Newbie 2019 | Game Over!

[GeorgeBailey]

Votecount 1.8

GeniusGamer(4)

~ Porkens(80), ItalianoVD(68), MiniMegabyte(41), shellyc(64)

word321(2)

~ T-Bone(41), SJReaver(39)

Redados(1)

~ GeniusGamer(66)


Not Voting (2): Redados(63), word321(39)


With 9 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-07-26 15:14:53)

FLAVOR

[SJReaver]

Where do you even get those pictures?

So you read GeniusGamer as town and concede this may be a mislynch?
I'm not mafia. I know PoE wise I might look bad, but I don't know how you consider me as scummy all of a sudden
For word, I haven't seen him post much, and I'd like to take a closer look at him

If I were mafia, GG would be a safe elim D1. You want to grab those weaker townies during the day and take out the stronger ones at night. That why I found T-Bone's pressure on Micc sus at first. Getting rid of people who are inactive is an easy sell and it doesn't reflect on you when they flip green.

When word popped in, and he began to interact with t-bone, I revaluated. T-bone wasn't going for an easy target. Word's baiting and mind games felt off as a response.

Then, up popped the Genius wagon. Porkens started it. Would Scum!Porkens make a sudden push like that if word was their partner? Yes, actually. I think they're bold enough to do so, but also I think they'd wait a bit. Italiano? He's a strong town read for me and hoping on second strikes me as in character.

That leaves Mini and you. As my null, I decided to look at your ISO, and I found something that struck me as out of character. It looks like a newbie scum attempt to distance themselves from a partner.

[SJReaver]

Italiano, why did you hop on this BW? without any further agreement / disagreement on the vote. There are 2 people on and i'd like to hear his defense before voting

^ 7:33 pm my time

A 3-person bandwagon. I can see how this is a solid vote, so I'm going to place this at E-1. GeniusGamer is my biggest sus as stated before.

^ 7:58 pm. So twenty-five minutes later with no time for him to make a defense.

Hmm…

Can someone else sniff at this and tell me if I’m reaching?

I will totally decide someone is scum and death tunnel them, reading everything they say as suspicious.

[Porkens]

Then, up popped the Genius wagon. Porkens started it. Would Scum!Porkens make a sudden push like that if word was their partner? Yes, actually. I think they're bold enough to do so, but also I think they'd wait a bit. Italiano? He's a strong town read for me and hoping on second strikes me as in character.

You sure about that?

[shellyc]

SJReavers, didn't Redados push Genius? Although he didn't go on the wagon in fear of OMGUS, but he definitely turned the tide towards Genius

[shellyc]

Also do you think baiting and mind games are alignment indicative? I'd like to dig deeper into word's "mind game" posting, which you think are scummy

[shellyc]

Just because I pivoted, doesn't mean I'm scum. In those 25 minutes, I read his ISO, investigated the words, and decided that he would be a better vote than any other options. I also stated him as my biggest sus, which I'd like to vote off.
Dead tunneling will get you nowhere. Mafia requires a level of flexibility, being open to any new susses that crop up is a townie trait.

[Porkens]

Italiano, why did you hop on this BW? without any further agreement / disagreement on the vote. There are 2 people on and i'd like to hear his defense before voting

^ 7:33 pm my time

A 3-person bandwagon. I can see how this is a solid vote, so I'm going to place this at E-1. GeniusGamer is my biggest sus as stated before.

^ 7:58 pm. So twenty-five minutes later with no time for him to make a defense.

Hmm…

Can someone else sniff at this and tell me if I’m reaching?

I will totally decide someone is scum and death tunnel them, reading everything they say as suspicious.

It’s a fair ping. But it’s not a scum slip. Imo.

[ItalianoVD]

@Shellyc: care to respond to my questions?

[Redados]

SJReavers, didn't Redados push Genius? Although he didn't go on the wagon in fear of OMGUS, but he definitely turned the tide towards Genius

Order of operations:

1. I post about scumreading Genius in post 463 (9:11 pm my time)
2. MiniMegabyte in post 464 says that she scumreads him too (9:14 pm my time)
3. In post 466, Porkens scumreads and (

V1

) votes for GeniusGamer (9:24 pm my time)
4. ItalianoVD (

V2

) in post 470 votes for GeniusGamer (9:28 pm my time)
5. In post 475, Shelly scumreads GeniusGamer (9:40 pm my time)
6. In post 479, (

V3

) MiniMegabyte votes for GeniusGamer (9:54 pm my time)
7. Shelly votes for Genius Gamer (

V4

) in post 480 (9:58 pm my time)

I have not voted. I will not vote right now because we haven't heard Genius' defense/flip. I still think Genius is the best elimination and I stand by my scumread of him.

[GeniusGamer]

Woah, what happened here? Everyone suddenly sees me as scum, a main reason for which being that I... joined Redados’s wagon? Oh, but not all of them say that! Shelly doesn’t think my posts demonstrate thought due to a “lack of contribution and passiveness” (post 475)? I’ll need a closer look at that, but it seems I now have to prove that I’m town.

I have, in fact, produced game advancing content. I’ve asked questions, answered questions, brought up several suspicious actions, and expressed scumreads. It was pretty late for me when I voted for Redados, and I was

planning

to make clear my reasons for voting, but that will also have to wait.

I am trying to help you as a member of the town. In fact, I’ll provide you with some information about the setup. I am a

Town Mason

, though I will not reveal the other mason’s name unless asked. There are either two mafia goons or a mafia goon and a mafia roleblocker. It doesn’t matter though because no townies have any activatable powers. Killing me will result in what is effectively six townies versus two goons.

Now, think about what you’ve just done by putting me at L-1. You have forced me to provide information to the mafia. If you don’t end up killing me, the mafia almost certainly will. There will effectively be vanilla townies versus mafia goons and the rate at which you gain information will be slowed. Congratulations on failing spectacularly.

You caused this.

[Porkens]

I don’t believe you.

[Redados]

Everyone should give their thoughts now that we've seen the response, and then we can decide whether to eliminate.

If what GG says is true, this is bad.

If what GG says is false, I do NOT want to talk about this extensively because it's bad for the town.

NO ONE give the final vote until we see what everyone says.

NO ONE VOTE YET.

[Porkens]

In the event that genius is mafia, he is fishing for town power roles. Don’t enable this.

For example: no one should say “you can’t be a mason, I’m the cop!” Or something like that.

[Redados]

Here's a thought I just had: if he's the mason, there's no point in saving him, right? Because the wolves will just kill him. Which would suck, I guess. But it's already lost because he already revealed. Is there a hole in this logic?

[GeniusGamer]

Since I’m the mason, saving me gives you a chance to eliminate mafia. I’ll certainly be dead by the next day phase. But if you get mafia now, it’ll be one mafia down and one town instead of two town. Of course, I’m assuming you believe me, and it seems like you don’t.

[Redados]

Since I’m the mason, saving me gives you a chance to eliminate mafia. I’ll certainly be dead by the next day phase. But if you get mafia now, it’ll be one mafia down and one town instead of two town. Of course, I’m assuming you believe me, and it seems like you don’t.

I want to see what everyone else has to say before I make my judgement.

[ItalianoVD]

Genius not voting is off putting to me because I think scum can be afraid of how their votes will make people read them.

Really? Never heard of that idea.

TL;DR: My strongest read is on MiniMegabyte, who I think is scum because of a lack of game-advancing content. I also need to learn to condense my findings to a reasonable size.

Is there a reason you haven't voted this strong scum read you have?

as a general rule the game

will

stall out if there aren't people actively working to push it forward.

To both of you, I wasn’t planning on voting until I was really sure of the scum. Apparently, that’s a bad idea in this game. In light of this...

VOTE: MiniMegabyte

There’s probably a lot more evidence to be found before the day ends. Then again, it doesn’t hurt to vote now, I suppose.

Only a bad idea if you want to avoid suspicion?
Had you expressed a SR if mini prior to this vote?

I don’t have any reason to avoid suspicion, and I have not expressed my read prior to that post. I wanted to make sure I wasn’t misvoting town.

Originally, I wanted to make sure that I wasn’t misvoting. When you and Micc found it odd that I hadn’t voted, I decided to because it wouldn’t hurt.

Then

I realized that the information I already had was enough for a vote using my previous standards.

Genius not voting is off putting to me because I think scum can be afraid of how their votes will make people read them.

Very good point. I’ve noticed the uneasiness to solidify a decision from the start, which is also why I’m reading him the way I am.

It’s not an “uneasiness to solidify a decision”. I merely voted once I was sure that I had enough evidence. While I already had evidence, I was planning to wait for more. When it was pointed out to me that it was supposedly odd to not vote in the situation I was in, I decided to vote.

Question. What information were you looking to get? And what did Mini do at that point to give you the go ahead to vote? Well other than Micc and Porkens promoting you?

[ItalianoVD]

So this is the sample PM from the Page 1 Setup information

Welcome!

You are a Town Mason.

You know that [player] is Town-aligned. You also share a Private Thread (PT), located here, where you may talk at any time.

With this being said I’ve ISO’d you multiple times to make sure I wasn’t reading unjustly and now I’ve ISO’d you again since your “claim” and I find no evidence of you giving any type of push or read towards anyone being town. I’m not entirely sure how the roles work but if you have been having conversations with another town player, why have you not given a readslist telling us that you feel townie towards X player more so than anyone else or something like that. Not just once but multiple times throughout the day so that it is more of an organic read. You did none of that. Zero. And now you expect us to believe that you have this role? Not sure, but I doubt scum would have picked up on a Mason role if you had given us that information.

So no, I don’t believe you and I think you are just trying to not get eliminated.

[T-Bone]

I believe you, for what its worth.

[ItalianoVD]

Here's a thought I just had: if he's the mason, there's no point in saving him, right? Because the wolves will just kill him. Which would suck, I guess. But it's already lost because he already revealed. Is there a hole in this logic?

Here’s the other thought. If we were to save him and he didn’t get night killed then he’d just get eliminated Day 2. I don’t believe any scum newbie or experienced would pass up on an obvious kill as that.

[ItalianoVD]

I believe you, for what its worth.

It’s not worth a lot if you don’t tell us why you believe him.

[T-Bone]

Going fishing now??

[Redados]

I believe you, for what its worth.

It’s not worth a lot if you don’t tell us why you believe him.

Stop. Don't do this.

[T-Bone]

I believe him because Mason is the worst fakeclaim for mafia at L-1. Because at this point there's no reason not to Lim him unless his Mason partner claims. I'm not saying the partner needs to do it. But now that he's claimed it, we have to test it. And because we have to test it, makes it a bad move for the mafia. It's a little wine in front of me (WIFOM) but not really.