FGO: Mafia in the Lostbelt (Game Over!)

[Servant Foreigner]

Can someone please confirm the following.
They are a town player without the ability to make someone else a master?

Because I don't think anyone has done that, and that's still a scum slip on top of the 101 scummy things they have done.
I am trying to drop it because everyone is saying I am role fishing but like I hard scum read the slot for play and I really just want to make this easy on myself.

Like as soon as the game started I said "It makes perfect sense for scum not to be able to make someone else a master".
Then Shielder played like scum.
Then scum flipped having a with a master ability but not the ability to hand it on.

I only refrained from hard pushing it because I was worried it wouldn't even be labelled "with a master for scum".

[Servant Avenger]

It's pretty obvious Cabd didn't leave them with fake role claims.
Archer's was lazily modified.

This take really, Really REALLY runs counter to everything I know/have observed about Cabd game designs and in fact I think the Tales of Vesperia game I read during the previous phase directly contradicts this idea. When I'm not half-asleep I'll go look for the example I'm pretty sure I remember from that game and link it here.

------------------------

I think it's time to reveal this.

During this day phase I have been neighborized. By a player I think is town.

That is all.

For now.

Skip it, give me bare essentials. Has he provided fake claims before?

[Servant Beast]

There's an underlying tangibility to some player's roles that pretty much everyone that's town has hinted at to one extent or another while Archer was pretty much a black hole of role information. He either hadn't decided what he wanted to be when he grew up (not uncommon day 1) or didn't have something to fall back on early.

Who else hasn't given out information/fake information on their role?

Other than confirming that I can also give out master benefits like everyone else, I haven't explicitly said anything about my role. I don't really plan on it either. You will know when you need to know.

[Servant Assassin]

I would like to ask you if you've managed to settle on a guess for a team yet?

I don't have a full solve.

I do have town reads to varying degrees on Alter Ego, Foreigner, Avenger, Berserker, Caster, Ruler and to a lesser extent Saber. (None of these are GTH, to use a cool kid initialism.)

You can probably work backwards from there to figure out where my head is at.

I want to firm up my Saber read. I want to read Lancer properly. I've been lazier on these two slots than others.

(I also kind of want to figure out which of my town reads I'd be wrong about if I am wrong about one or more of them, but this isn't a major concern for me until I start being wrong.)

(And I guess now that Archer has been flipped, I get to think about associations too.)

I see. Was mainly interested because you'd mentioned looking for a 4th at one point and was curious if you'd found it.

[Servant Assassin]

Let's not play the game off Role PMs.

[Servant Foreigner]

If someone is playing like scum and people won't listen.
Then I can and will argue they scum slipped.

I didn't remember the scum slip until I tried to make a better case btw.

[Servant Alter Ego]

It's pretty obvious Cabd didn't leave them with fake role claims.
Archer's was lazily modified.

This take really, Really REALLY runs counter to everything I know/have observed about Cabd game designs and in fact I think the Tales of Vesperia game I read during the previous phase directly contradicts this idea. When I'm not half-asleep I'll go look for the example I'm pretty sure I remember from that game and link it here.

------------------------

I think it's time to reveal this.

During this day phase I have been neighborized. By a player I think is town.

That is all.

For now.

Skip it, give me bare essentials. Has he provided fake claims before?

Yes to fake claims.

If I remember Vesperia correctly, and I hope I do since I read it just a week ago, there was a role copier and a godfather in that game. The rolecopier would have (maybe did????) receive the godfather's fake claim role. The gofather decided to modify the fake claim he got in his role PM, and the modified fake claim would have gone to the role copier. I can't remember if this came out in the postgame as an explanation of a possible game reality or if it actually occurred. Hence my wanting to reread and be absolutely sure.

[Servant Foreigner]

If someone could vouch it's not a scum slip, I think someone would have done it as well.
The entire way they entered the day doesn't make sense.

Why do people on this site hate eliminating scum.

[Servant Caster]

Can someone please confirm the following.
They are a town player without the ability to make someone else a master?

Because I don't think anyone has done that, and that's still a scum slip on top of the 101 scummy things they have done.
I am trying to drop it because everyone is saying I am role fishing but like I hard scum read the slot for play and I really just want to make this easy on myself.

I see it as possible their role is different. Especially as Shielder is one of the special servants in flavor. What I do find odd is them changing their story to being able to chain once.

[Servant Foreigner]

Can someone please confirm the following.
They are a town player without the ability to make someone else a master?

Because I don't think anyone has done that, and that's still a scum slip on top of the 101 scummy things they have done.
I am trying to drop it because everyone is saying I am role fishing but like I hard scum read the slot for play and I really just want to make this easy on myself.

I see it as possible their role is different. Especially as Shielder is one of the special servants in flavor. What I do find odd is them changing their story to being able to chain once.

A common scum mentality is "just slightly alter your real role pm". Which would justify going against the fake claim.

I don't think it's impossible the scum team is just bad and either didn't check in the scum PT before claiming in thread.
Like Shielder claiming that as soon as he replaced in is a huge deal in terms of that mistake happening.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

Cabd could have very well made it so only one town player did not have that ability.

He's a huge fucking troll and I could so very easily see that being the case.

But I do think Shielder probably is scum who genuinely doesn't have it and truthfully claimed that.

FTR, every single still living player apart from Shielder has claimed to have it (or "a similar ability").

I somewhat agree with whatshisface that you shouldn't play the game around role PMs, but it's still a factor I'm thinking about. It's a piece of the puzzle.

[Servant Foreigner]

I mean he was caught for play and this role pm stuff was brought up after the fact.
It's just helping seal the deal really.

[Servant Assassin]

I think Berserker is referring to Archer's vote when she says "led by scum" (even though Archer wasn't leading it).

(And Archer's vote there doesn't make me think "wow, definitely not distancing" either.)

My preliminary thought is that while I would certainly not rule out shielder and archer as being compatible teammates, I do not know how long my time in the game will be (even with the strongman removed from the picture), and would like to ride the high of the first scum elimination to pursue more difficult targets. But this is all pending a thread review.

[Servant Avenger]

I mean he was caught for play and this role pm stuff was brought up after the fact.
It's just helping seal the deal really.

I moved my vote back more quickly than I usually would on the strength of him failing to define "negative" Not that, this means I'm right about this though. If he usually gives fake claims, he probably gave fake claims. Sorry for the derail.

[Servant Alter Ego]

He's a huge fucking troll

Confirming!

[Servant Foreigner]

I mean he was caught for play and this role pm stuff was brought up after the fact.
It's just helping seal the deal really.

I moved my vote back more quickly than I usually would on the strength of him failing to define "negative" Not that, this means I'm right about this though. If he usually gives fake claims, he probably gave fake claims. Sorry for the derail.

I am saying he didn't check all 4 of his fake claims and notice the connection.
It's not information available in the game mechanics and he could have easily posted before looking at the scum PT.

Shielder did that as soon as he replaced in.

And again I remembered this after already being pretty committed to voting him.

AND we still have 0 confirmation from anyone else that is actually possible.

This shouldn't be this hard to push ngl

[Servant Foreigner]

Idk so you think the following 2 conditions are true.

That a town player would not vote someone for "information" then argue later the wagon didn't matter because of how inevitable it was.
The wide range of other scummy things come from town.
In addition, this oddly scummy townie ended up with Cabd's only red herring town role pm.

Because these are the 2 conditions needed for shielder to be town and I don't buy it.

[Servant Assassin]

If you take everyone's stated skill levels and personalities at face value then idk.
Sounds like a good way to lose an anon game.

I will be honest: I do not think the player on that account has adopted their persona as a deliberate scheme. That seems like a strategy no one would ever willingly pursue.

If we're arguing over whether the Shielder wagon was scum or town lead, it makes sense to identify precisely who people thought was leading that wagon. Talking in abstractions confuses people. If people also use different definitions of leaders, they could talk about different slots entirely.

I bring this up because I also think Shielder is a bad place to lynch for now and I want to look at his wagon. Sure, there could be the defeatist Archer and Shielder are both scum approach but that would be ideally confirmed by seeing a lack of scum pushing Shielder as well.

I feel like saber replaced saber.

The hits just keep coming with this game.

@Shielder, er, probably not. To your solve. Rider and Caster are not likely scum partners.

Why?

You're not reading the room if you think town is apathetic.

We're reading the room differently. Towns have conflict or they breed apathy. Good towns resolve that conflict efficiently. Since I got here, I see a follow the leader. I am concerned about it, so I'll say so.

I don't know, I'm feeling some conflict going on right now. Makes me feel warm inside.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

I don't think Shielder is lying about being scum read a lot as town, or lying about anything regarding his playstyle really.

I do think Shielder is using that as a crutch though (because it's true

when he is town

, it's easier to spew true things about it).

[Servant Alter Ego]

I don't think Shielder is lying about being scum read a lot as town, or lying about anything regarding his playstyle really.

I do think Shielder is using that as a crutch though (because it's true

when he is town

, it's easier to spew true things about it).

Oh my dear, dear Moon Cancer you just nailed my year 1 scumgame.

Does Shielder seem that new to the game to you?

Maybe? I dunno.

[Servant Alter Ego]

Godfather Role PM from Vesperia

Ragou

"It's the privilege of my exalted station to dispel such boredom with the...help of the common people."

Your role is Mafia-Aligned Modified Godfather

Ah, a position of power. Good thing you totally abuse the heck out of that. Isn't diplomatic immunity great? You will appear as town to all cop investigations. In addition, you may choose what you appear to be when role copped. If you don't specify anything, your fakeclaim below will be used by default.

Your partners are Prohawk and Discode. Your quicktopic is below. (Daytalk is active by default)

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/9JcMsqdnMvsFC

You win when all non-mafia players are dead, and at least one mafia player is alive; or when preventing such from occurring is impossible. Please confirm with a reply PM stating your role and alignment.

Spoiler: fakeclaim

Patty Fluer

"I wasn't attacked! We were playing!"

Your role is Town-Aligned Even-Night Hider

You're older than you look, honest. WAAAAAAY older. Now don't mind me, go over there and hide, I know you want to.

Each even-numbered night, you may PM me a name. You will hide behind that player. If they are town aligned, great. If they're not, well, I hope you enjoy the feeling of a knife in your ribs...

You win when all anti-town players are dead, and at least one town player is left alive. Please confirm with a reply PM stating your role and alignment.

Subject: Mini 1551: Tales of Vesperia Mafia (Game Over)

Saki, Karol Capel the Town aligned modified Hated, Killed Night 4.


Moogle Dance Troupe, Raven the Town-aligned 3-shot Role Copier, Endgamed Night 4.

Orcinus_theoriginal, Ragou the modified godfather (Showing as even night hider), survives and wins.

Note the "showing" part.


Subject: Mini 1551: Tales of Vesperia Mafia (Game Over)

The mod was trolling. Haven't you /met/ him?

Quoted just because.

[Servant Alter Ego]

I should say:

I expect scum have fake role pms or can ask for them/ask to have them modified.

I don't expect this game to push the limits toward bastard quite as hard as Vesperia did just because I think Cabd's mod philosophy has changed over the years. This game ran in 2014.

[Servant Moon Cancer]

The whole "negative" thing he said means he either didn't have one or ignored the one he was given to claim that.

I haven't followed recent pages outside of skimming for mentions of either my name. Why do people think this is at all important?

[Servant Shielder]

Adding multiple levels of self awareness doesn't magically make it townie. Scum bait out experience levels all the time on anon accounts, and I feel the only argument in his favor is his scummy actions are a result of a lack of experience.

If it was a stupid thought process that bad players actually think, sure why not. But no one goes "haha time to not vote my scum read because it won't breed good information".

well you'd be right if the archer elim wasnt inevitable. if we were in the scumhunting phase then my vote should be on scummy people. but archer was getting elimed there 100%. so it doesnt really matter whether i vote there or not.

But you just fucking said the composition was important
I can't deal with this person they're like a caricature of a scum aligned player

i think my vote mattered uniquely little, since people had already made up their minds about me one way or the other

[Servant Avenger]

@Shielder, er, probably not. To your solve. Rider and Caster are not likely scum partners.

Why?

Because they interacted quite naturally and I don't think rider would be caught dead saying some of the stuff he was saying to caster as scum.