Mini Theme 2161: Undertale C Open - Chara's Folly

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I dunno

he hasn't done enough yet for me to use my soul read yet.

I'm worried he might be avoiding me :>

How is it that he was "avoiding" you when he placed a hurt vote on you and directly questioned you on if you had any reads? (;￢＿￢)

because it felt like a not very serious hurt vote. There was not much substance or additional follow-through.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

If I put a vote on someone I am saying "This person is suspicious" and drawing attention to them. If I was a bit vague with my initial posts, I don't think it was hard to infer why I felt you were suspect. My vote also got you to stop fucking around and produce actual content, so in that regard I'd consider it a rousing success.

ok but what exactly have you done to sort my slot?

[Morning Tweet]

Yeah so Hectic probably isn't scum, don't really see why he goes out of his way to call all that attention to himself.

Note that he has failed to be cognizant of the game setup before as scum (In werewolf, warlock, vampire he sort of forgot scum had a nightkill), but that was during RVS, not after 28 pages of literally half of which was mech talk.

If he truly believes that 1 spare / 3 fights is better than 4 fights (I cannot be fucked to check if that's the case but he seems to think so), combine that with knowing I am 99% town, it just kind of makes sense to advocate for sparing me

I can see why Prism interpreted it as performative, but i think if you insert yourself into Hectic's mindset there it'd make sense. His mindset being "We need 1 spare and 3 fights in no particular order, Morning is town so there's the first correct decision off the bat"

whereas if Hectic is scum, i don't see why the hell he'd start advocating for a spare. WITHOUT ANY CASE or flashy reasoning to be seen. Especially considering that spares are always met with suspicion thus far. And I think it's vastly unlikely scum!Hectic is like "Oh I'm going to pretend to misinterpret the setup and start advocating a spare without giving a case for it because people will interpret that as too scummy to be scum". cause we won't. Not a single time has someone advocating for spares been met with positive feedback to my knowledge

i think it just makes more sense that town Hectic doesn't care about how he's interpreted and he justs posts that, thinking it to be the best strategy possible at the time. clearly mistakes were made

[Morning Tweet]

Also pointing out I'm 100% town and then getting me spared seems like a pretty pointless move, bordering on just a plain negative play for scum!Hectic. I can see the argument being made that his intention was never to actually get me spared and he's just doing it because I guess he's.. trying to do... what exactly? I'm not actually sure what he gains from pretending to want me spared either

[catboi]

I dunno

he hasn't done enough yet for me to use my soul read yet.

I'm worried he might be avoiding me :>

How is it that he was "avoiding" you when he placed a hurt vote on you and directly questioned you on if you had any reads? (;￢＿￢)

because it felt like a not very serious hurt vote. There was not much substance or additional follow-through.

Me saying "the more I think about it, the more I think I'm with you" comes off pretty serious, I thought. But, whatever. I definitely did not communicate clearly at that point in time. If I step outside of my own head for a minute, I think I can see why someone would be bothered by the way I worded that vote post.

Let's make a deal: I still do not trust you. However, I do not think the town is going to want to FIGHT either of us today. I've other reads I'm more interested on elaborating on at this point in time. In order to avoid drowning the thread in an endless back and forth that no one actually wants to read, I am proposing a truce where we stop arguing with each other for now. Deal?

[Morning Tweet]

Oh maybe pocket me. It's a fantastic way to pocket me.

But pocketing isn't very useful if you get eliminated immediately after

[catboi]

my Spicy Hot Take(tm) of the night is that lavender (confidering how difficult they seem to be to wagon) is chara who's trying to leave out the fewest associates possible for after they flip. this may or may not be the sleep deprevation mixed with unhealthy tunnelling speaking. i'll decide in the morning.
HURT: lavender

This is definitely looking plausible at this point in time. I would be perfectly willing to fight Lavender at this point in time. I would say she is the player in this game I suspect the second most. (the first I will be explaining shortly).

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Me saying "the more I think about it, the more I think I'm with you" comes off pretty serious, I thought. But, whatever. I definitely did not communicate clearly at that point in time. If I step outside of my own head for a minute, I think I can see why someone would be bothered by the way I worded that vote post.

yes, and I thought it was pretty strange you took his vote that seriously - I'd love to know why you thought it was a good idea - I'm trying to see your thought process because I want to figure out if you are coming at me because you actually suspect me or if you are scum trying to push a ML.

That's why I am asking you for "why" you believed that post made a good case for Pooky being scum.

[Hectic]

Note that he has failed to be cognizant of the game setup before as scum (In werewolf, warlock, vampire he sort of forgot scum had a nightkill), but that was during RVS, not after 28 pages of literally half of which was mech talk.

but i wasn't trying to fake a dumbslip or anything. i was talking about identifying 1 T-T pair

after

the nightkill, and then when someone mentioned the possibility of a W-W pairing, i admitted it wasn't actually true in that case
no one even bothered to ask me if i'd forgotten scum had a nightkill or to clarify why i thought 1 T-T pairing was enough
everyone thought it was a townslip so i just went with it and let it happen lol

[catboi]

Me saying "the more I think about it, the more I think I'm with you" comes off pretty serious, I thought. But, whatever. I definitely did not communicate clearly at that point in time. If I step outside of my own head for a minute, I think I can see why someone would be bothered by the way I worded that vote post.

yes, and I thought it was pretty strange you took his vote that seriously - I'd love to know why you thought it was a good idea - I'm trying to see your thought process because I want to figure out if you are coming at me because you actually suspect me or if you are scum trying to push a ML.

That's why I am asking you for "why" you believed that post made a good case for Pooky being scum.

I actually suspected you, yes. I felt as though you were deliberately avoiding engagement with the thread, and hectic called you out on not having a single read. I felt like the gimmickry was a front, that if you played the part of the goofy fun man people would just wind up drawn to other targets and ignoring you because "why would he do that as scum?". You showed no sign of seriously sorting anyone's alignment, and at that point in time, that was good enough for my day 1 vote.

(the past few days I have been unable to respond properly because I've been busy IRL and haven't been able to properly catch up to the thread which is why I've not really been able to respond to you directly).

[catboi]

lol

my style is to ask questions and try to do it in a neutral way, because i like seeing how people respond when you don't cue them exactly how you want them to respond. like, if you warn someone "im probing you" before you probe them you get a different response than if you don't. fyi. i think some people misread me when i do this

also i wanted hectic to elaborate more than he did. i still feel like he shoudl feel townier than he does, so i'm kind of null on the slot. (maybe it's just the posting gimmick? i admit the pictures do get me to at least read what he says)

I recall talking with a friend over your alignment in a game we were spectating. He was extremely confident you were town while you were basically a coinflip to me. I will accept that it is possible your style is just one that is difficult for me to read.

As for Hectic, I feel comfortable enough now to say he has said things I like, as well as some I do not like. I do not have a definite conclusion on him, but I would say my misgivings are relatively minor right now.

now i have to know more! you can't tell me that people are gossipping about me and not tell me more. what game was it? why did you not think i was town? do i have my own fanclub? im actually pretty pleased with my games on this account so far, ive made it to endgame in all of them and won all my town games. (There was one scum game but i dont really count that because i subbed into a scumteam where i was the only scum left, which makes me extra curious to get a sense of how you read me)

Mafia of Revelations, after Day 1- for the record, I ultimately did decide you were town, it was just one of my lowest confidence reads.

[catboi]

anyways, based on what vibes / reads im hearing from people here's my take on what wagons are viable, fwiw:

* pooky
* elements
* * hectic
* taylor

catboi seems to have divided people 50-50 but with more leaning town, same with me i think? (not sure why tbh.) there hasn't been as much wagon development today as im used to with all the spare talk, so the options look a little weird. there's also probably some room to fight someone who hasn't made much of an impression (i might put lavender and prism in this category, though prism has posted enough so maybe i'm making that up? maybe redtea? idk).

also apropos of nothing i want to talk to morning tweet and chara a little more, i had some productive convos with them early on and haven't lately.

Strongly feel that redtea is town and Prism is trending that way as well. (also wouldn't fight Prism day 1 unless he overtly scumslipped and even then I might keep him around for laughs).

[catboi]

2) catboi-are you still scumreading Pooky? I felt he might be overplaying the spare angle at first, he was 2/3 in my scumpool, but after he got more vehement it became more of a coinflip to me. I haven't read his case on you yet. Without really knowing his meta, it seems possible for the heavy hitting out of left field to be a reliable tool in an experienced player's arsenal. But what do you think?

I will admit, I am feeling little pangs of doubt right now. as I said earlier, when I step outside my own headspace, where my motivations are perfectly clear and lucid to me, I can see why he'd be bothered with the way I've said things. Still, I think a tool in his arsenal is to fight back hard and intimidate people, get them to back down. I more or less expected him to flip the switch and get serious when I accused him. I still have a harrd time some of the arguments he is making are genuine thoughts.

[catboi]

Okay, moving on from pooky arguments, hopefully.

Is no one else bothered by how User Chara's recent posts are all information over analysis? 487 503 509 517 520 585 586 590

The closest they come to actual content is an unsupported "hesitant TR" on Hectic, and only because they've been questioned on their read of him. What bugged me about that was the fact they offered a link to a recent scumgame of Hectic's in 380, without drawing any conclusions from it themselves. I would say a lot of User Chara's posting falls into the category of "background noise". This person is my strongest scumread at this point in time.


HURT: Chara

[Tayl0r Swift]

I might be forced to compromise but until that point this vote is not moving. Terrible responses imo

"legitimately pushing for sparing me" is really tenuous, and "this is the play friends" with arrows highlighting ithe spare vote on Morning, with the mech as the framing leading up to it, suggests that it was more than "idk just getting mech thoughts out there"

Not thinking to either sell others on the townread, and not showing any thought as to how likely a Morning spare was/what other spares might be considered. Giant red flags to me.

Still phone posting for now, I really want to read Morning/Puppy/Tanner when I get to my computer in a few hours

yaeh actually the more i think about it the more i agree that hectic has been overly defensive about this. i also still find it a little hard to buy that someone could forget whether spare or fight was the agreed upon strat after 20 pages of discussion

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Note that he has failed to be cognizant of the game setup before as scum (In werewolf, warlock, vampire he sort of forgot scum had a nightkill), but that was during RVS, not after 28 pages of literally half of which was mech talk.

but i wasn't trying to fake a dumbslip or anything. i was talking about identifying 1 T-T pair

after

the nightkill, and then when someone mentioned the possibility of a W-W pairing, i admitted it wasn't actually true in that case
no one even bothered to ask me if i'd forgotten scum had a nightkill or to clarify why i thought 1 T-T pairing was enough
everyone thought it was a townslip so i just went with it and let it happen lol

Personally I think a player of Hectic's caliber just doesn't town-slip

[catboi]

(●´ω｀●)ゞ tayl0r, do you mind explaining why exactly it is that you scumread me?

[Morning Tweet]

i asked that too but haven't gotten a response yet i dont think (・`ω´・)

[catboi]

I know but she had just posted so I was hoping she'd see mine and answer (๑•́‧̫•̀๑)

[Morning Tweet]

(¬‿¬) it's a bold strategy, let's see if it pays off

[Tayl0r Swift]

hmm i reread the iso and im not sure what i was seeing. its possible that the avatar just set me off? on rereading youre more null-town

[catboi]

(๑•̆૩•̆) I am not sure how I feel about that answer.

[Morning Tweet]

ヽ(・о・)ﾉ

that was your top scumread! what happened?!

[Tayl0r Swift]

i dunno! at the time i didnt like that catboi wont lay off pooky. pooky feels like lhf and kinda obvtown. but catboi overall i think is just overeager town.

[Isis]

beeboy replaces Elements, effective immediately