Newbie 2025 | Lilies | Game Over

[Casey]

When I first entered the game and thought she behaved the scummiest of all the players, I thought her thinking I had a scumread on her was because she simply failed to understand that I didn't necessarily think she was scum.

This is noncommittal AF.

English isn't your first language, correct?

Willing to give a pass for that.

Considering I learned English before I ever entered kindergarten, you could say it is.

When you see someone get called the scummiest person in the game, don't you think it's reasonable that the accuser believes that person is scum?

Do you think it makes sense that the accuser thinks someone else is mafia but not the scummiest person?

Do you have any precedent of calling someone the scummiest person in the game but not having a scumread on them?

[Casey]

I am almost caught up, and I have a few more pages to go. Before I finish the read...

Even then, if my plan was to be safe why risk claiming the Shelly townread when most people at the time were scumreading her?

This is true, but I feel like it is easier to townread a townie who is being scumread than to scumread a townie who is being townread as scum.
Your point about why you haven't been able to do more real time stuff is fair, so I guess I'm leaning towards rocknil then.

I sincerely hope there's more to your catch-up than this.

[Casey]

I think Redados unvoting is townie because he could have easily kept his vote on shellyc if she is town.
I am still not completely understanding why she is our primary target for elimination. I think her posts have been fine this game.

LavarManos, who would you like to lim today? (I suggest that you vote for them)

To be frank, I am not sure and I do not feel confident voting in anyone. My catchup was quite a skim, so I feel like I may be missing out on some important details. I'm not sure I believe in a shellyc elimination though. Perhaps rocknil or Fredrick?

Disappointing.

[Nahdia]

Vote Count 2.02

rocknil (2):

LavarManos, ItalianoVD

Frederick A Campbell (1):

Redados

, rocknil

LavarManos (1):

Frogsterking

Frogsterking (1):

Frederick A Campbell

ItalianoVD (1):

Casey

Not Voting (1):

Casey

, Redados

Deadline is in

(expired on 2020-09-03 18:44:04)

, at which point we will default to no elimination.

With seven players alive, it takes

four

to reach majority.

Note:

Today's opening vote count displayed an incorrect deadline earlier. It has been corrected.

[Casey]

Oh, and for the record, my push on Frederick began as a weak scumread and now is quite strong. It wasn’t baseless in fact, just in appearance. There is no player who I scumread so high as Frederick in this game.

I'm yelling at a corpse, but maybe she can hear me from the grave: not publishing your findings is frustrating.

[Casey]

She really started wanting to appear as town so far so she voted herself without any provocation. After that She claimed VT which is convenient as claiming a PR will immediately get her CC’d. Her appealing to emotions has really backfired. I think her playstyle is harming the town more than any of her contributions. It is safe to eliminate her either way.

This paragraph makes me frown.

1. Scum can goad a CC on their way out. I disagree that a VT claim makes someone more likely mafia.

2. You talk about appeal to emotions as if it's inherently a mafia trait. I've had townies AtE me plenty of times. Mafia almost never.

3. "Her playstyle is harming the town" sounds self-exclusionary and really doesn't make me believe you ever truly thought she was mafia.

[Casey]

shellyc had failed to make coherent thoughts throughout this game. How is she suddenly able to come up with the idea of fake claiming a power role?

Rude.

[Casey]

Rocknil now voting for shelly with a long post saying why seems a little forced, but I’d like to give you the benefit of the doubt. You don’t talk all day, then you come in with a fairly decent reason for voting.

A vocal majority has panned Rock's post (including me!) but you're willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, despite saying it seems a little forced. Why is that?

[Casey]

It's Monday. I would like to hear more of ItalianoVD's thoughts on current events.

You know you don’t have to keep prompting me to post my thoughts. I will and do.

Maybe it's all in my head but I feel like you've been much less active this game than last.

Not alignment indicative of course because real life stuff comes up and is more important. But I keep forgetting that you're even in the game.

Pretty sure these two aren't buddies.

[Casey]

My reaction is that it's a conscientious and cooperative response. NAI and pro-town.

This is different from how you described your "hmm" earlier.

[Casey]

As in you responded to the same post twice, but with different reactions.

[Casey]

Here:

Yeah. (ignoring last game) this game Shelly has been pretty active and pushing. I don't necessarily agree with her pushes because she reaallly does not like being scumread. I am still scumreading her.

(using last game) I don't agree with Shelly's constant pushing because she was doing that last game; she kept yelling at MiniMegabyte for "scumslipping" (Mini was town). I think it's not helpful to latch onto small things and use them to justify a scumread. Sometimes you have a feeling you can't justify, but I think it's disingenuous to pull weak justification for your scumread. In retrospect, I may have done that with my initial scumread of Shelly, so I'm revising my scumread from a justified one to a gut one.

(ignoring last game) ItalianoVD has not been super active but he's posted enough. He's given reads and had conversations with people. I don't really have a handle on his alignment yet.

(using last game) something someone else said about how Italiano's playstyle might make him look scummier than he is resonates with me. I spent a lot of last game oscillating back and forth whether Italiano was scum or town and my impression is that he could hide it well enough if he were scum. It makes me scared to townread him or scumread him, although I'm townreading him now. I do feel like he was more active and off-the-cuff last game, but I haven't gone back and really ISOd and compared, which I will do at some point.

Hmm..

That was off the cuff so I'm curious to hear your reaction.

it made me feel joy inside

...and...

Yeah. (ignoring last game) this game Shelly has been pretty active and pushing. I don't necessarily agree with her pushes because she reaallly does not like being scumread. I am still scumreading her.

(using last game) I don't agree with Shelly's constant pushing because she was doing that last game; she kept yelling at MiniMegabyte for "scumslipping" (Mini was town). I think it's not helpful to latch onto small things and use them to justify a scumread. Sometimes you have a feeling you can't justify, but I think it's disingenuous to pull weak justification for your scumread. In retrospect, I may have done that with my initial scumread of Shelly, so I'm revising my scumread from a justified one to a gut one.

(ignoring last game) ItalianoVD has not been super active but he's posted enough. He's given reads and had conversations with people. I don't really have a handle on his alignment yet.

(using last game) something someone else said about how Italiano's playstyle might make him look scummier than he is resonates with me. I spent a lot of last game oscillating back and forth whether Italiano was scum or town and my impression is that he could hide it well enough if he were scum. It makes me scared to townread him or scumread him, although I'm townreading him now. I do feel like he was more active and off-the-cuff last game, but I haven't gone back and really ISOd and compared, which I will do at some point.

Hmm..

That was off the cuff so I'm curious to hear your reaction.

My reaction is that it's a conscientious and cooperative response. NAI and pro-town.

A conscientious, cooperative, pro-town, but ultimately NAI response made you feel joy inside?

[Casey]

The guy that just replaced in looks town.

What did you see? Because all I saw was disappointment.

[ItalianoVD]

Rocknil now voting for shelly with a long post saying why seems a little forced, but I’d like to give you the benefit of the doubt. You don’t talk all day, then you come in with a fairly decent reason for voting.

A vocal majority has panned Rock's post (including me!) but you're willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, despite saying it seems a little forced. Why is that?

Simply because I wanted to give him a chance to build more of a presence in the game. This way I could have more information before making a final decision. I haven’t really gotten that which is why he has my vote for today.

[ItalianoVD]

You're not reading this game if you can't figure out what my reads are so far.

What is up with people safeguarding their thoughts this game?

So who do you think the scum is?

[Casey]

I am here. Should I hammer shelly?

Ew ew ew this is so gross.

[Casey]

Rocknil now voting for shelly with a long post saying why seems a little forced, but I’d like to give you the benefit of the doubt. You don’t talk all day, then you come in with a fairly decent reason for voting.

A vocal majority has panned Rock's post (including me!) but you're willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, despite saying it seems a little forced. Why is that?

Simply because I wanted to give him a chance to build more of a presence in the game. This way I could have more information before making a final decision. I haven’t really gotten that which is why he has my vote for today.

This is a good answer.

You're not reading this game if you can't figure out what my reads are so far.

What is up with people safeguarding their thoughts this game?

So who do you think the scum is?

That is some mad confidence you have.

Almost done reading D1. Recap to come afterward.

[Casey]

Spoilers I read ahead. I found this:

Last minute baseless speculation:

Consider a Frogster and Frederick scumteam. They play off of each other constantly, they reinforce each other; even Frogster’s criticism seems anticipated and expected.

If Shelly flips green... consider the value of a Frogster and Frederick scumteam and compare it with how their interactions and play have been.

Also, my survival or death has no bearing on this baseless speculation whether you want it to or not, to prevent Town from getting suckered into a wildly off base round of game solving nonsense. Even if scum actually use worried about this, don’t read into it. Follow my earlier play if I die tonight.

MUSHSHAGANA was killed during Night 1. She was a

Vanilla Townie

.

Why did Fredrick not vote???? Was he afraid to hammer because he knew that ShellyC was town? Or am I overthinking it?

VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

Mush was onto Frogsterking and Fredrick A Campbell. And looking back I think Fredrick A Campbell was working hard to blend in. I find it more scummy than others.

VOTE: Fredrick A Campbell

I think Rock in this chain of posts is kinda gross.

[Casey]

TOWN

Redados - Consistent, fearless posting. Strongest townread by far. Nothing to complain about here, at all.

OK

Italiano - Confusing, though consistent and confident. Someone earlier mentioned he was like a puppy dog playing in the snow and after a reread I can feel that vibe.

MEH

Frog - The theory lessons are great, but it would also be great if he'd

do something.

Campbell - Frustrating posts. Weak townreads. Non-committal.

NAH

Rocknil - Less Rock than Nil. Hasn't followed through with

any

activity as claimed. Biggest post was a heckin sketchy dud.

LavarManos - Absolutely 100% disappointing and gross posts.

I have 4 pages left to read. Barring any revelations, Lavar needs to go.

[Casey]

VOTE: Unvote

Break time.

[LavarManos]

LavarManos - Absolutely 100% disappointing and gross posts.

You are not going to be able to hang me with no elaboration on those reasons. If you truly believe I am scum and aren't just throwing shade, please explain to the rest of us

why

I had disappointing and gross posts. Also, I think my posts being disappointing is to be somewhat expected, and I don't think "disappointing" is scummy in general.

[Redados]

It's okay to be scumread, LavarManos. Everyone will get scumread at some point, and Casey is still catching up on the game. Her thoughts might evolve by the time that she catches up to the present hour. No one is trying to hang you right now; Frogsterking has voted for you, and Casey is scumreading you. This is not by any means the end of the world. In

my

opinion, you are not the best lim for today at this point.

Don't try and argue your way out of being scumread. Just keep posting. The more you post, the more that your true character will shine through.

[Frogsterking]

TOWN

Redados - Consistent, fearless posting. Strongest townread by far. Nothing to complain about here, at all.

OK

Italiano - Confusing, though consistent and confident. Someone earlier mentioned he was like a puppy dog playing in the snow and after a reread I can feel that vibe.

MEH

Frog - The theory lessons are great, but it would also be great if he'd

do something.

Campbell - Frustrating posts. Weak townreads. Non-committal.

NAH

Rocknil - Less Rock than Nil. Hasn't followed through with

any

activity as claimed. Biggest post was a heckin sketchy dud.

LavarManos - Absolutely 100% disappointing and gross posts.

I have 4 pages left to read. Barring any revelations, Lavar needs to go.

Looks like we have pretty similar reads. I'll try to post more in depth in the areas I promised tomorrow morning.

I think I did enough outside the theory lessons since I lead the initial pushes on both your current scum reads.

[Casey]

Here's some expounding on my thoughts.

I think shellyc is behaving rather townily because of her utter willingness to be the hang. However, some of you have said that she played similarly in your last game with her? That doesn't make me feel as good.

Curious if a vote is incoming. This feels odd to just take their word for it instead of doing the research.

What's up with this waffle?

I am here. Should I hammer shelly?

Ew ew ew this is so gross.

Here's Lavar asking for permission to vote. This is at the very end of D1, with everyone already in agreement to hammer before it goes no-lim. This is pretty much my #1 red flag, showing an outsider trying to get in on town action.

Also in D1:

I am almost caught up, and I have a few more pages to go. Before I finish the read...

Even then, if my plan was to be safe why risk claiming the Shelly townread when most people at the time were scumreading her?

This is true, but I feel like it is easier to townread a townie who is being scumread than to scumread a townie who is being townread as scum.
Your point about why you haven't been able to do more real time stuff is fair, so I guess I'm leaning towards rocknil then.

I sincerely hope there's more to your catch-up than this.

When someone replaces in, it helps to get a fresh perspective on things. I expect Lavar to deliver

something.

This was the delivery:

I think Redados unvoting is townie because he could have easily kept his vote on shellyc if she is town.
I am still not completely understanding why she is our primary target for elimination. I think her posts have been fine this game.

LavarManos, who would you like to lim today? (I suggest that you vote for them)

To be frank, I am not sure and I do not feel confident voting in anyone. My catchup was quite a skim, so I feel like I may be missing out on some important details. I'm not sure I believe in a shellyc elimination though. Perhaps rocknil or Fredrick?

Disappointing.

Everyone has different posting habits, but to have skimmed through a game and come back with a shrug and two guesses? That's so underwhelming it hurts.

I also don't see cohesive thoughts from one post to another. The Lavar in one post feels like he has a different mindset than the previous Lavar.

I don't see an effort to solve the game. I see someone blending in and giving pushes as light as a breeze.

Even Rock did more than that.

Still haven't read D2. Maybe it goes better.

[ItalianoVD]

Don't try and argue your way out of being scumread. Just keep posting. The more you post, the more that your true character will shine through.

Great advice! I was trying to overthink again, but this solidifies my read on you. This is good because if you’re town, posting more will show you more and more town and if you’re scum, posting more will show you more and more scum.