Open 789: Two-Fold 2d3 [Game Over]

[Hiraki]

I agree with Dram hard here.

[Jake The Wolfie]

I agree with the first 3 lines, but disagree with your conclusion.

I'm much more inclined (or confbiased, if you feel that way about me) to think that the repeated half-assed attempts to swing a wagon somewhere else is indicative of Jake being scum.
1. His buddy doesn't want to lynch him and have to solo the game, especially cuz they can just lose to a lost bullet.
2. The opposing scumteam has no incentive to lynch him, he's exebait to them. (I'm aware this is true regardless of his alignment). Testing the waters on other wagons is much more beneficial to them.

If Jake was town any scum coulda just taken the easy hammer when it was available with little suspicion, and to be quite blunt his continued existence benefits both scumteam EVEN if he somehow flips town.

"So.. if my continued existence is beneficial to both evils regardless of my purity, then how could you conclude that I was indeed evil?"

[teacher]

VOTE: jake

Drama probably right - the slot is going to have to be resolved, and since tomorrow is theoretically melo, I’d rather not carry it forward.

[Bell]

I agree with the first 3 lines, but disagree with your conclusion.

I'm much more inclined (or confbiased, if you feel that way about me) to think that the repeated half-assed attempts to swing a wagon somewhere else is indicative of Jake being scum.
1. His buddy doesn't want to lynch him and have to solo the game, especially cuz they can just lose to a lost bullet.
2. The opposing scumteam has no incentive to lynch him, he's exebait to them. (I'm aware this is true regardless of his alignment). Testing the waters on other wagons is much more beneficial to them.

If Jake was town any scum coulda just taken the easy hammer when it was available with little suspicion, and to be quite blunt his continued existence benefits both scumteam EVEN if he somehow flips town.

*rubs eyes* Did Dramonic just engage with someone? It's Christmas already?

I'm hearing a lot of pros and cons and opposite opinions about which are pros and which are cons for the scum teams. I'm not sure which to weigh more heavily.

Question, would it be more beneficial to us to wait for the other replacement and having them all catch up before eliminating someone or not?

Pedit: Okay. Mind answering that question?

[Bell]

@Teacher, when I think about it, it doesn't make a lot of sense for you to say and vote Jake at your level of skill for the stated reason. Try explaining your reasoning again. Maybe I'm just dumb though.

[teacher]

Question, would it be more beneficial to us to wait for the other replacement and

having them all catch up

before eliminating someone or not?

Just like Chemist caught up? or RCE? Right now I think apathy is deepening and deepening, and just putting the game on ice will do nothing but further drain town's desire to play.

@Teacher, when I think about it, it doesn't make a lot of sense for you to say and vote Jake at your level of skill for the stated reason. Try explaining your reasoning again. Maybe I'm just dumb though.

OK, lets try this: I dont have an affirmative townread on the slot. Rather, I bought the case that Haven was a useless town, and repped out after being called such. Her replacement, Jake, has also been pretty useless -- a weird character affectation, but no real contribution to reasoning/hunting/sorting/interacting. So Im left with thinking its a pretty useless slot that has had a lot of positioning around it all day. (I also didnt like the wagon composition)

If it flips scum, its pretty indiciative that at least one scum (and likely more) was probably directing/taking part in the counterwagons, which are in turn more likely town. Its also a GREAT sign that my reads have been f-ed up and need deep reevaluation.

IF it flips town, its pretty indicative that my reads are pretty solid, and to continue on my same course. But -- and here is the key thing -- it gets rid of a slot that I think will NOT help town win the game -- its a VT claim that is not helping my progression, and that I would be liable to mislynch later due to the weird positioning of this day.

Does that make better sense at all?

[teacher]

The "if it flips town" paragraph is expressing the need to resolve the slot in my earlier post, or Dram's "his continued existence benefits both scumteam EVEN if he somehow flips town" before that.

[Jake The Wolfie]

Question, would it be more beneficial to us to wait for the other replacement and

having them all catch up

before eliminating someone or not?

Just like Chemist caught up? or RCE? Right now I think apathy is deepening and deepening, and just putting the game on ice will do nothing but further drain town's desire to play.

@Teacher, when I think about it, it doesn't make a lot of sense for you to say and vote Jake at your level of skill for the stated reason. Try explaining your reasoning again. Maybe I'm just dumb though.

OK, lets try this: I dont have an affirmative townread on the slot. Rather, I bought the case that Haven was a useless town, and repped out after being called such. Her replacement, Jake, has also been pretty useless -- a weird character affectation, but no real contribution to reasoning/hunting/sorting/interacting. So Im left with thinking its a pretty useless slot that has had a lot of positioning around it all day. (I also didnt like the wagon composition)

If it flips scum, its pretty indiciative that at least one scum (and likely more) was probably directing/taking part in the counterwagons, which are in turn more likely town. Its also a GREAT sign that my reads have been f-ed up and need deep reevaluation.

IF it flips town, its pretty indicative that my reads are pretty solid, and to continue on my same course. But -- and here is the key thing -- it gets rid of a slot that I think will NOT help town win the game -- its a VT claim that is not helping my progression, and that I would be liable to mislynch later due to the weird positioning of this day.

Does that make better sense at all?

"Counterpoint: I could be lying about my powerless claim, so I won't be put under the evil's required kills microscope. I'm not saying that I'm retracting my claim, but that is something that i would do. There are parallel worlds where I pretended to have one claim when I had another."

[teacher]

I noted you didnt actually affirmatively claim VT. But tbh, that kind of WIFOM gets you nowhere from me. If you dont claim a PR, you dont get treated like a PR.

[teacher]

kindly prod Dunn

I’m sure he’ll have excellent insight to add.

[PenguinPower]

guess not

[teacher]

Clever. Also liked your vote, and would gladly join that wagon if it got up to fighting strength, but I don’t have the energy to push it there.

[Chemist1422]

I haven't caught up but I've done a couple ISOs

I do want to point out that there's a lot of "I would vote [x] if a wagon on them happens but I'd rather compromise on someone more viable"

We do have a good bit of time so I think this is a good time to experiment with wagons

[TemporalLich]

VC 1.23

Jake The Wolfie (5) - dramonic, Hiraki, Marashu, Almost50, teacher [E-2]

Almost50 (2) - Dannflor, Bell
teacher (2) - Dunnstral, RCEnigma
dramonic (1) - Gamma Emerald
Hiraki (1) - Jake The Wolfie
Dunnstral (1) - PenguinPower

Not voting: Chemist1422

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 deadline is currently frozen at 4 days, 0 hours, 0 minutes until replacements are found.

Dunnstral has been prodded.

[Bell]

That's better Teacher. Okay.

Sure Chemist, I'm game.

[Chemist1422]

i think the jake wagon doesn't really have much except for momentum behind it at this point and is probably bad then

bell, if you could decide the elim for today, who would it be?

[Chemist1422]

question goes to everyone btw

multiple names are acceptable, though ideally ordered

[teacher]

Dunn, Gamma slot, Jake, a50=RCE

[teacher]

Prob actually RCE before A50 because I’m willing to give the multiple expressed trs of the monkey some deference for their greater experience.

[Bell]

Oh my god that is a hard question to answer for me. Part of me wants to hit Hiraki just because of how weird he's being with Dramonic, but that's more of a curiosity thing.

Jake<A50 < Dunn/RCE/PP < Teacher/Hiraki < Dann < Dramonic < Chemist.

[Bell]

Gamma probably slightly above Hiraki/Teacher.

[teacher]

Where’s Maru and gamma slot?

Pedit: Maru only then.

[Bell]

Put him barely above the null slot pile due to a vague feeling of townieness.

[PenguinPower]

I dunno how you can have the gamma slot that high tbh.

[Bell]

I don't know how you can have an opinion on Gamma when you haven't read past when you replaced it.