FGO: Mafia in the Lostbelt (Game Over!)

[Cabd]

Vote Count M-10

Assassin (5): Archer, Foreigner, Rider, Moon Cancer, Alter Ego
Caster (3): Saber, Lancer, Caster
Avenger (3): Avenger, Berserker, Beast
Rider (1): Ruler
Saber (1): Shielder

Phase Page Count: 32/60

With 14 servants alive, it takes 8 votes to lock in a master. Otherwise, a master will be selected by plurality rules in: (expired on 2020-09-08 21:23:37)

[Servant Avenger]

@question to everyone, do private PT posts count toward your title?

Like If I post 1000 times in a PT do I have a mafia goon title?

@Alterego, you probably didn't. You sort of asked how my read had progressed from never hinting I thought you weren't town to town read. So I replied to that.

[Servant Alter Ego]

@question to everyone, do private PT posts count toward your title?

Like If I post 1000 times in a PT do I have a mafia goon title?

@Alterego, you probably didn't. You sort of asked how my read had progressed from never hinting I thought you weren't town to town read. So I replied to that.

Oh yeah, I saw that. It made sense so I didn't have a followup.

I'm getting a sense of deja vu here because my observation was that you had questions for me, but not a lot of followup.

[Servant Avenger]

I see. You mean the tables have turned? That's normal. Not every question is answered or followed up on.
Guess you don't know about my title question?

[Servant Alter Ego]

@question to everyone, do private PT posts count toward your title?

Like If I post 1000 times in a PT do I have a mafia goon title?

I don't think PT posts count. at least not while they're actually private, and maybe never. There's a thread I read somewhere about how that works but hell if I know where it is.

[Servant Foreigner]

I get what your saying avenger, but I don't think I should read into the fact some players have titles that don't line up with there post count >_>

[Servant Foreigner]

If the above is even the case I am way too lazy to check lol.

[Servant Rider]

I don't believe his reasons for not wanting to vote me are legit though. It sounds like personal policy as an excuse not to vote me. But I am scum reading him, so I guess, politically, there's no benefit for him to town read me and just hand me the vote.

What the hell does this even mean

@question to everyone, do private PT posts count toward your title?

Like If I post 1000 times in a PT do I have a mafia goon title?

I don't think PT posts count. at least not while they're actually private, and maybe never. There's a thread I read somewhere about how that works but hell if I know where it is.

PTs don't count by site policy.

[Servant Avenger]

Nah, I was just thinking about whether Moon cancer was lying about his 11 page private QT thing.
Guess we'll never know until the game ends.

[Servant Alter Ego]

I see. You mean the tables have turned? That's normal. Not every question is answered or followed up on.
Guess you don't know about my title question?

Not for absolutely certain. But, I know that some effort went into working things out so that it wouldn't be evident that someone must be posting in a PT, given their profile post count. It would be especially damning for newbie game players in their first mafia game to have a post count discrepancy.

[Servant Avenger]

@Rider:
First of all, thanks.
2. You said if scum were going hard it would be me and that's why you weren't going to vote me. That statement does not come off as a genuine read.

[Servant Avenger]

Cough, I guess it wouldn't have been in the spirit of the game for that to be viable.
Forgive my lack of sportsmanship.

[Servant Assassin]

was that an attempted angleshoot, or an faux attempt at an angleshoot from someone who knows better as an attempt to be townread? the mind boggles at the possibilities.

VOTE: Avenger

putting my vote where my mouth is, but will selfvote if i get the votes for it also

[Servant Avenger]

Lol, I was literally just thinking that I hope I didn't just make someone experienced think that.
I've been there.

[Servant Rider]

@Rider:
First of all, thanks.
2. You said if scum were going hard it would be me and that's why you weren't going to vote me. That statement does not come off as a genuine read.

You're right, I did say that. You're also leaving out about 75% of what the rest of I said, which was that I feel can't read you, I feel can read other people, I think the best course of action is to elect someone I think is town, so I'm not going to vote for someone who's a big damn question mark. Let's see:

Avenger frustrates me. I can't read them; I've read their ISO more than anyone else's in the thread. The best I can say about them is, at the risk of aping Assassin from a few minutes ago, is they've said a few decent things recently. However, there's also a few things they've said recently that I don't like. None of this adds up to a townread or a scumread for me, and add that to the fact that I have solid townreads on Assassin and Alter, a liquid townread on Caster and gaseous townreads on a couple of others, I'm not voting for a damn question mark.

So, now we've cleared that little misrep up, let me ask again, what the hell does this mean?

But I am scum reading him, so I guess, politically, there's no benefit for him to town read me and just hand me the vote.

What, precisely, are you trying to say here? That there's no benefit for me to town read you because you're scumreading me?

Pedit @Assassin what the actual hell is an angleshoot

[Servant Avenger]

Thanks for the vote assassin. I appreciate it, because I think it helps getting the votes I need more than pretty much any other.
Hopefully I get IC'd.

@Rider, is that a misrep if it's literally what you said. You've been hemming and hawing over whether I'm scum or not with 100 posts. I'm not going to argue that my beginning posts were bare. Part of that is just that it's early game, I was on a tablet that probably made my posts very focused on what I wanted to say, and was still working on impressions.

An angleshoot means just that, it's a shot in the dark from an angle that uses outside/non-game related information to find scum. So it's outside the box, so to speak. Mafia sometimes do it to look town.
Town sometimes do it because, well they're town and they want to win.

[Servant Avenger]

Changing tack. Rider, if you don't mind, would you give a complete list of your reads and your reasoning for each of them?

[Servant Assassin]

Pedit @Assassin what the actual hell is an angleshoot

means trying to get an advantage using underhanded methods. essentially, did avenger really just try to gauge whether a new account's title would reflect posts made in a PT to determine if someone is lying (unethical, unsporting, but probably town) or are they someone who knows better and faked it to get towncred? i think probably the former but since this is an anonymous game, who knows. i'm willing to take a chance anyway

[Servant Rider]

It is a misrep, because you're misrepresenting my reason for not voting you.

*deep breath*

I don't like that you keep making these vague statements (the political part of #771, #531 and #534, there'd be a list if I were still bothering to take notes). I don't know what the purpose of them are. Your early game was null, we've established this. I don't like how you seemed to talk yourself into scumreading me; it felt fake. I don't like your reason for scumreading me; you don't know me, you don't know how I play. I don't like that the only thing you've done consistently is try to get elected and setup spec.

It'd be great if all this added up to a scumread, but it doesn't. I've seen worse come from town. I've seen better come from town. But all of these niggles add up to one thing: I'm sure as fuck not voting for you today.

I apologize if this is coming across as needlessly aggressive. But something about that political comment has me riled.

Pedit: No, I don't think I will. You know who I want to vote for today.
Pedit2: Thanks, Assassin.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

I read all that and I still don't know what your read on Avenger is.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

At one point you said you were "coming around to the idea" that Avenger was town (308) and that you were starting to like him a bit more recently (422) but then that suddenly went to flat-out not voting him today (715), being unable to read him (724) and that last post that doesn't tell me much about your position on him.

There's nothing between 422 and 715 that I can see about Avenger.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

That's why I mentioned your trajectory™ on Avenger is odd.

I guess #531 and #534 were enough for you to be totally unsure about your earlier town read on him?

[Servant Rider]

I

don't know what my read on Avenger is. In 308, several people were townreading Avenger and I thought to myself "hey, maybe there's something to it". In particular Beast's point about Avenger's counterclaim resonated with me, so I wanted to reread Avenger taking that into account. When I did, I came to the conclusion that it was null, (and I remained firmly on the fence with Avenger) because the tinfoil hat-wearing part of me that was abducted by UFOs thinks hey wait, quick thinking scum could've done it too. Very similar to the reason I don't give Berserker town points for the initial push.

In my 422, I had started to see hints of towniness. I liked his #343. It was one of the first things he'd said that struck me as having real substance to it. But one post I liked out of 50 or so wasn't enough. So I waited. Then 531 and 534 happened. As you've probably noticed in my reaction to archer's #241, I really don't like things that look like content but aren't, and both of those posts ping'd. Down to null/faint distaste again. Then we run into #645/647. I don't like the progression there. His 343 had decent reasoning for not townreading me, but "Rider would be more helpful if town" strikes me as a little disingenuous in an anon game. We then go into 647 which hit me as very off, as I think it may be the first time I've seen someone go "huh, guess I'm scumreading that person". When I scumread someone I tend to smite them from on high with holy fire and rhetoric, so the progression there felt wildly unnatural to me. Then we get to #771 and the rest, as they say, is history.

Now, you would think reading this that I'm scumreading Avenger now. I'm not. I know myself well enough to know I make mountains out of molehills sometimes, particularly when pissed. And boy was my hair on fire from that political comment in 771. I've calmed down a bit now, though. Thinking on it now, I'm not sure why it angered me the way it did. Certainly shouldn't have let it do so, regardless of where it came from. So the conclusion I came to is I really don't understand Avenger. Everything in the above paragraph could be explained by differences in playstyle. It proved to me one thing: I'm not reliable at reading him. And I'm not voting for someone I can't read.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

If you set your hair on fire in anger because he used the word "politically", I am frightened to imagine what you'd do if he said something actually controversial.

[Servant Rider]

It had nothing to do with the word politically and everything to do with the fact that I felt like I was being pot-shot at. Using personal policy not to vote for Avenger? I very clearly said in 724 I don't feel comfortable voting someone I can't read, particularly when I have multiple townreads I could be voting for instead. Avenger then says well, it's not surprising Rider isn't voting me, since there's no ulterior motive for Rider to do so as he(Avenger) is already scum reading me. It came off as snarky and snide, and I took umbrage with it.