Mini Theme 2164: Betrayal Mafia I (Game over!)

[lilith2013]

V OTECOUNT 3.036
P LAYER N AME	C URRENT V OTES		S TRENGTH	S PEED	K NOWLEDGE	P LAYER N AME
Gamma Emerald	None	EL-6	2	1	6	Gamma Emerald
SirCakez	None	EL-6	2	3	3	SirCakez
CreativeMod1	None	EL-6	3	4	3	CreativeMod1
Albert B. Rampage	I Keep Siteflaking	EL-5	3	3	3	Albert B. Rampage
LavarManos	None	EL-6	3	3	4	LavarManos
DkKoba	None	EL-6	3	3	3	DkKoba
I Keep Siteflaking	DkKoba	EL-5	3	3	3	I Keep Siteflaking
PenguinPower	None	EL-6	3	3	3	PenguinPower
Fun and Games	Albert B. Rampage, CreativeMod1, Noraa, JohnnyFarrar	EL-2	3	3	3	Fun and Games
Noraa	Fun and Games	EL-5	3	4	3	Noraa
JohnnyFarrar	None	EL-6	3	3	6	JohnnyFarrar
Not Voting	Gamma Emerald, SirCakez, LavarManos, PenguinPower
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate. Deadline: (expired on 2020-10-27 16:13:10)
Notes: JohnnyFarrar is V/LA until Oct 21 pagetops: Lilith 55 | penguin 18 | ABR 11 | dk 6 | iks 6 | gamma 4 | noraa 4 | johnnyf 3 | cm1 2 | fun & games 2 | nosferatu 2 | cakez 2 | gb 1 | bingle 1 | lavar 1

[Gamma Emerald]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=68775
Here's the game that makes me feel like early plans help scum more than town. Read it yourself, because I'm tired of having to explain everything.

[DkKoba]

Labs dont count scum players
Only town players. Thats why they are OP.

[DkKoba]

not OP but strong as fuck

[Gamma Emerald]

labs are rather ineffective as a win condition if town are good about getting rid of them, to the point where the only conceivable points where they'd matter would be at 2 or 3 townies left

[DkKoba]

Lol i read that game to get meta on some1 in that game i believe. But seriously its still not a scumtell ?

[Gamma Emerald]

The fact F&G was angling so hard to out info early like they were is scummy, because it's aiming to set up a scenario like the one that existed in that game.

[PenguinPower]

Does anyone have something that ensures a better chance to survive an attack than what their stats indicate? I might be able to construct a plan if I get a yes to this.

Such as? I'm not sure what you mean by this.

[DkKoba]

every lab thats up equals 1 less ML. Theyre also nightkills that dont need to reduce the limpool. We've done good so far but we blew resources on the most recent one.
Im still not buying that fng is scum but if skitterz doesnt come thru with some good analysis on each slot since i heard they are some sort of -really good- player in another game im not gonna fight against their lim anymore.

[Gamma Emerald]

Such as the thing IKS claimed to have that provides +2 to defense rolls

[DkKoba]

gamma are u just talking about the actions ppl took and trying to get ppl to only visit certain places?

[Gamma Emerald]

We've done good so far but we blew resources on the most recent one.

How???

[DkKoba]

You'd have a good argument if they were trying to suss out abilities and items early on but i didnt see that on my skim thru

[PenguinPower]

Also, if Penguin bluffed about giving gamma his sword - now it is good time to reveal it.

This is like the third or fourth time...

Also how was attempting to destroy a lab when two much more capable people were going to do it a "fun and cool option"? Seems more likely you just put out a fake action claim to hide whatever you actually did because you're scum

I want to vote F&G but I should give whatever PP did a chance to become clear

It won’t become clear today, so don’t wait if that’s what you are waiting on.

[Gamma Emerald]

gamma are u just talking about the actions ppl took and trying to get ppl to only visit certain places?

Yeah that was a thing I wasn't actually strongly remembering until you brought it up
With the fact a roomblock is now known to exist trying to put people towards X room is a kinda shady thing to suggest
The issue is I don't particularly remember anyone trying to advocate that sort of thing until D2, which was after the roomblock was sussed out.

[PenguinPower]

yo let's not forget about Penguin kinda seems like he's giving up

?

I'm not leading the charge on everything but not sure where you get me giving up?

[Gamma Emerald]

Didn't Cakez or someone else spout that same nonsense on PP D2

[Fun and Games]

Im still not buying that fng is scum but if skitterz doesnt come thru with some good analysis on each slot since i heard they are some sort of -really good- player in another game im not gonna fight against their lim anymore.

what are you looking for from me?

[PenguinPower]

Such as the thing IKS claimed to have that provides +2 to defense rolls

Ah - I think I do. Let me confirm.

[Fun and Games]

no, that's my role/career

[PenguinPower]

Didn't Cakez or someone else spout that same nonsense on PP D2

yeah - cakeman and abr because I was vla

[SirCakez]

yo let's not forget about Penguin kinda seems like he's giving up

?

I'm not leading the charge on everything but not sure where you get me giving up?

oh I didn't realize you were V/LA
you kinda disappeared from the game and that's what I was reading off of

[I Keep Siteflaking]

no, that's my role/career

Damn it.
My genial plan of deflecting Noraa's attempt to murder me by answering that question asking about your carrier almost worked.

[Gamma Emerald]

I see I have somehow completely missed the existence of the dawn phase - I am quite bad at reading rules.

Should we mass-claim what we did last night and our motivations behind our actions?

I think everyone should claim what they chose to do last night, or at the very least if they chose to explore or not

VOTE: SirCakez

~ Games

How does this

not

try to fish out abilities and items? Especially asking who explored, as exploring is generally how one finds items.

I have been thinking about the setup and below are some of my thoughts so far.



I've played similar games where there are rooms etc and one way to find the bad guys is to have a running tally of actions etc.

It seems one way the scum could kill people is by attacking them at night as one of their actions - as room exploration, lab deactivation attacks are not public actions.

In lieu of a standard nightkill, the scum have an anonymous attack - they also could attack somebody directly if they believe they have a good chance of killing them as a dead person is unable to say anything.

They can also use their nightactions to attack a person directly,

For example the entire scum team could attack Bingle and if they succeed in dealing him enough damage - he would not be able to tell us who his attackers were as he is dead.

One way I thought of to deal with this is if we coordinate our night actions on rooms that provide verification.

For example if all of us were to use the gym - all of us would get a speed increase of 1 - scum who would try to do something evil would not get this speed increase and be exposed.


Also @Nosferatu - what happened to your knowledge? Did the scum use their factional ability to reduce it? This would put you very close to dying if I am reading the rules correctly and you should go to the library to fix this.


Also as for mech-speculation - I do not believe it is a priority to destroy the labs currently as our player count is quite high - it would make sense imo to have higher knowledge players destroy labs.

A player with a knowledge score of 3 has only a 10/27 chance of de-activating a lab successfully - and failure would be a wasted action on the part of the town. Also the lower the probability of success is, the easier it is for scum to do something evil and pretend like his night-action was to de-activate a lab when it really was not.


~Fun

however, i don't know how to feel about stacking a single player? like, say that the doctors decide to attack the stacked person one night; they use the factional attack, and then (presuming all are alive here) all attack the same person. if they're worried that they can't kill that night, they can just use their one-shot to make themselves anonymous and do the same thing tomorrow to kill them off, since at that point i think the odds would lean much more towards the doctors being able to kill whoever was stacked? also, whoever we try to stack up will most likely end up the target of the -1 knowledge loss each night.

This is a great point and I love the way you think about this from a risk-perspective. I will discuss with my better half about whether to town-slot you as she is much better at this game than I am.

The way I thought about the risk is - the mafia do not really have the freedom to use all their attacks on someone as long as there is a public room with stat modification and speed is low.

What I mean by this is - if say all players only had one action and we decided to have 11 players go to the library to study and 1 super knowledge item stacked player go disarm a lab. The mafia cannot deviate and attack the stacked player instead of going to study because then their stats will not increase the next day. Also the stack played would presumably have some kind of item that boosts his defense so that it would be riskier for the mafia to risk unveiling themselves just to attack them.

As far as I understand the rules - even if we were to stack a player - the items would not be "lost" per se if the player were to die - we can loot their corpse and stack another player so the risk is not that great.

The primary reason I like stacking is because it's much more effective to have 1 player with knowledge 5 or 6 attacking a lab rather than 5 players with knowledge 3 - the odds are just much much better. Also having multiple players attacking a lab gives mafia room to do bad things and lie about it as the probability of failure is reasonably high. Whereas if a stacked player with knowledge 5 failed to blow up a lab - it is much less likely.

So it turns out F&G didn't really hard push anything regarding everyone using the same room, but they did try to make it sound like a good mechanical option. Again I really feel like the secret knowledge scum had of their roomblock made them want to try to mislead the town into thinking this was a good idea.

[PenguinPower]

yo let's not forget about Penguin kinda seems like he's giving up

?

I'm not leading the charge on everything but not sure where you get me giving up?

oh I didn't realize you were V/LA
you kinda disappeared from the game and that's what I was reading off of

I think it's more that noraa and dk joined the game and everything else is kinda lost in their posting.