noraa counter tunneling and omgus'ing you isn't scum!indicative
noraa using the newbie card to get out of jail for free is NAI, because scum!noraa would probably be using that as much as town!noraa
I disagree, but the jury's out on everyone really - I'm not lock-scum on Noraa or anything mad. I think there's going to be high volume posting in this game, so I'm going to take more of a backseat and share my observations later.
In response to Datisi and Menalque calling me arrogant - not actually true, it's mostly just tongue-in-cheek really!
I'm aware my scumhunting record overall is pretty marginal at best, although on my day I can be very good, and am improving with age. I generally do my best work when i don't post so much, however that's also less fun! Also pressuring newbies in non-newbie games is just objectively the right thing to do.
this sequence is funny with BM saying hes gonna take a back seat/break and then immediately BM posted ~10 more times
I'm an addict ok! Are you in the midst of a trolling spree right now? If so, I'll come back and post some serious content later...
TheGoldenParadox/Noraa
piisirrational/Tayl0r Swift
Wow you're a lot fussier than me. Also I will put it on record, I am very impressed with Ico play in this game. I don't recall him being this sensible and constructive in previous games. It's an MVP performance here so far. Not sure what means for alignment though.
I wasn’t under a lot of pressure
Even if I were scum it’s not like I could use that to push you to an elim bc when you flipped it would prove I was lying
this is bad. the fake-claim was bad. the fake claim was only not that bad because it was obviously fake. if this post is genuine its town-indicative because youre upset that your gambit failed. but its far more likely that this post isnt really genuine and you were hoping to get a townie to give you free towncred by fake-claiming a neighborhood. you werent under that much pressure anyway, it was like page 5. i think town!you knows its early game and theres no need to be concerned about a little pressure.
In post 532, TheGoldenParadox wrote:uhh yeah this post scumpings hard wth
this is basically textbook manipulation VOTE: shelly
golden with this opportunistic wagon hopping
im not getting limmed today, you are
I don't quite see what you mean by opportunistic wagon hopping. Golden comes in with a read that he thinks noraa vs bm is actually svs. So at the point of the nora vote he claims to have scum read on both. And then later he says that he sees Nora as newb town. When he moves his vote to the other player he player he scum read at that point.
And his 3rd vote to you. Do you see all the votes as opportunistic or just the one on you. As that's the vote with least progression before it aswell as the one you quoted.
What i dont get is why the first thing you would think of is that he is being opportunistic. Maybe if it had pushed to l-1 or giving intent on that small post. But l-3 does feel like bit of exaggeration when its only pushed you to l-3. A point its sat at for the last day.
Forgetting that you claiming that you beleive the nature of his vot was opportunistic. what do you think of his read on you?
I wasn’t under a lot of pressure
Even if I were scum it’s not like I could use that to push you to an elim bc when you flipped it would prove I was lying
this is bad. the fake-claim was bad. the fake claim was only not that bad because it was obviously fake. if this post is genuine its town-indicative because youre upset that your gambit failed. but its far more likely that this post isnt really genuine and you were hoping to get a townie to give you free towncred by fake-claiming a neighborhood. you werent under that much pressure anyway, it was like page 5. i think town!you knows its early game and theres no need to be concerned about a little pressure.
i agree the fakeclaim was bad, but not sold on your conclusion.
I'd like you to read this post carefully, as I'm going to extend a proverbial olive branch to you, in the knowledge that it's possible you might be town. I'm only doing this once, and to be clear, I'm not doing so to try and make you townread me, nor is this an attempt to judge your alignment. I'm communicating with you 'out of character' to try and be helpful and constructive to your development, as I do when I'm an SE player in a newbie game.
I'm doing so because if you're town, I don't want you to leave this game with the feeling of "damn, that BM was so scummy, it was all his fault, I didn't get any enjoyment or educational value from that experience at all". Even if you're scum, as a new player, it would be preferable if you leave this game having gained some valuable experience and knowledge about expectations of town players.
My head says you're giving off lots of textbook scumtells, and like Ico, I'm slightly biased towards eliminating you early in the knowledge you might be town who distracts from eliminating scum and basically a liability at endgame. My heart says you're probably just town - I had a similar experience with a newbie (in a newbie game) a couple months ago which ended pretty badly, and he ended up being town.
Please therefore take this advice, and it is only my opinion from my own experience, in good faith. You are free to think I'm scum before, during and after, but please actually read this and take on board.
1. You and I have no personal beef. I did put you under significant pressure early in the game, and would not have done so had this been a newbie game. However, because this is a normal game, I treat everyone as having a reasonable level of experience by default. You felt I tunnel-visioned you, but I didn't. I tested you, partly because I felt you were newer and more likely to slip up if you were scum. Is it exploitative? Yes, but outside the road to rome, I've always considered everyone fair-game. You are free to look at other completed games of mine, to see that it's just an approach I use - and I do so regardless of alignment, so it's neither an inherent scumtell or towntell.
2. Pretending to tunnel-vision to put pressure on somebody is often good. Actually tunnel-visioning somebody is bad. However, I can say that even as an experienced veteran, I have tunnel-visioned and normally done very badly as a result. In one large theme game, I single-handedly cost town the game by tunnel-visioning. I don't claim to be the world's best mafia player, but I've played a lot of games over the years, and I try hard to improve. Nowadays I'm much more chilled and try to continually re-evaluate people. It doesn't really matter if I get it right first time, the goal is to get the right answer in the end, and if that means admitting my earlier suspicions were wrong, so be it. On a personal level, if you all you do in a game is attack one player, and that player ends up being town, you've essentially just been a detriment to the town. Giving opinions on other players means you make a bigger contribution to the town wincon. Throwing around terms like "confscum" won't do you any favours in terms of building credibility. Saying things like "I think bm is basically a confscum(at least in my head) which is why imma tunnel some more and hopefully get a good case on him bc I want a bm lim today" is obviously problematic for me, because it's acknowledging that you are focussed on trying to create something to prove yourself right, rather than looking at things objectively, and assuming I'm town in this case and unlikely to actually be lunched, it risks making you a redundant player who is not playing for the town and should be policy-elimmed. If you try to actually solve my slot by asking me questions and engaging with me, you'll find it fruitful and insightful. Otherwise, I'm not motivated to engage because you have already made your mind up.
3. You're right not to just give up, but keep an open mind. When Golden told you to abandon your BM-scumread because nobody else agrees with you, I think you were justified in standing by it. Just because nobody agrees with you, doesn't mean you're wrong, and there are scum in this game who will try to influence you, so having a backbone is a good thing. However, what if you're wrong, and I'm not scum? It's important to keep an open mind because, let's say I flip town - what then? I don't think you will want to go and re-read the whole game again. Also, if I'm town, you focussing only on me means that scum can get away with more, and distracts the rest of the town from doing good work. In other words, the key is striking a balance - suspect people but also keep looking and re-evaluating as you go. People will take you much more seriously if they think you are actively scumhunting, rather than trying to find things to confirm your own presumptions. Additionally, even if you're right about me, you're not gaining anything by trying to elim me today because it won't happen - so if I was scum, you'd be better off trying to pick off my partner(s). Crucially, your job as town is not to "prove yourself correct" but to eliminate scum.
The reality is, as I've already claimed, I'm town in this game. But being wrong about my slot is fine. I just ask kindly that you engage with other things going on and make a wider contribution than just focussing entirely on me, which isn't productive for you or anybody else.
I hope this is helpful, and even if you aren't able to read it in good faith now, it's something you can return to after the game as part of a 'lessons learnt' exercise.
In post 532, TheGoldenParadox wrote:uhh yeah this post scumpings hard wth
this is basically textbook manipulation VOTE: shelly
golden with this opportunistic wagon hopping
im not getting limmed today, you are
I don't quite see what you mean by opportunistic wagon hopping. Golden comes in with a read that he thinks noraa vs bm is actually svs. So at the point of the nora vote he claims to have scum read on both. And then later he says that he sees Nora as newb town. When he moves his vote to the other player he player he scum read at that point.
And his 3rd vote to you. Do you see all the votes as opportunistic or just the one on you. As that's the vote with least progression before it aswell as the one you quoted.
What i dont get is why the first thing you would think of is that he is being opportunistic. Maybe if it had pushed to l-1 or giving intent on that small post. But l-3 does feel like bit of exaggeration when its only pushed you to l-3. A point its sat at for the last day.
Forgetting that you claiming that you beleive the nature of his vot was opportunistic. what do you think of his read on you?
you wanna join me on Golden today, and you pick the flip tomorrow?
In post 532, TheGoldenParadox wrote:uhh yeah this post scumpings hard wth
this is basically textbook manipulation VOTE: shelly
golden with this opportunistic wagon hopping
im not getting limmed today, you are
I don't quite see what you mean by opportunistic wagon hopping. Golden comes in with a read that he thinks noraa vs bm is actually svs. So at the point of the nora vote he claims to have scum read on both. And then later he says that he sees Nora as newb town. When he moves his vote to the other player he player he scum read at that point.
And his 3rd vote to you. Do you see all the votes as opportunistic or just the one on you. As that's the vote with least progression before it aswell as the one you quoted.
What i dont get is why the first thing you would think of is that he is being opportunistic. Maybe if it had pushed to l-1 or giving intent on that small post. But l-3 does feel like bit of exaggeration when its only pushed you to l-3. A point its sat at for the last day.
Forgetting that you claiming that you beleive the nature of his vot was opportunistic. what do you think of his read on you?
you wanna join me on Golden today, and you pick the flip tomorrow?
In post 532, TheGoldenParadox wrote:uhh yeah this post scumpings hard wth
this is basically textbook manipulation VOTE: shelly
golden with this opportunistic wagon hopping
im not getting limmed today, you are
I don't quite see what you mean by opportunistic wagon hopping. Golden comes in with a read that he thinks noraa vs bm is actually svs. So at the point of the nora vote he claims to have scum read on both. And then later he says that he sees Nora as newb town. When he moves his vote to the other player he player he scum read at that point.
And his 3rd vote to you. Do you see all the votes as opportunistic or just the one on you. As that's the vote with least progression before it aswell as the one you quoted.
What i dont get is why the first thing you would think of is that he is being opportunistic. Maybe if it had pushed to l-1 or giving intent on that small post. But l-3 does feel like bit of exaggeration when its only pushed you to l-3. A point its sat at for the last day.
Forgetting that you claiming that you beleive the nature of his vot was opportunistic. what do you think of his read on you?
you wanna join me on Golden today, and you pick the flip tomorrow?
My gut keeps telling me that he is town. He does feel opportunistic as he keeps jumping into the most high profile points of a wagon. With the only higher bits being l-1 and hammer
He came in without rvs and rushed into with a 4th slot vote that pushed noraa to l-3. Although little reasoning behind it at the time with 30 mins he had elaborated on his reasoning. I don't get if he was scum why there would be such a delay. Surely if he was scum he would have made them together. As it's not like he was near the prod time. If he was scum and he needed time to come up with a reason for his read. Wouldn't he have just posted the vote 30 mins later instead. Feels to me like hasty town.
In post 532, TheGoldenParadox wrote:uhh yeah this post scumpings hard wth
this is basically textbook manipulation VOTE: shelly
golden with this opportunistic wagon hopping
im not getting limmed today, you are
I don't quite see what you mean by opportunistic wagon hopping. Golden comes in with a read that he thinks noraa vs bm is actually svs. So at the point of the nora vote he claims to have scum read on both. And then later he says that he sees Nora as newb town. When he moves his vote to the other player he player he scum read at that point.
And his 3rd vote to you. Do you see all the votes as opportunistic or just the one on you. As that's the vote with least progression before it aswell as the one you quoted.
What i dont get is why the first thing you would think of is that he is being opportunistic. Maybe if it had pushed to l-1 or giving intent on that small post. But l-3 does feel like bit of exaggeration when its only pushed you to l-3. A point its sat at for the last day.
Forgetting that you claiming that you beleive the nature of his vot was opportunistic. what do you think of his read on you?
you wanna join me on Golden today, and you pick the flip tomorrow?
My gut keeps telling me that he is town. He does feel opportunistic as he keeps jumping into the most high profile points of a wagon. With the only higher bits being l-1 and hammer
He came in without rvs and rushed into with a 4th slot vote that pushed noraa to l-3. Although little reasoning behind it at the time with 30 mins he had elaborated on his reasoning. I don't get if he was scum why there would be such a delay. Surely if he was scum he would have made them together. As it's not like he was near the prod time. If he was scum and he needed time to come up with a reason for his read. Wouldn't he have just posted the vote 30 mins later instead. Feels to me like hasty town.
An interesting point, I like it, but it's not enough to dissuade me.
30 pages into a mini game, but having fewer posts than the Mod.
I'm sorry, I couldn't help myself!
Almost every game on this site that I remember playing has been under 100 pages total, with many under 50. I guess site meta has really shifted towards ridiculous post counts recently, or maybe it's just this PL? Anyways, I don't tend to post too much, but you can't disagree that I've posted substantive material, so I don't think noting my post count is really helpful here.
30 pages into a mini game, but having fewer posts than the Mod.
I'm sorry, I couldn't help myself!
Almost every game on this site that I remember playing has been under 100 pages total, with many under 50. I guess site meta has really shifted towards ridiculous post counts recently, or maybe it's just this PL? Anyways, I don't tend to post too much, but you can't disagree that I've posted substantive material, so I don't think noting my post count is really helpful here.
you're telling me! back in my day, 20 pages would be plenty!
I have no idea why you're trying to make a case that my post 839 was meant as a serious one, but I suspect it might take you another 50-100 pages to do so!
The place i first started playing mafia you would get some players that would posts once or twice a week. There would be that little that the days often got extended by an extra 14 days. Making a day last 30 days.
30 pages into a mini game, but having fewer posts than the Mod.
I'm sorry, I couldn't help myself!
Almost every game on this site that I remember playing has been under 100 pages total, with many under 50. I guess site meta has really shifted towards ridiculous post counts recently, or maybe it's just this PL? Anyways, I don't tend to post too much, but you can't disagree that I've posted substantive material, so I don't think noting my post count is really helpful here.
you're telling me! back in my day, 20 pages would be plenty!
I have no idea why you're trying to make a case that my post 839 was meant as a serious one, but I suspect it might take you another 50-100 pages to do so!
nah ahaha, didn't take it as serious, just making that note - we really have devolved to hyperposting, haven't we? oh well, at least it means more content, but a lot more garbage to sort through
