Mini Theme 2161: Undertale C Open - Chara's Folly

[Tayl0r Swift]

7 pages of mech talk. 7 pages is nothing. and i have a hurt vote on record too. but ill participate properly when you all decide what strategy we should do. im very much of the opinion that mech talk and EVs are pretty much NAI and using them to justify strategy is gonna let scum persuade us to do what they want more often than not. it seems to me that a fight day 1 and then sparing later days is a good idea, but i really havent thought about it that much

[redtea]

what is taylor swift on rn

[Lavender]

Reading walls of text make me sleepier (_ _).｡o○

[catboi]

o(〃＾▽＾〃)o It's ok Lavender, just help me find the bad guys

[Morning Tweet]

Oh my god. MorningTweet just stole my post intro. I should just post what I have if I can't drudge up anything else:

I am so sorry for being utterly useless. Statistics make my brain melt.
I would say I have reads but what ones I made out were counterbalanced from what I could understand of setup talk.
All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.

Tbh not a bad point that mafia might be aware of how solely focusing on mechanics can be perceived as NAI, so that would be somewhat of a dissuader from even bothering

Idk, it's tough. I'd like to just be like "oo shiny spreadsheet" on catboi and whoever else made the walls on mech im not reading

I think what i was getting at in my original post was like, if a ton of people (say, 1/3rd) do a bunch of mechanical discussion, surely at least one scum bothers (or theres at least a decent chance one does)? And then can I really know who it is since they're all basically talking about mechanically/objectively right or wrong stuff?

Sure, maybe just whoever efforted the most as you said, I guess. hmmm

What reads did you have that got counterbalanced by the mech talk?

[Morning Tweet]

All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.

（ΦωΦ）For the record, I ran those numbers pregame and you should absolutely not townread effort in that vein, but the difference in EV is so significant that I wouldn't have bothered outing it as mafia because I'd be torpedoing my own team's chances

I hate the massives amounts of WIFOM this post emanates. Not like in a scummy way but just in a "Damn i hate you if you're scum saying this" kind of way.

But yeah..... you're right. im gonna give u your due townpoints because you earned them (¬ω¬)

I suppose the WIFOM is negated by how you're not trying to trick us into sparing you thru towniness. You're advocating for the FIGHT route, which means you getting spewed as town (if you're scum) is way less useful as compared to us doing the SPARE route where you either end our game instantly or just cause us to basically lose upon getting spared

Yeah, okay i will accept this townread

[Morning Tweet]

im also in the boat of i dont really care about the mech talk or evs. i think theyre silly and good play and the human element matters more than whats going on on paper. depending on the lobby different strats will work better or worse. none of these strats appear to break the game.

anyway, HEAL: Morning
that avatar has me pocketed.

Mmmmmmmm agreeing mech is not fun, healing me, and complimenting my bat all in the same post

Yup, my judgment for your alignment is now completely out of wack, and it only took the one post

it is a pretty cute avatar

AcK!

[redtea]

Didn't notice the typo fuck

Oh my god. MorningTweet just stole my post intro. I should just post what I have if I can't drudge up anything else:

I am so sorry for being utterly useless. Statistics make my brain melt.
I would say I have reads but what ones I made out were counterbalanced from what I could understand of setup talk.
All I got is: The quick estimate Pooky gave I do no give out town points for (regardless ty for your contribution) and the ones who went the extra mile (catboi, Prism). Maf wouldn't fuckin bother, or think to, anyway. Esp. with how "focusing on game mechanics" is looked at.

*who went the extra mile, I do.

[redtea]

Not only NAI, but people are quick to point out mechanics-talk as a maf content padding tactic.

Oh yeah, I'm not saying maf won't partake in ANY mechanics discussion, but they ARE much more likely to leave it open-ended, be non-committal, etc. It's only the lengths catboi and Prism went that are in any way AI. Usually there's no point making heads for tails of it, unless someone is obviously leading mechanics-apathetic town astray.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I think it will be more challenging to win the game via pacifism but I have faith in the goodness of our hearts shining through bright and beautiful

[redtea]

Also correct me if I'm wrong but was there not a conclusion that taking the neutral route is the least useful @taylorswift

[Morning Tweet]

Not only NAI, but people are quick to point out mechanics-talk as a maf content padding tactic.

Oh yeah, I'm not saying maf won't partake in ANY mechanics discussion, but they ARE much more likely to leave it open-ended, be non-committal, etc. It's only the lengths catboi and Prism went that are in any way AI. Usually there's no point making heads for tails of it, unless someone is obviously leading mechanics-apathetic town astray.

Yeah, i think your take on it is good.

I still don't feel like actually trying to figure out the mechanical stuff for myself -ω-

I will let catboi and whoever probably figure it out and then go with whatever is best. I'm sure i'll feel like looking into it more another time.

I really wanted to spare people! or be spared.

I think it will be more challenging to win the game via pacifism but I have faith in the goodness of our hearts shining through bright and beautiful

If we reached a day where there were no consensus townreads, would you then be open to swapping to FIGHTing, or would you force a pacifist route anyway?

I suppose what I'm curious about is what are your motivations are here. Is the only thing that matters to you sticking to way of pacifism? Mafia aren't going to show such mercy to us in return

[redtea]

MorningTweet I'm gonna hold off on what you asked for now. Trust me when I say you don't want my frozen takes.

[redtea]

dont encourage them

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I suppose what I'm curious about is what are your motivations are here. Is the only thing that matters to you sticking to way of pacifism? Mafia aren't going to show such mercy to us in return

if the town consensus is to fight our way to victory I will obviously help with that

\

[Hectic]

makes me sad but i know when i'm beat, 4 SPARES is a no go
any of ya gonna work out the numbers for 1 to 3 SPARES?

anyway, Prism town because he did the math and was accurate before catboi revealed his spreadsheets
he made the effort but showed no working or proof to try and make it look impressive or get any towncred from it

i believe catboi when he says he wouldn’t reveal the EV working if he was mafia
only because he decided to out his info right after I made a huge case on 4 SPARES, where there was some uncertainty where town would go, and it wasn’t just guaranteed to be genocide anyway

[Elements]

mechanically 4 spares is sub-optimal but if we don't spare we're basically just playing normal mafia

[Hectic]

yeah bud, that's honestly my main issue
hopefully we can make a 1-3 SPARE route work if the EV for that is acceptable

[CantHateAPuppy]

hectic who would you spare right now

[Elements]

hectic who would you spare right now

changing your tune a bit

[CantHateAPuppy]

hectic who would you spare right now

changing your tune a bit

?

[Elements]

you've been all "we must fight" "fighting is the only path" and now you're asking about spares

[CantHateAPuppy]

Yes

[Elements]

so your tune has changed....

[CantHateAPuppy]

No