Mini Theme 2164: Betrayal Mafia I (Game over!)


Forum rules
User avatar
PenguinPower
PenguinPower
He/Him
.peng
User avatar
User avatar
PenguinPower
He/Him
.peng
.peng
Posts: 22435
Joined: June 15, 2016
Pronoun: He/Him

Post Post #100 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:29 am

Post by PenguinPower »

In post 93, Bingle wrote:“Item: You find a dire wombat and are reminded that Pine failed us all.”
:lol:


Last edited by lilith2013 on Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
<(") | (")>
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #101 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:32 am

Post by Bingle »

ABR: am I wrong in my impression that you would want to be the scum role that would need to survive, the idea that you would be able to get your way, or both?
User avatar
Albert B. Rampage
Albert B. Rampage
Illogical Rampage
User avatar
User avatar
Albert B. Rampage
Illogical Rampage
Illogical Rampage
Posts: 27261
Joined: April 8, 2007
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico

Post Post #102 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:40 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

In post 101, Bingle wrote:ABR: am I wrong in my impression that you would want to be the scum role that would need to survive, the idea that you would be able to get your way, or both?
The former. The latter depends on the rest of the scum.
Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards.
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #103 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 5:41 am

Post by Bingle »

Interesting. Are you aware of why scum you wants me to come to the opposite conclusion?
User avatar
Gamma Emerald
Gamma Emerald
Bigender (He/She)
Survivor
User avatar
User avatar
Gamma Emerald
Bigender (He/She)
Survivor
Survivor
Posts: 63692
Joined: August 9, 2016
Pronoun: Bigender (He/She)

Post Post #104 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:02 am

Post by Gamma Emerald »

Actually is the wombat thing something from a mafia game, or like, a DnD session?
We're falling through space, you and me, clinging to the skin of this tiny little world, and if we let go...That's who I am.

Visit my
new
GTKAS page here!
User avatar
Albert B. Rampage
Albert B. Rampage
Illogical Rampage
User avatar
User avatar
Albert B. Rampage
Illogical Rampage
Illogical Rampage
Posts: 27261
Joined: April 8, 2007
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico

Post Post #105 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:03 am

Post by Albert B. Rampage »

In post 103, Bingle wrote:Interesting. Are you aware of why scum you wants me to come to the opposite conclusion?
???
Guard your honor. Let your reputation fall where it will. And outlive the bastards.
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #106 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:07 am

Post by Bingle »

There's a scum utility to being the top of the list if you wouldn't actually try to be the Voice, but I'll hold off on explaining why until more people weigh in on the question because I think it's an interesting area to develop conversation and reads.
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #107 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:07 am

Post by Bingle »

In post 104, Gamma Emerald wrote:Actually is the wombat thing something from a mafia game, or like, a DnD session?
Check out Pine's sig.
User avatar
PenguinPower
PenguinPower
He/Him
.peng
User avatar
User avatar
PenguinPower
He/Him
.peng
.peng
Posts: 22435
Joined: June 15, 2016
Pronoun: He/Him

Post Post #108 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:08 am

Post by PenguinPower »

In post 104, Gamma Emerald wrote:Actually is the wombat thing something from a mafia game, or like, a DnD session?
Mish Mash interactive story
<(") | (")>
User avatar
Pine
Pine
In Your Head
User avatar
User avatar
Pine
In Your Head
In Your Head
Posts: 16763
Joined: February 27, 2011
Location: Upstate New York

Post Post #109 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 6:31 am

Post by Pine »

Grumble grumble I’ll get it started again soon.
"Cry havoc, and let slip the wombat of war!"

Act 3, Scene 1 of
Julius Caesar
, by W. Shakespeare
User avatar
lilith2013
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
User avatar
User avatar
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
Spice of Life
Posts: 7170
Joined: September 22, 2015
Pronoun: she/her
Location: New York
Contact:

Post Post #110 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:02 am

Post by lilith2013 »

V
OTECOUNT
1.002
P
LAYER
N
AME
C
URRENT
V
OTES
S
TRENGTH
S
PEED
K
NOWLEDGE
P
LAYER
N
AME
Gamma Emerald
None
EL-7
3
3
3
Gamma Emerald
SirCakez
CreativeMod1, Fun and Games, Bingle
EL-4
2
3
3
SirCakez
GeorgeBailey
None
EL-7
3
3
4
GeorgeBailey
CreativeMod1
None
EL-7
3
3
3
CreativeMod1
Albert B. Rampage
None
EL-7
3
3
3
Albert B. Rampage
Pine
None
EL-7
3
3
4
Pine
Bingle
PenguinPower
EL-6
3
3
3
Bingle
Nosferatu
SirCakez
EL-6
3
3
1
Nosferatu
DoctorPepper
Ydrasse
EL-6
3
3
3
DoctorPepper
PenguinPower
Pine, Nosferatu
EL-5
3
3
3
PenguinPower
Fun and Games
DoctorPepper, Albert B. Rampage
EL-5
3
3
3
Fun and Games
Ydrasse
None
EL-7
3
3
3
Ydrasse
beeboy
Gamma Emerald
EL-6
3
3
3
beeboy
Not Voting
GeorgeBailey, beeboy
With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.
Deadline: (expired on 2020-09-27 23:16:10)
Notes:

beeboy is V/LA until Sept 21
User avatar
lilith2013
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
User avatar
User avatar
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
Spice of Life
Posts: 7170
Joined: September 22, 2015
Pronoun: she/her
Location: New York
Contact:

Post Post #111 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:04 am

Post by lilith2013 »

In post 96, Albert B. Rampage wrote:
Mod: If a doctor explores and finds a lab, will that be made public the next day?
Please see the following:
In post 6, lilith2013 wrote:The discovery of permanent Rooms is announced at the beginning of the Day phase, but not by whom they were discovered.
LABS are included in "permanent Rooms."
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #112 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:23 am

Post by Bingle »

@mod, the rules reference hidden permanent rooms that we can interact with at our own risk. Can you confirm whether any of these hidden rooms are potentially labs?
User avatar
lilith2013
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
User avatar
User avatar
lilith2013
she/her
Spice of Life
Spice of Life
Posts: 7170
Joined: September 22, 2015
Pronoun: she/her
Location: New York
Contact:

Post Post #113 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:26 am

Post by lilith2013 »

In post 112, Bingle wrote:
@mod, the rules reference hidden permanent rooms that we can interact with at our own risk. Can you confirm whether any of these hidden rooms are potentially labs?
Any type of room that can be interacted with as a night action (permanent rooms + LABS) can be hidden. Players cannot interact with rooms that have not been discovered.
User avatar
SirCakez
SirCakez
he/him
Is A Lie
User avatar
User avatar
SirCakez
he/him
Is A Lie
Is A Lie
Posts: 24820
Joined: June 18, 2015
Pronoun: he/him

Post Post #114 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:40 am

Post by SirCakez »

In post 90, Bingle wrote:
In post 87, SirCakez wrote:I did read the rules but there's just a lot so I probably forgot some things
VOTE: SirCakez

My previous vote was also serious, but I feel better about this.
Oh do enlighten me
Brian Skies - "
I just wanna say Cakez is an evil mod and this is an evil setup.
"

--------------------
Get to know a Cakez! Newly updated!
User avatar
Fun and Games
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1157
Joined: September 7, 2020

Post Post #115 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 7:49 am

Post by Fun and Games »

In post 86, Bingle wrote:I'd like everyone to talk about whether they would have been the voice or not and why. Note: this is not a list of towniness, but rather an "If they were scum 100%, would they have chosen to be the neverlynch scum."
(Just gonna out this cuz i can tell i'm gonna get frustrated: this is skitter, *waves*)

In many permutations of the pl it's probably me
If there's some combination of like you, abr, pine and me being scum it might be up for debate, but i would also imagine that there would be elaborate distancing shenanigans

I think you're ranking pine too low, bu agree with your assessment of abr. Not sure what you mean by tho

~ games
User avatar
CreativeMod1
CreativeMod1
Operative Excel-lence
User avatar
User avatar
CreativeMod1
Operative Excel-lence
Operative Excel-lence
Posts: 740
Joined: August 14, 2018

Post Post #116 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:02 am

Post by CreativeMod1 »

Lol so much going on, still trying to wrap my head round the whole set up

I explored last night

What is this voice that people are talking about? I may have missed it in the rules?
♪ ♫
I am the one thing in life I can control. I am inimitable, I am an original
♫ ♪
Come play: Codenames! | Taskmaster!
GTKAS!
It's easier to message me on Discord: CreativeMod1#3798
User avatar
Nosferatu
Nosferatu
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Nosferatu
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7726
Joined: June 23, 2015
Location: Geek U.S.A.

Post Post #117 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:13 am

Post by Nosferatu »

In post 74, Fun and Games wrote:
Or like now there's 2 labs. What if 6 people pile on the first one and nobody goes to the second one?

~Games
i call dibs on the eugene lab
BRASIL BRASIL BRASIL BRRRRR
last.fm
gtkas
User avatar
GeorgeBailey
GeorgeBailey
He/Him
GeorgeBailey
User avatar
User avatar
GeorgeBailey
He/Him
GeorgeBailey
GeorgeBailey
Posts: 3400
Joined: September 23, 2019
Pronoun: He/Him
Location: GeorgeBailey
Contact:

Post Post #118 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:07 am

Post by GeorgeBailey »

In post 74, Fun and Games wrote:Like I just dont fully understand what the benefit is to deliberately be secretive about everything
If Doctors know who explored, they know that person has a higher chance of having an item. I really don't think mass claiming night actions is a good idea.
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #119 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:25 am

Post by Bingle »

In post 118, GeorgeBailey wrote:
In post 74, Fun and Games wrote:Like I just dont fully understand what the benefit is to deliberately be secretive about everything
If Doctors know who explored, they know that person has a higher chance of having an item. I really don't think mass claiming night actions is a good idea.
Explored =/= Has an item.
Has an item =/= would be a better scumkill.

There is absolutely no guarantee that an item is positive utility, or that exploring a room doesn't just drop you in a pit trap and do damage.

OTOH, having a rough idea of how often we're going to hit labs is potentially useful as we weigh whether labs need to be focused on. (Individually).
User avatar
Bingle
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
Bingle
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 7704
Joined: July 21, 2019
Location: Bad Player Jail

Post Post #120 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:35 am

Post by Bingle »

In post 115, Fun and Games wrote:(Just gonna out this cuz i can tell i'm gonna get frustrated: this is skitter, *waves*)
Ah. I'd guess that you'd be right above me in the list.

Pine certainly could fulfill the role of scumlord with extra power, sure. He wouldn't though. Pine doesn't like to solo endgame, he likes to set up his team to win after he goes down. Given that option in the pregame, he pretty much always goes for the latter, I think.

And because someone asked: The Voice is one of the scums that makes the secondary scum win con slightly easier to achieve while they're alive. (Functionally, they require one fewer lab to win.) Scum chose which one of them would be the Voice in the pregame. There may or may not be additional benefits or restrictions associated with being the voice.

Admittedly, the assignment of the voice would seem to mean very little in most cases, but I think there's a way we can twist the mechanic to town's advantage, and want to hear people's thoughts on whether or not they (or others) would likely want to be the voice and why, both in pursuit of that and as a way to kick off legitimate scumhunting.
User avatar
GeorgeBailey
GeorgeBailey
He/Him
GeorgeBailey
User avatar
User avatar
GeorgeBailey
He/Him
GeorgeBailey
GeorgeBailey
Posts: 3400
Joined: September 23, 2019
Pronoun: He/Him
Location: GeorgeBailey
Contact:

Post Post #121 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 10:38 am

Post by GeorgeBailey »

In post 119, Bingle wrote:Explored =/= Has an item.
Has an item =/= would be a better scumkill.
Yeah, that's why I said higher chance. Scum doesn't really have a reason to target people who went to a lab. It narrows down night actions for them.

And scum has an additional attack, they can steal and attack for damage.
User avatar
Fun and Games
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1157
Joined: September 7, 2020

Post Post #122 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:09 am

Post by Fun and Games »

I have been thinking about the setup and below are some of my thoughts so far.



I've played similar games where there are rooms etc and one way to find the bad guys is to have a running tally of actions etc.

It seems one way the scum could kill people is by attacking them at night as one of their actions - as room exploration, lab deactivation attacks are not public actions.

In lieu of a standard nightkill, the scum have an anonymous attack - they also could attack somebody directly if they believe they have a good chance of killing them as a dead person is unable to say anything.

They can also use their nightactions to attack a person directly,

For example the entire scum team could attack Bingle and if they succeed in dealing him enough damage - he would not be able to tell us who his attackers were as he is dead.

One way I thought of to deal with this is if we coordinate our night actions on rooms that provide verification.

For example if all of us were to use the gym - all of us would get a speed increase of 1 - scum who would try to do something evil would not get this speed increase and be exposed.


Also @Nosferatu - what happened to your knowledge? Did the scum use their factional ability to reduce it? This would put you very close to dying if I am reading the rules correctly and you should go to the library to fix this.


Also as for mech-speculation - I do not believe it is a priority to destroy the labs currently as our player count is quite high - it would make sense imo to have higher knowledge players destroy labs.

A player with a knowledge score of 3 has only a 10/27 chance of de-activating a lab successfully - and failure would be a wasted action on the part of the town. Also the lower the probability of success is, the easier it is for scum to do something evil and pretend like his night-action was to de-activate a lab when it really was not.


~Fun
User avatar
Fun and Games
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Fun and Games
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 1157
Joined: September 7, 2020

Post Post #123 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:13 am

Post by Fun and Games »

It also seems to me to be a priority to have a player with a very high knowledge stat that can reliably destroy labs now and later when they become activated - an activated lab has only a 1/27 chance of being de-activated by someone with knowledge 3 - but it is much better odds at knowledge 5-6.

This game is unique in that the scum do not have the ability to outright nightkill a player if I am reading the rules correctly - hence if we were to stack a universal town-read with knowledge items, that player could have a very high knowledge stat and do the job of destroying any labs we find. - In fact if I'm reading the rules correctly this would not even require a universal town-read - if for example a player has some innate profession that gives bonus to knowledge - we could stack them with knowledge items and use them to destroy any labs we find.
User avatar
Ydrasse
Ydrasse
*twirls hair*
User avatar
User avatar
Ydrasse
*twirls hair*
*twirls hair*
Posts: 11460
Joined: May 1, 2020

Post Post #124 (ISO) » Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:40 am

Post by Ydrasse »

i'm fine with a running tally of actions personally. i think that holding people to doing certain things/knowing what they did definitely makes it easier. also thanks for doing the numbers on the knowledge score stuff because while i am bad with numbers i agree with that sentiment.

however, i don't know how to feel about stacking a single player? like, say that the doctors decide to attack the stacked person one night; they use the factional attack, and then (presuming all are alive here) all attack the same person. if they're worried that they can't kill that night, they can just use their one-shot to make themselves anonymous and do the same thing tomorrow to kill them off, since at that point i think the odds would lean much more towards the doctors being able to kill whoever was stacked? also, whoever we try to stack up will most likely end up the target of the -1 knowledge loss each night.

it seems safer to me to try and have a more even spread among everyone statwise because we could lose a lot of time/resources by pouring them into one person who we might lose quickly. also, i think that it being a utr would be more beneficial because... well, you trust them. doctors could have a knowledge-based ability that boosts them and we wouldn't be any the wiser until we start investing into them and oh, that's weird, why aren't any of the labs destroyed yet.
warrior cats mafia is now in a queue near you!
- - - -
kill me and live with the memory — then tell the stars that you
won
.
Locked