Mini Theme 2161: Undertale C Open - Chara's Folly

[Nachomamma8]

Could you both tell me what you think of my Pooky-case? I think it's him, but if not, probably Lavender. Also, I should really read why Prism so strongly though it was Chara and get back to you.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12194871

Pedit: Hello again!

While I'm working on it, why do you think Pooky opted not to kill N2?

[Hectic]

HURT: Lavender

Scumteam had a weird strategy going into this. Elements and Puppy tried for a mutual bus to give Puppy the credit to get spared the next day, but seemed to only half-do it. If Puppy had a strong scumpartner (aka any of the players with a big ol' chunk of posts this game), I don't think it unfolds the way it does - they would be encouraged to either press it harder or drop it completely. Catboi kill N1 was silly; as Pooky pointed out, catboi was a high town read but most certainly not unmislynchable like many others that are still alive.

Really? That's not the impression I get at all. Launchy (what I call Puppy) looked to be distancing because he knew he was out of the game at the end of the day (on a town FIGHT), since he moved off Ele and tried pushing me instead, and then only revoted upon realising Ele/beeboy was actually gonna happen.

It's not Tanner because of early Puppy/him interactions. It's not Prism because hyperposting. It's not Pooky because I think Pooky makes an effort to make a bigger splash play centering around the Chara role, and I don't think Pooky hangs out on Hectic the day after the Taylor Swift lynch. It's not Hectic because my heart tells me it's not Hectic.

The things that strongly point me towards Lavender are the early townread on Puppy, which I think happened because Elements said in the scum PT that the strategy was to get Puppy cred then get him spared the next day. I don't think town!Lavender's only read that they express any significant amount of attachment to is a townread on the "if town spares here they lose" guy.

No flipped scum made a run at Lavender, which is kind of crazy when they are the definition on low hanging fruit - whenever beeboy or Puppy mentioned them, it was always attached in a group with other lurkers.

And finally, there's no one else who would have forgotten to submit the N2 kill. There's no reason to pass up on a kill in that situation when it's a kill you very desperately need to silence some town voices.

[Hectic]

Could you both tell me what you think of my Pooky-case? I think it's him, but if not, probably Lavender. Also, I should really read why Prism so strongly though it was Chara and get back to you.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12194871

Pedit: Hello again!

While I'm working on it, why do you think Pooky opted not to kill N2?

I don't know, you could argue he's more likely to "meme" by no-killing than anyone else, but it's still very illogical. However, a no kill doesn't make sense for any player in this game. So, the only solution is to ignore it ever happened and play normally, or to assume scum forgot to kill, which implies Lavender or your slot, since Chara's activity was very intermittent and Prism mentioned something about Chara being away from the game for the period of time the night phase occured.

[Alisae]

/me waves

hi!

come vote with me!

Read your thing
It works for me
HURT: lavender

[Hectic]

y'all are boring.

puppy's early game seems pretty Tanner-centric for someone who knows he's dying soon so I doubt Tanner is scum here. Why are people clearing lavender?

People are clearing Lavender because of this:

HURT: Taylor
Okay I’m going back to sleep now

Town were 2 hours away from instalosing due to a clause in the rules which allow scum to pick who gets SPARED if town hit deadline without majority. Lavender came on and saved the day.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

ugh prism too

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Welcome Alisae! ヽ(>∀<☆)ノ

[Hectic]

I thought Prism/Nacho were cool after the scum collusion in the hydra minigame game. Feelsbad.

[Hectic]

[Nachomamma8]

This is the first scum-indicative thing I saw. At the time, I found the reasoning here very strange, I think I mentioned it then at some point as well, but basically, it smells of scum!Pooky distancing with Ele, but the reasoning he's provided is just not believable. It's very unrealistic and surface level to assume that scum!Ele is trying to "sneak" himself into the middle of some SPARES because he's Chara trying to ascend. Pooky also for whatever reason is implying puttimg himself in the middle somehow makes it more sneaky, like Ele has put forth a plan of days 1 to 3 SPARES. The read just makes no sense, and it's because scum!Pooky is using it as an excuse to distance some with his partner.

I agree with your criticism that the point is not great. But I don't understand how "attacking someone with poor logic" leads you to "scum distancing". Why would Pooky want to distance with Elements at that point? It's usually not hard to find reasons to attack a scum partner (since you know they are scum already), but usually bad distancing happens when people force it - why would Pooky, a very crafty teddy bear, force it?

Elements did basically put forward a spare plan for the next three days. I understand Pooky's point about him putting himself in the middle but not at the end (so he looks like he's willing to spare someone else, but he's also not putting himself as the last person to be spared. I understand your criticism here, again, but disagree that bad logic = scum.

[Alisae]

161 likely means nacho town
234 probably means tanner town.
535 this probably means tanner town and pooky town
900 Trying to move someone from lav to taylor
1489 Krazy probably town
1934 this is interesting because he never goes for lavender.
2224 Yeah he puts a bit of pressure on the slot and backs off.
2379 tanner really seems town tbh

[Nachomamma8]

y'all are boring.

puppy's early game seems pretty Tanner-centric for someone who knows he's dying soon so I doubt Tanner is scum here. Why are people clearing lavender?

People are clearing Lavender because of this:

HURT: Taylor
Okay I’m going back to sleep now

Town were 2 hours away from instalosing due to a clause in the rules which allow scum to pick who gets SPARED if town hit deadline without majority. Lavender came on and saved the day.

oh.

well that's a big ol' debbie downer.

i still believe that lavender is the last baddie who simply didn't want to win in such a sad, soul-crushing way but acknowledge that things are no longer the slam dunk i thought they were.

tanner's also SUPATOWN.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Hectic is Piergeiron the Paladinson your alt? Because that would explain the Backrooms nonsense.

[Nachomamma8]

Alright, then we have this. This also pinged me at the time, but I couldn't really put my finger on one of the reasons for why until overnight. The post is worded in a very strange way, he's not talking to Ele directly, he's not just going straight into his thoughts with a "I find this hilarious because", he's starts with a "This is just a hilarious read from". I know some of you won't like this kind of read, but unnatural wording when talking about scum partners is a serious scumtell, because here, it looks like Pooky is presenting the read to an audience, like this is for all intents and purposes how it'll be viewed by others - which it is.

Okay, the other reason it's scummy is because Pooky does more tinfoil/weird reasoning to shade Ele for it. He assumes Ele is forming a team solve with the two scum exactly being Tanner/Launchy, and the Chara being Pooky. There is nothing to suggest Ele is putting forth a team solve with those being partnered, for all we know they could be individual reads - which is what I assumed at the time. Instead, Pooky focuses heavily on how Pooky/Chara/Puppy is ridiculous. It's more TMI-esque distancing.

This is a reach.

Most people present their scumreads as opposed to talk to them - you're trying to convince other people to kill the bad guy, not convince the bad guy that he himself is bad - same thing you did with this case, same thing I did when I talked about Lavender. I also think that it's reasonable to assume that Elements putting forward three scumreads when there's a three person scumteam is Elements putting forward a potential solve; your perception of it is also valid, but calling it TMI-esque distancing because he came at it with a different angle than you did is bad.

[Nachomamma8]

Hectic is Piergeiron the Paladinson your alt? Because that would explain the Backrooms nonsense.

hectic is a good honest kid
care to join me on lav or krazy but probably lav?

[Alisae]

y'all are boring.

puppy's early game seems pretty Tanner-centric for someone who knows he's dying soon so I doubt Tanner is scum here. Why are people clearing lavender?

People are clearing Lavender because of this:

HURT: Taylor
Okay I’m going back to sleep now

Town were 2 hours away from instalosing due to a clause in the rules which allow scum to pick who gets SPARED if town hit deadline without majority. Lavender came on and saved the day.

tbh I don't think this clears Lavender when Lavender was being told that they'll be locktown if they vote there. Sure Lavender can wait around for like 2 hours but its too risky. If town shows up and votes Taylor then they're screwed and anything can happen within 2 hours.

[Alisae]

Hectic is Piergeiron the Paladinson your alt? Because that would explain the Backrooms nonsense.

hectic is a good honest kid
care to join me on lav or krazy but probably lav?

Why Krazy?
I feel like Krazy is in his townrange given a quick glance at is iso

[Hectic]

Hectic is Piergeiron the Paladinson your alt? Because that would explain the Backrooms nonsense.

I was Grumpy Cat, I thought you knew +_+

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

don't you have like 10 alts

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

are you Piergeiron?

[Hectic]

Nah, it's like 2 or 3 max

[Hectic]

are you Piergeiron?

No

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I'm legit kinda sad now that you're not very good at reading Town!Pooky

[Hectic]

If you doubt me, check the playerlist here:

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=84250

Pedit: I lost so much confidence by just seeing this post, you have no idea

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

it's ok one day you will know my heart.