Mini Normal 2173 | Bending | Game Over

[Almost50]

Baltar's posts on page 15 -albeit more theory than scum hunting- do not see to come from scum ever. I explicitly TR this slot.

[Andresvmb]

^TR’ing Tayl0r*

I am not good at picking up when arguments are TvT. I am starting to think that this is one of those cases. I TR Tayl0r strongly because I felt we agreed on the basic view of the game. I think we still do. I’m waiting on flips and additional information to solidify that view, but I think we’re in somewhat of a similar place. I think VPB is doing one of two things: either he’s fighting some of these things because it’ll put Scum in a worse position after (as Scum), or because he genuinely disagrees. There are certain positions he could stake out not to stick out as much. He doesn’t strike me as doing much of that.

[Infinity 324]

What exactly are you referring to, the discussion about me/taylor not being TvT?

[Andresvmb]

I am okay with my vote on Infinity for now, really. There’s too much complaining about how people started SR’ing them too late into D1 too which as an argument makes no sense. Sometimes you go back and catch things you missed the first time.

[Andresvmb]

What exactly are you referring to, the discussion about me/taylor not being TvT?

No, the discussion between Tayl0r and VPB.

[VP Baltar]

At a pragmatic level, if there are things I could tweak to make my posts more digestible please let me know

It's cool. I used to post like you tbh. It can be helpful for some people to see big walls.

I'm just a bit older now and I tend to like shorter posts that make concise points. You do you. I'm not going to fault you for your own style and whatever type of posting is most helpful for you

[Andresvmb]

What exactly are you referring to, the discussion about me/taylor not being TvT?

No, the discussion between Tayl0r and VPB.

To clarify, I’m saying that their argument

is

TvT. Or that at first glance it feels that way to me.

[VP Baltar]

Chat shit, get banged,

Legit loled. Drunk Mark is where it is at

[Infinity 324]

I am okay with my vote on Infinity for now, really. There’s too much complaining about how people started SR’ing them too late into D1 too which as an argument makes no sense. Sometimes you go back and catch things you missed the first time.

It was such an obvious point though. I haven't had strong scumreads the whole game, and had voiced it multiple times, but they only thought it was scummy once momentum started building.

[Infinity 324]

What exactly are you referring to, the discussion about me/taylor not being TvT?

No, the discussion between Tayl0r and VPB.

To clarify, I’m saying that their argument

is

TvT. Or that at first glance it feels that way to me.

I could see this, I think VP is ok just "compromising" on me (like koba) and doesn't lose much as scum with the vote on taylor. Since he has a lot of influence over the game, he isn't afraid to stick out.

[VP Baltar]

I literally said Tayl0r was my strongest TR just before. VPB knows that this is a position they will have to convince others of and argue aggressively. This is not something Scum aims to do.

Ugh. And then Andres posts stuff like this and I feel bad for questioning him. I was bracing for scum!Andres to attack me over that.

Hmm.

[Andresvmb]

@Infinity But aren’t you coming out more strongly against VPB the minute that Tayl0r and VPB start fighting and votes are exchanged? And only then do you put some “relevant posts” down? Seems somewhat convenient to me.

[Infinity 324]

@Infinity But aren’t you coming out more strongly against VPB the minute that Tayl0r and VPB start fighting and votes are exchanged? And only then do you put some “relevant posts” down? Seems somewhat convenient to me.

I went back, ISO'd VP, and reconsidered. VP just piggybacked off of your point and it didn't feel like genuine re-evaluation.

[Marky Mark]

In particular, I'm concerned/worried about DGB - they are clearly a competent player who is currently being allowed to coast and avoid scrutiny.

I've played a good amount with DGB in olden times. This is just her play. She definitely will get more active later. If I had a scum read on her, I'd be all in with you, but she's null to town for me atm.

Happy scumday mate.

I don't know DGB super well but they are clearly an experienced player and imo they are coasting right now. For those TRing DGB right now I'd ask them how they think sucm!DGB would be playing differently because right now I see a whole deal of coasting and trying to look town.

This being said, I am keen to be pragmatic and as I seem to be alone in finding DGB highly sus, I am content to look at other scumreads or low-info slots for today's elim, ie {DK, N_M} and maybe Geraint as a compromise if neither of the above are agreeable with other players. DGB is getting away with a lot right now, so I am just keen that they are held to account - especially as they still haven't responded to questions raised earlier, eg their inconsistencies between their reads on N_M and Geraint

I am going to VOTE: DK and this is me going back to back to first principles - as I have explained at reasonable length already, their unsubstantiated discrediting, inconsistencies, and deflections is not remotely aligned with town interests. If they feel there is a meta defence to be had here, they are welcome to articulate it (just as they are welcome to articulate their reasons for 909)

[Almost50]

VOTE: jacksonvirgo

AND...



TRUE STORY: I did type this..

INNOCENT CHILD

You are a

Town Innocent Child

You may PM the mod at any time to have him reveal your role to everyone in the game topic.
You win if all threats to the town are eliminated and at least one town-aligned player is alive.
Confirm by stating your role and alignment

I got this correct, JV! I now -probably- have a 4/4 hit rate on reading you.

Now imagine how stupid I felt when I realized it was a fake claim and that the mod actually did NOT confirm JV as IC (I only saw the green text and

assumed

it was a confirmation.

[Andresvmb]

@Infinity But aren’t you coming out more strongly against VPB the minute that Tayl0r and VPB start fighting and votes are exchanged? And only then do you put some “relevant posts” down? Seems somewhat convenient to me.

I went back, ISO'd VP, and reconsidered. VP just piggybacked off of your point and it didn't feel like genuine re-evaluation.

But that’s a significant re-evaluation and argument as a means of taking a side in a fight between Tayl0r and VPB that had just happened. The timing is too perfect. If they’re both Town, then as Scum you have very little to lose there.

[Andresvmb]

@Infinity But aren’t you coming out more strongly against VPB the minute that Tayl0r and VPB start fighting and votes are exchanged? And only then do you put some “relevant posts” down? Seems somewhat convenient to me.

I went back, ISO'd VP, and reconsidered. VP just piggybacked off of your point and it didn't feel like genuine re-evaluation.

But that’s a significant re-evaluation and argument as a means of taking a side in a fight between Tayl0r and VPB that had just happened. The timing is too perfect. If they’re both Town, then as Scum you have very little to lose there.

And you also didn’t do this for Tayl0r. You just wrote that Tayl0r is Town. Why didn’t you ISO Tayl0r then?

[Infinity 324]

@Infinity But aren’t you coming out more strongly against VPB the minute that Tayl0r and VPB start fighting and votes are exchanged? And only then do you put some “relevant posts” down? Seems somewhat convenient to me.

I went back, ISO'd VP, and reconsidered. VP just piggybacked off of your point and it didn't feel like genuine re-evaluation.

But that’s a significant re-evaluation and argument as a means of taking a side in a fight between Tayl0r and VPB that had just happened. The timing is too perfect. If they’re both Town, then as Scum you have very little to lose there.

I mean I said I would re-evaluate my read on VP yesterday.

PEdit: see 1677 wrt my taylor reads. I don't think I need to ISO her because most of the AI stuff she's done has been recent.

[Andresvmb]

I am okay with my vote on Infinity for now, really. There’s too much complaining about how people started SR’ing them too late into D1 too which as an argument makes no sense. Sometimes you go back and catch things you missed the first time.

It was such an obvious point though. I haven't had strong scumreads the whole game, and had voiced it multiple times, but they only thought it was scummy once momentum started building.

Essentially you did a version of this, while you’re SR’ing someone for it like in the same set of posts. I just don’t get it.

[VP Baltar]

Since he has a lot of influence over the game, he isn't afraid to stick out.

I have a lot of influence? I haven't gotten people to vote my way most of the day.

I'm definitely engaging with a lot of people because that is how I get reads, but I wouldn't say I'm particularly influential at this point.

I'm basically being forced to compromise yeet you because of my lack of influence

[Andresvmb]

Anyway I welcome some input from others on this and you can all yell at me for focusing on the wrong thing if that’s what I’m doing. This could also be confirmation bias on my part.

[Infinity 324]

How about this, did any of the reasoning in 1644 feel manufactured to you?

PEdit: andres they totally different scenarios and I don't understand how to explain it better than I did. Me not having scumreads was an obvious point that was clear all game. The few points that VP felt manipulative weren't obvious and needed a reread. Re-evaluation is done in different ways by town and scum, one is towny and one is scummy.

[Infinity 324]

Since he has a lot of influence over the game, he isn't afraid to stick out.

I have a lot of influence? I haven't gotten people to vote my way most of the day.

I'm definitely engaging with a lot of people because that is how I get reads, but I wouldn't say I'm particularly influential at this point.

I'm basically being forced to compromise yeet you because of my lack of influence

Yeah, I guess it's more like scum!you would be confident enough to stick out.

[VP Baltar]

Anyway I welcome some input from others on this and you can all yell at me for focusing on the wrong thing if that’s what I’m doing. This could also be confirmation bias on my part.

I don't think you're wrong that infinity is clearly OMGUSing me for voting him. I think Taylor's reasoning is equally bad and her crying foul act every time I ask her a question is sus as hell, but I'm fine yeeting infinity today. I think the scum equity is maybe not as high as youd think (maybe like 65% odds flip red in my unscientific estimation), but I'm willing to concede I'm wrong often and infinity isn't exactly winning me over since I voted him.

[Marky Mark]

Anyway I welcome some input from others on this and you can all yell at me for focusing on the wrong thing if that’s what I’m doing. This could also be confirmation bias on my part.

The infinity elim here feels like a low % play

I get the argument for their POE being off (I am less convinced by the Taylor argument of them playing differently to prior games), but I am not particularly convinced at this point that their POE being off => they are scum

If I were a gambling man, I would put dosh on there being 1+ scum in the lurker pool

As such, I am leaning towards either an elim on someone who has objectivley acted against town interests (ie DK) or someone in the lurker pool (ie DGB, NM or Geraint at a push).