Mini Normal 2159 | Cinder Block Mafia | Game Over!

[ItalianoVD]

I think the shelly wagon was scum driven. Scum rarely get eliminated Day 1, except by luck or major slipup and the way this gamestate was in Day 1, it's very likely imo. Shelly wasn't even all that scummy to me.

[Tayl0r Swift]

ok italiano. its time for you and walter to explain why you were so confident in each other yesterday. i dont like your entrance to today, and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

[Looker]

I feel like there's a pretty good chance scum is between cfj or Walter though

So you're saying both scum bussed shelly?

Spoiler:

I will hammer whichever wagon hits E-1 first as soon as it hits E-1 no questions asked. Claims out if ya got em.

this post never comes from town

ur so cracked

honestly ill switch to shellyc

VOTE: shellyc

i town read this slot but i really don't like who's on the walter wagon with me

I'm tempted to town read Nosferatu for the end of day switch here.

I agreee sorta also. Iam trying to figure out why scum team would not stall out the game state again. Which makes me think nos is town for that. Although I'm not sure RCE using the same reasons is a good one.

Do you think a stall would be inconspicuous if they were already bussing? I don't know how effective jumping off of shelly last minute would be.

[ItalianoVD]

ok italiano. its time for you and walter to explain why you were so confident in each other yesterday. i dont like your entrance to today, and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

[ItalianoVD]

@Taylor: I am scumreading Gamma, just so you know.

[ItalianoVD]

I feel like there's a pretty good chance scum is between cfj or Walter though

So you're saying both scum bussed shelly?

Spoiler:

I will hammer whichever wagon hits E-1 first as soon as it hits E-1 no questions asked. Claims out if ya got em.

this post never comes from town

ur so cracked

honestly ill switch to shellyc

VOTE: shellyc

i town read this slot but i really don't like who's on the walter wagon with me

I'm tempted to town read Nosferatu for the end of day switch here.

I agreee sorta also. Iam trying to figure out why scum team would not stall out the game state again. Which makes me think nos is town for that. Although I'm not sure RCE using the same reasons is a good one.

Do you think a stall would be inconspicuous if they were already bussing?

I don't know how effective jumping off of shelly last minute would be.

Jumping on would be. Or staying off for that matter.

[callforjudgement]

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

Do you have the ability to confirm yourself to people overnight?

If so, who did you confirm yourself to last night?

[Tayl0r Swift]

ok italiano. its time for you and walter to explain why you were so confident in each other yesterday. i dont like your entrance to today, and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

and did the mod confirm to you that walter is town?

[WaltertheDunce10]

This is true
Me and italiano are in a neighborhood

[Tayl0r Swift]

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

[Frogsterking]

I don't believe that the wagon was scum driven. I believe it wasn't intended by scum.

The TFN neighborhood thing makes sense given the theory I floated yesterday about the setup being a 9-4, with more prs to come for town. I'm actually imagining this setup now as a series of two-person town neighborhoods vs four scum. Maybe one neighborhood is one town one scum.

In my current view of the game CFJ is angry because he believes shelly lost the game for scum, and given it's a traditional 10-3 setup, I believe there were no scum on the shelly wagon, and one on each of the others:

Gamma on the geraintm wagon, CFJ on Walter wagon and shelly on her own Italiano wagon.

Given a 9-4 I think there was a single scum on the shelly wagon, and my first guess is tayl0r. She doesn't seem very happy that a mafia got lynched D1 + a VT died, and she seems a little anxious for town cred.

[Frogsterking]

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

Do you have the ability to confirm yourself to people overnight?

If so, who did you confirm yourself to last night?

ok italiano. its time for you and walter to explain why you were so confident in each other yesterday. i dont like your entrance to today, and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

and did the mod confirm to you that walter is town?

This is true
Me and italiano are in a neighborhood

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

I'm reading panic here.

[Frogsterking]

Panic from both the tayl0r and CFJ slots.

[Frogsterking]

I'm very curious what power roles scum have available to them in a normal setup. Does anyone mind giving a brief summary of the current normal setup meta on the scum side?

[Raya36]

I feel like there's a pretty good chance scum is between cfj or Walter though

So you're saying both scum bussed shelly?

No. I'm saying one of those two are probably scum. But that is an interesting theory considering the idea that the elimination was scum driven

[callforjudgement]

I'm very curious what power roles scum have available to them in a normal setup. Does anyone mind giving a brief summary of the current normal setup meta on the scum side?

Most commonly, either three goons, or two goons + a weak investigative (Rolecop, Tracker, etc.). Encryptors used to be common, but nowadays simply putting "scum have daytalk" in the rules is more common.

It's possible for scum to have a Roleblocker or similar role, but those tend to need a very powerful town in order to counteract their balance effects.

Neighbourhoods are more commonly town+town, although town+scum is also seen. (Some mods will pick one neighbour as town, then randomly pick who the other neighbour is, in order to avoid modmeta/modWIFOM being used to figure out the alignments of a neighbourhood.)

[Raya36]

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

Scum!Walter would have likely NKed the FN. Nobody would know for sure if it was luck or if Walter knew.

UNVOTE:

[callforjudgement]

I think there's a chance that Italiano is confused between the roles "neighbour" and "friendly neighbour"; Italiano has been confirmed to have the first by Walter, and has claimed the second (possibly by mistake). It is possible, even in a Normal, for him to have both. This is why it's important to get a clarification of the claim, because there's a big difference in terms of balance impact and in what we can deduce from Walter's actions.

@

Italiano

: Are you a Friendly Neighbour (can confirm self as town), or just a Neighbour (can talk privately)? If you are a Friendly Neighbour, a) who did you confirm yourself to (knowing this will probably let us confirm you as town), b) did Walter know that prior to the end of Night 1?

[Raya36]

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

Do you have the ability to confirm yourself to people overnight?

If so, who did you confirm yourself to last night?

ok italiano. its time for you and walter to explain why you were so confident in each other yesterday. i dont like your entrance to today, and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

And I appreciate that a lot. It's going to come up eventually, but I am the Friendly town neighbor and I share a neighborhood with Walter.

and did the mod confirm to you that walter is town?

This is true
Me and italiano are in a neighborhood

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

I'm reading panic here.

Another thing is there is no attempt to read Walter's alignment from this new info. It makes much more sense that Walter is town in this situation or I'd expect Italiano to be dead instead of confirmed right now. Not worth the town cred of keeping the FN alive in my opinion.

This reads as Taylor guessing that Walter is not confirmed to be town and therefore using that to try to place doubt.

[RCEnigma]

Walter isn't confirmed even if Italiano is FN. Whether he knew going into the night or night, there are some large conclusions being jumped to, will consolidate my initial day 2 reads when I do some wagon sniffing.

However Nos town from eod (alright felt like this was true but ehh) as well as gerain. My vote on Shelly was kind of an eod prayer since deadline had already passed (even with the 2 hour delay) I threw it on Shelly thinking it probably wouldn't count but hey if it did we get a flip.

Gerain 100% could have just opted not to hammer and had already established he would probably miss eod.

Regardless I think it's an offwagon day. NM looks more like a pr hunt than anything else and should NOT dissuade off wagon hunting.

But RC, why would scum shoot offwagon if they weren't on the Shelly wagon? Well silly little townie, cuz mafia.

[Tayl0r Swift]

Panic from both the tayl0r and CFJ slots.

what sort of panic do you think im in? what exactly do you think is causing me to panic?

[Nosferatu]

I will hammer whichever wagon hits E-1 first as soon as it hits E-1 no questions asked. Claims out if ya got em.

this post never comes from town

ur so cracked

honestly ill switch to shellyc

VOTE: shellyc

i town read this slot but i really don't like who's on the walter wagon with me

I'm tempted to town read Nosferatu for the end of day switch here.

honestly i was hard reading shelly as town i was so ready to gloat

[Tayl0r Swift]

at this point it may be helpful for everyone to claim whether or not they are in a neighborhood. no need to claim neighbors, but it would be very helpful for me to understand my role. i can claim/explain everything or at least something based on what people say.

[ItalianoVD]

Do you have the ability to confirm yourself to people overnight?

Yes

If so, who did you confirm yourself to last night?

If that person wants to reveal that they can do that.

...and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

I missed this initially. Why does it sound like you are so concerned that I crumbed?

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

From what I’ve read scum is more likely to be in 3+ person neighborhoods. That’s not to say it can’t happen in a 2 person neighborhood, but I don’t think it’s likely in this case.

And to answer your previous question, no Walter’s role has not been confirmed to me, but I wasn’t gonna feel comfortable him getting eliminated because I’ve had a strong feeling that Walter was/is town.

[Tayl0r Swift]

Do you have the ability to confirm yourself to people overnight?

Yes

If so, who did you confirm yourself to last night?

If that person wants to reveal that they can do that.

...and while i covered for you yesterday i think you owe an explanation to everyone for what you crumbed yesterday.

I missed this initially. Why does it sound like you are so concerned that I crumbed?

ok but do you know each other's roles? because a scum-town neighborhood is definitely a thing

From what I’ve read scum is more likely to be in 3+ person neighborhoods. That’s not to say it can’t happen in a 2 person neighborhood, but I don’t think it’s likely in this case.

And to answer your previous question, no Walter’s role has not been confirmed to me, but I wasn’t gonna feel comfortable him getting eliminated because I’ve had a strong feeling that Walter was/is town.

im concerned because i picked up on the crumb and made an assumption about your role and then hard defended you and walter (especially walter). following that, the pressure on walter disappeared. if theres a possibility that walter could be scum (if most/all of you are in neighborhoods it becomes increasingly likely that at least some of you are in neighborhoods with scum). if the pressure on walter disappeared for bad reasons, then we should look back at day 1 and reconsider whether walter is a good push today.