Death Curse

[UNOwen]

Yo Bell, why are you voting shelly?

(Also I missed that you actually followed up on the reference yesterday, yes it is a pretty cool pun)

[Vaxkiller]

Quick question, once someone gets the scroll, I HOPE were still going to all vote (even if its unofficial) for the next person to get it.

It really only seems more advantageous for the scum to not talk and just kill someone.

Or is the game paused when the scroll is handed out?

[shellyc]

I liked that reads list but I reread UNO's ISO and it feeeeeeels like bussing imo

like the points where UNO basically just headlines that "I've been SRing Noraa! Give me TOWNCRED!" doesn't sit right with me at all

[Hopkirk]

LLD is town, but I've noticed that essentially none of her posts can be reduced down to 'gr I'm angry' rather than any meaningful content.

hectic is a rather boring mod

don't modkill me

an investigative mindset leans town though, it's not making something out of nothing, it's quite clearly a solving mindset

Right but if Noraa is correct that she did not mention setup in discord, does that make her more likely to be town?
It doesn't seem like a useful line of inquiry, because I already presumed she had not mentioned setup.

Upsides
IF Nora town - full picture of the situation reduces odds of misunderstanding
IF Nora scum - they can easily get caught out in a direct lie here
Either way - any interaction with Noraa helps inform our reads on the slot.
No downsides

I want to do Noraa because Noraa has CLAIMED SHE WILL HAND TO ADORABLE.

incorrect. I said there were two possibilities and I will not be forced to choose one. I will choose for myself. Don't worry stop screaming I think ur a town that's way over your head. I suggest you tone it down otherwise its gonna look really nasty tomorrow after a green flip on my end.

I really don't understand how LL's mental image of Noraa would be 'Someone who'll do something they said earlier on, definitely not changing their mind or being annoyed with the game at all since then, definitely not chaotic or emotional as a player'.

[UNOwen]

scum do not have a nightkill

the only way to get a nightkill is to sacrifice one of their members
thus in here they will have to give more effort to shade consensus TRs so they can miselim them at some point

I know, that is why it is "night kill" instead of night kill. What I mean is a scum directed kill, which they can do if we catch scum first or second and they feel no pressure to remain pretending.

[shellyc]

Quick question, once someone gets the scroll, I HOPE were still going to all vote (even if its unofficial) for the next person to get it.

It really only seems more advantageous for the scum to not talk and just kill someone.

Or is the game paused when the scroll is handed out?

no, leashing is bad because that hands some control to scum if the scroll in town hands

[shellyc]

I know, that is why it is "night kill" instead of night kill. What I mean is a scum directed kill, which they can do if we catch scum first or second and they feel no pressure to remain pretending.

yeah

so I was referring to shady/discrediting reads towards consensus TRs
I found you

[shellyc]

Yo Bell, why are you voting shelly?

because I'm scum reading Bell hard (and still am)
UNO take a look at Bell's ISO tell me what you think

[shellyc]

wait I asked you about this already and you said rl issues and don't want to read them

still I wanna tell you that bell is in essence omgussing here

[UNOwen]

yeah

so I was referring to shady/discrediting reads towards consensus TRs
I found you

Oh right I thought you were replying to my post. Nevermind.

[MURDERCAT]

Quick question, once someone gets the scroll, I HOPE were still going to all vote (even if its unofficial) for the next person to get it.

It really only seems more advantageous for the scum to not talk and just kill someone.

We will talk but ultimately it is up to the person otherwise scum can potentially have too much influence

[shellyc]

idk I feel UNO is a player who I cant reeeeally get a grip on

there are posts shading Pooky (who I TR)
there are bussing Noraa posts in that iso

I think town!UNO has that "wow" factor from what I've seen of them and I haven't got that yet

[shellyc]

town!UNO is proactiveness, a genuine spiritual interest in solving snd I don't get that *yet*

but at the same time UNO doesn't really townspew early on

I might be rambling here but tl;dr UNO's in the red zone

[Vaxkiller]

Quick question, once someone gets the scroll, I HOPE were still going to all vote (even if its unofficial) for the next person to get it.

It really only seems more advantageous for the scum to not talk and just kill someone.

Or is the game paused when the scroll is handed out?

no, leashing is bad because that hands some control to scum if the scroll in town hands

Hmmm, I was thinking more along the lines of we get scum, they will do everything in their power to NOT kill another scum, we could get soem good intel from that. I would at LEAST prefer no hipshots and a good reads lists.

[Nero Cain]

¶

Votecount 1.6

[5] Noraa:

UNOwen, Hopkirk, Adorable, Toogeloo, MURDERCAT

[3] Hopkirk:

Lady Lambdadelta, PookyTheMagicalBear, Vaxkiller

[2] shellyc:

VaultDweller, Bell

[2] Bell:

Lapsa, shellyc

[1] Tayl0r Swift:

Theta Alpine

[1] Adorable:

Noraa

[1] PookyTheMagicalBear

Tayl0r Swift

[5] Not Voting:

Gloria Cleary, MUSHSHAGANA, Fidget, Zdenek, Flea The Magician

With 20 alive, it takes 11 to curse someone with the scroll. If there is no majority by the deadline, the mafia will choose who to curse.

The cursing deadline is in (expired on 2020-10-28 03:35:35).

Joint moderator ISO.

[UNOwen]

idk I feel UNO is a player who I cant reeeeally get a grip on

there are posts shading Pooky (who I TR)
there are bussing Noraa posts in that iso

I think town!UNO has that "wow" factor from what I've seen of them and I haven't got that yet

Is an awesome and probably undeserved description of my play. Do not worry, I have faith you will change your mind eventually.
I feel you are misreading my reply to MUSH if you think I was attempting to claim credit or whatever though, I was just joking about the fact that my ISO at that point was indeed lazy.

[shellyc]

Hmmm, I was thinking more along the lines of we get scum, they will do everything in their power to NOT kill another scum, we could get soem good intel from that. I would at LEAST prefer no hipshots and a good reads lists.

why wouldn't scum just insta-kill a townie then to limit discussion

[shellyc]

I feel you are misreading my reply to MUSH if you think I was attempting to claim credit or whatever though, I was just joking about the fact that my ISO at that point was indeed lazy.

hmmmmmmm

oh and I also have a terrible sense of humour

so yeah. uno is in red zone. but less so. I think 1415 comes from town more than scum. a defiant tone towards someone who is wrongly scum reading you is hard to fake as scum, because scum know the person pushing them is being correct

[Vaxkiller]

LLD is town, but I've noticed that essentially none of her posts can be reduced down to 'gr I'm angry' rather than any meaningful content.

That's pretty much how I read LLD in a nutshell.

NUT(How I read LLD)SHELL

I'll be here all day folks.

[UNOwen]

Upsides
IF Nora town - full picture of the situation reduces odds of misunderstanding
IF Nora scum - they can easily get caught out in a direct lie here
Either way - any interaction with Noraa helps inform our reads on the slot.
No downsides

Did you feel there was a misunderstanding from either Noraa or LLD?

[Vaxkiller]

UNVOTE: hopkirk

[Vaxkiller]

I make my own decisions.

[shellyc]

vax entrance was rather consensus-y not sure if I like that + their pred was the null isis

Idk I feel like there are scum in the lurker zone given how much I TR much of the rather active players

now gunna reread pooky-taylor

[Hopkirk]

I asked how many scums there are. If I was scum, I would literally just be like ok so with 4 scums here, blah blah blah. Do you really think that's not a more convincing town slip?

I don't follow. Are you saying that as town you wouldn't read the OP, but as scum (you still wouldn't read the OP but) would know how many scum there were and not ask the question that town you always would?
I don't get the logic unless you're saying you plan to use trust tells in a really dumb way that hurts your win rate more than it helps it.

Give me shit to work with so if you DO flip town, it's information for us.

then give noraa the chance to do it by taking the pressure off of her and starting a wagon on someone else

if noraa is town this gives her the chance to contribute without feeling pressured to defend herself
if noraa is scum she is going to die today regardless

and it gives us the chance to get more interactions with a wagon on someone who is not already doomed

Bad post

Sometimes, as town, you just have to eat a death. This includes a miselim. Even on D1. By fighting it so hard you make yourself look worse Noraa.

I'm 50/50 on whether you are purposefully doing it as scum because you want to avoid real conversations or if you are just playing to live instead of playing the optimal way to win as town.

But we have to eliminate you because there's too many SRs. So if are town please work with us now.

This is really bad phrasing. The last part feels like a lamist mediator talking words and ignoring why Noraa isn't working with us. Like if Noraa is town here in what world does she respond positiviely to 'work with us' and nothing else? In worlds of scum Noraa it doesn't matter sure, but if you care about the say 10% chance town Noraa (guessing your priors here) then this is a spaghetti weak appeal with only limpyness behind it.

The best timeline here is Noraa town passes to scum LLD and is lauded for the big brain play

This doesn't happen because scum LL pushing town Noraa this far would give odds Noraa rage shoots LL much higher than any town benefits they'd get out of it imo.

My reasons:

Considering she can push this hard, she is 100% a threat to town. I did mess up some but I don't believe at all that she's willing to reconsider even for a second. She is way over herself and squashes all other opinions. I will bring her down with me to prevent town from having this absolute domineering player that is, as far as I'm concerned, pushing in 100% the WRONG places. She is not helping town and is so fucking frustrating to work with. I do not think town benefits from her reads and presence AT ALL. Perhaps this is hypocritical coming from me considering my playstyle also sucks ass but I mean in the end, its beneficial for town cuz we get basically two policy lims.

My problem is that scum-you threatens to shoot a strong townread here in an attempt to try and get us to say 'let's hit Noraa with the third shot instead of first'. It's essentially light blackmail, and it's a bad look for you either way.

I think you're really overestimating LL's voice in the game btw. To me she's literally just sorted noise that I've chucked in the townbin and don't really care about. If you're town then how about literally not responding to, reading, or commenting on anything else LL says today, accepting she's probably town, and trying to find some more townreads. Imo, townblocking+POE is the best D1 strat. Good odds for the POE shoots beat out good scumreads unless there's a major skill disparity btw scum/town.

Atm I can't see any serious townreads from you or any attempt to look at your wagon. Sure, you could be 'legitimately annoyed', but can you also see why we'd all have a problem with that response since scum you really doesn't want to give out associative here, while town you has incentive to be trying to engage outside the black hole LL essentially is to you?

[Vaxkiller]

LLD is town, but I've noticed that essentially none of her posts can be reduced down to 'gr I'm angry' rather than any meaningful content.

That's pretty much how I read LLD in a nutshell.

NUT(How I read LLD)SHELL

I'll be here all day folks.

I take this back. LLD hasnt really been pushed enough for me to get the best read on her.

Is LLD's main argument with hopkirk is that he tends to agree with her?