PookyTheMagicalBear v Flavor Leaf (Game Over)

[MURDERCAT]

It's due to interactions with other players I am town reading

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf's got nothing on pichu

Let's see how true this is if I ever roll town against scum you.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Pichu can't be scum

Pichu heart is pure

[pichu]

Flavor Leaf's got nothing on pichu

Let's see how true this is if I ever roll town against scum you.

you already have and you didn't even realise post game because you couldn't comprehend the fact i was scum

[pichu]

Pichu can't be scum

Pichu heart is pure

SOUL MASON
you wanted my heart to shine brightly this game

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

you already have and you didn't even realise post game because you couldn't comprehend the fact i was scum

imagine losing so badly you dont even know you lost

I'm like tempted to just hard sheep pichu but titus didn't give me a vote so lol

[pichu]

hey you could tell everyone Bell's a good vote
then they wouldn't be sheeping me they'd be sheeping the IC as well

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I'd feel bad if Bell is green tho

how sure are we talking for this read from like a scale of THUNDERBOLT to quick attack?

[pichu]

we're talking thundernuke here Pooky
i don't remember ever being wrong on a read this confident so i would be genuinely shocked and ashamed

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

THUNDERNUKE BELL

[pichu]

HYPE
you heard him everyone

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf's got nothing on pichu

Let's see how true this is if I ever roll town against scum you.

you already have and you didn't even realise post game because you couldn't comprehend the fact i was scum

if it was the mbos game, doesn't count. I replaced out before I posted 50 pages. I don't really think I'd have been faded if I stayed, but I got tilted there, and knew I was gonna post like 50 pages.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf's got nothing on pichu

Let's see how true this is if I ever roll town against scum you.

you already have and you didn't even realise post game because you couldn't comprehend the fact i was scum

if it was the mbos game, doesn't count. I replaced out before I posted 50 pages. I don't really think I'd have been faded if I stayed, but I got tilted there, and knew I was gonna post like 50 pages.

[mastina]

pichu's case I read. I don't find it compelling, but I also don't find it wrong in the same way I did MURDERCAT's case on Polar Bears Express.

he's the first to start townreading noraa and with such CONFIDENCE
but i feel town!Bell would have considerably more paranoia after the events of Death Curse (where Noraa deepwolfed with everyone convinced she was town and almost pulled out a phenomenal comeback)

This is at least plausible to me. Not overwhelmingly compellingly probable, but plausible.

there are other town in this game that townread Noraa - they have normal reactions to her getting suspicion
scum!Bell overreacts each time because he's decided to heavy buddy and defend her this game

This is also fairly plausible. It doesn't resonate as overwhelmingly probable, but it is definitely more than just possible.

The size of Ircher's posts versus the content and quality of the conclusions felt super lackluster to me.

just saying i hard disagree here
really liking Ircher now

I wanted to say that I agree Ircher looks probably town and do disagree with Bell's viewpoint, but I can see it as plausibly, maybe even probably, coming from town, although I do recognize the possibility, maybe plausibility, of that viewpoint being scum.

this type of narration of everything that transpired but drawing absolutely

no

strong conclusions either way from it is very scum-indicative
there's no comment on what it means for BM specifically or the people talking about BM
and the take on Solstice is the very definition of fence-sitting

I disagree on that being fencesitty from Bell on Solstice, but the overall take here is probably one of the strongest points (albeit one that I feel I should research in greater detail to verify its validity).

so EVEN IF town!Bell is just supremely confident Noraa is town - which i simply don't believe, i think it's unnatural and the fact he provides no reasoning for it throughout this game but just snaps at people who even dares suggest Noraa is scum is just full of agenda, a whiteknight there is how he's decided to play this game out
but EVEN IF that wasn't the case, Bell should not be jumping to scumreading MURDERCAT just for thinking Noraa is scum
there's no attempt to engage with his case or question into here
just a vote and saying his push alone is scummy because he disagree with the read
that's not a natural way to react, it's how scum reacts when they're trying to whiteknight someone

This is also one of the strongest points in the case. While I feel like the narrative is overly black-and-white in viewpoint (to use the term people try to describe of me), I see what pichu is talking about here in that Bell's reaction to MURDERCAT

is

overly strong, and I can see the at-minimum plausibility if not probability of that, albeit still able to see it possibly, perhaps plausibly, coming from town.

The rest of the case doesn't really resonate with me much at all, but overall?

Conclusion: lukewarm with an emphasis on 'warm'; Bell was among the slots I was townreading that I needed to reassess and judge if they are scum. The case doesn't hard-sell me on Bell being lockscum, but it does a fairly good job at showing the very real plausibility if not probability of Bell being scum by demonstrating the actions that're more likely to come from scum than town, a viewpoint I do find myself overall agreeing with, albeit with the caveat that I do feel the need to research before sheeping it wholly and unconditionally.

In other words:
Would vote.

I like my Creature vote more right now, but if I was seriously asked to genuinely join the Bell wagon, I probably would.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I am asking for your vote Mastina <3

[MURDERCAT]

You want us to vote bell?

I wasn't sure if it was memes or not

[mastina]

DUN Dun dun dun dun dun Dun dun, DUN Dun dun dun dun Dun dun dun.

GUYS THIS MEANS THAT THE SCUM IS DUNNSTRAL
LETS GO GET HIM BOYZ

If MURDERCAT is in fact town?

Actually quite likely! Creature + Bell + Dunn + DEB would be an incredibly likely combo, with the other one being Creature + Bell + Toog + DEB (or Creature + Bell + Spiffeh + DEB but as mentioned I wanna table Spiffeh-scum thoughts until three scum are dead, ideally).

Although I remain unconvinced that MURDERCAT is town.

[MURDERCAT]

Although I remain unconvinced that MURDERCAT is town.

Boo

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

I don't know if murdercatto is a friendocatto but I know Pichu shares my soul and he would never lead me astray.

[mastina]

Anyone townreads Ircher here?

(I am pretty sure that Creature playing around with the idea of wagoning Ircher here is pretty damn scum...especially if Bell IS scum since trying to get Ircher pressure would remove it from Bell.)

[mastina]

Mastina I believe to be town but *technically* she could be scum in the event Creature is town and she had a really good D1 -- like I don't think she is scum but I have never seen mastina scum, either, so perhaps she didn't exit her scumrange but it'd have to be quite big.

I can help (well, "help") you there:
At my absolute peak scum performance levels, D1 is not out of scumastina's scum range altogether, albeit requiring a perfect storm of me being at highest-level functioning capabilities across multiple areas rather than in one or two more specific areas. ~2015-2017-era scumastina was genuinely one of the best scum players onsite with a huge, huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge flexibility to her scumgame and notably gifted at situational awareness to adapt her scumplay to perfectly fit the needs of the particular game as to maximize her team's chances at winning.

However.

Over the last two years, my scumgame has been utterly atrocious. I've been a total lurksack whose contributions were notably lackluster with the difference between my scumplay and townplay being night and day, with my scumplay being minimal, using every excuse to avoid content, and coasting by with my towngame being more energetic.

However

however, I DID just have a scumgame where I approached near-peak-scumastina-levels. I was still, very visibly, not in my towngame, and there were multiple scum traits of mine present, but I exuded a "town aura" as scum, something which is

very

hard to pull off, yet I have shown the capacity to do as given by that game. Radiating townness as scum is something within my scumrange, which is why I invented the flowchart for how to read me.

The flowchart is, notably, a little dated; it's missing some of my most recent town/scumtells and in the case of being reasonable and rational, this is something that has become almost nai. (I am more reasonable and rational as both alignments and as town can be very convincing with logical deductions and outlining the process behind my conclusions, so just on a skim, you'd think nai, but as scum my arguments still tend to be even more "precise" than their town counterparts, extra-targeted, extra-concise in comparison, extra on-point, whereas my town cases tend to always have weaknesses in them if you look beyond the surface. Which is to say, my scum cases tend to be more "perfect" than my town cases are, in spite of me being logical in both.)

And a key aspect of it is that I'll never show every town trait in a towngame and never show every scum trait in a scumgame and may show some scum traits in a towngame and definitely will show some town traits in a scumgame, but that overall it is incredibly hard, over a sustained period of time, borderlining on nigh-impossible levels, for me to maintain a presence of almost all towntells as scum, whereas they flow more naturally as town.

Basically, while I will suffer burnout as both alignments, it's easier to suffer burnout as scum because being scum at the highest level of effort is more draining than being town at the highest level of effort (even though both are, notably, draining; I am incapable of maintaining the highest level of effort as town indefinitely, which is why I frequently have a mixture of low/high-energy posting days, with low ones being rest time and high ones being active time). The cracks in scumastina form over time with continued observation; the solidification of town-mastina becomes more readily apparent given time.

So that is to say,
tl;dr?
D1's not impossible from scumastina, but is incredibly improbable to be her.

[mastina]

Uh, wouldn't I be happy with the game state here.

Uh, I'm not gunna engage with Pichu's case on me it's the same forest fire shit and I know exactly what I'd say and what he'd say and do in response to every cherry pick, wrong take, pointed out to him etc.

Hey so like.

Remember how there was a summation of "Noraa as scum does not react well to pressure but does as town", more or less?

Yeah, well.

I am beginning to think that applies better to Bell than it does to Noraa.

I remember Bell got some pressure in MBOS10--and reacted completely differently than Bell is reacting here, similarly under pressure.

There, he had a certain energy and smugness to him; here he's radiating defensiveness.

Soyeah.

Definitely am seeing Bell-scum here now!

[mastina]

You didn't push me. I spent upwards of 8 hours telling you to your face what the truth was and it didn't matter. Call it AtE or what not. But the facts are the facts and you saying you weren't voting me in that at the end of day is just massaging your own play to look better in hindsight as a form of ego protection.

(Ironically. Bell's posts in this stage of the game actually look almost exactly like Noraa's posts in that one Noraa scumgame everyone is talking about which I can't remember the name of off the top of my head. The one which MURDERCAT linked to. Noraa's posts there when defending herself, look like Bell's posts here when defending himself.)

[mastina]

Would like to hear update from Mastina on recent events but leaning town for now.
- Norwee

Considering I've pointed out reasons for Bell being scum that, to my knowledge, are unique to me and things not presented by others before me, it is now me who could use the advice of others in confirming if I am onto something in regards to Bell's defensiveness when under pressure.

(Which is to say I think it's a solid indicator that he's scum.)

I also have thoughts on others, but they're best saved for after a Bell flip if we are flipping Bell today.

I'm debating whether to vote Bell or not; I only have one vote and to me, both Bell and Creature are equally scum.

But overall, I think I do lean towards doing this:
VOTE: Bell.

[Double the Trouble]

Dunnstral you can come out now. Bell is threatened.

- Norwee