thank you for 820 clidd, I'm really trying my best so it's good to read that.
@infinity: you are right that I was appealing to horsewoman, but more in the sense that I wanted her to have an open channel with me so we could do things in the game together. she was already townreading me when I wrote #545 and I figured she could draw further parallels from my scumgame that she participated in to come to terms with my slot. you're right I was too uncharitable, but in my defense I simply forgot about her other posts as newer impressions replaced older ones.
pedit: you could be right and I share the same suspicion.
pedit2: I agree this might be too farfetched to take everything infinity posts with a grain of salt just because they were reading the game prior. but I think e.g. the reasoning behind you being a deepwolf if radja is is something very simple that anyone, as detached as they are while skimming through this game, can come to. the same is true for everything in that reads list he made. I'm still looking at his posts with more attention now so we'll see.
can we ask for an extended d1? I don't know what the procedures or rules are for things like that but it's new year and there's been a lot of unfortunate rep outs. I don't think it's fair to end the gameday so soon. apologies if this is improper to ask but I'm concerned.
In post 764, Infinity 324 wrote:
Literally whenever gimli posts a read it feels like he's glossing over it a bit. It feels like he isn't giving his own reads the time they need to be properly articulated, which is super scummy.
would you care expanding on this? I agree my posts can be sometimes hard to read but why do you think not giving posts a proper edit is scummy? you're a 2013 account so you're at least familiar with the idea that scum needs to actually edit their posts more because of all the faketies in their reasoning, while town has an easier time just writing what they're thinking, which means their posts might look more unarticulated as a result.
Not what I meant, you do actually seem to be editing your posts, but you don't seem to be actually asking yourself "how do I express this read in the best way possible so that I can convince other people?" Instead you're asking yourself "how do I write enough so that this read seems believable?"
Also, what is Not_Mafia doing? This is some of the worst play I’ve ever seen.
I will SEARCH for games with you and N_M to help you policy him.
I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.
In post 823, clidd wrote:Ahsoka, I know you probably don't like to read my posts, but do you think the ''Dk vs Gimli'' thing says something AI about Dk?
i forget where that was, but Dkkoba's been making scummy plays all day.
I was gone for a day and a half, mentally if not physically, and I don't remember the specifics of this game anymore, but I remember vague feelings.
Basically Dk entered the offensive/defensive hybrid mode which I imagine they can enter in both alignments.
But, in that situation, they seemed irritated with Gimli and after a temporary pause of ''x'' hours, Dk reconsidered and switched their vote to me. The line of: vote on radja, vote on gimli, vote on me and finally vote on radja again is something that I have difficulty seeing as beneficial for scum!Dk.
They don't seem to be taking advantage of those instances if they are scum and I'm ''?'' about all of that.
My sleep quality has been mediocre for the past two days and I believe I understand how you may be feeling.
In post 451, DkKoba wrote:ur progression on volxen is "uwu null because im so paranoid" to "aha volxen towntold haha must be town"
please tell me what you were "seeing" when it was just a single post lmfao
I see a lot of personal things.
His posts reflected me a lot like town!He and I was hoping he would post more for me to strengthen this (he was my third in townread intensity, that is, weaker than raya and gimli).
The substitution is making me rethink this.
except it seems more like you just want to discredit them because they came in strong
I guess I'll reveal it now since my actions/words have already slipped it:
i faked a townlean on you early on to see how you'd react. now i see that your read on me has progressed based on what the vibe was of my read on you. you avoided me when i was being buddy then when i was starting to express doubt you started to pivot. I notice these things.
You're not the only slot I've been watching carefully in this manner. Lets just say I plan to end the day is a good old CFD.............
In post 456, clidd wrote:I think your entire ISO is scummy, sorry, lol.
I must say what I think.
I just don't know why I'm feeling bad about saying this. I feel that this game would be more fun if I played with you, but this is my emotional one talking.
My rationale is saying ''bro, this is scum''.
if my whole iso is scummy you can quote at least 5 things then
In post 466, DkKoba wrote:ok like scum often play in a way of cultivating a gamestate:
the way everyone reads the game is how they read it.
if im faking a read, they can't properly evaluate and make decisions based on my reads(and other towns' reads)
now when i suddenly reveal the read was not true all along, it puts a wrench in their plans and causes them to react heavily.
i guess like i havent really caught scum directly yet with this method but its how i keep scum on their toes(its more lategame it works where theres less town scum are trying to fool/frame)
In post 468, DkKoba wrote:clidd imma be real with u rn cause im getting annoyed:
idgaf what u think of my posting style rn cause ur trying to frame me for NAI shit and its just validating my tinfoil on u. ur not getting me miselimed on d1 ever. it just never happens. if you do, you have to put all 3 scum on the wagon. and you minimum make 2 scum obvious on that wagon. which id love to happen but i still gotta put up that fight to force that situation lol
In post 519, DkKoba wrote:clidd, scum just spewed u town by hard appealing to u. how do u feel
In post 520, DkKoba wrote:theyre basically saying "lol clidd has terrible reads lets pocket him rn"
In post 521, DkKoba wrote:ok sorry that was probably too far but trying to get u to pull ur head out the sand and see what im seeing here
In post 532, DkKoba wrote:if my hunch is correct, within their next 3 posts they will scumslip and I will be able to fully case him. (:
In post 541, clidd wrote:And I find it very difficult for Gimli to be scum, because I really liked the descriptions he attributed to the posts he engaged with me and reflected me very genuinely as he is trying to evaluate me.
If you're seeing him as scum, Dk, you have to slap me in the face (metaphorically) and show me why he's scum to you.
he's either going to dodge the elephant in the room, or he's going to scumslip. its my prediction.
consider: if you're town then he's able to case you accurately and genuinely because well, you ARE town. it's something that exists. (even though uh well. we'll see once gimli decides to pop his head out of the scum PT)
In post 552, Gimli son of Glóin wrote:I don't care about addressing any of your points. feel free to vote and case me all you want.
cause youre caught scum and you know i caught you <3
if you're town you should have 0 trouble explaining your thought processes or reasons but you're not sooooooo <3
In post 560, DkKoba wrote:a real explaination is quick to come for a genuine read. a fake one takes an eternity.
(adapted from a quote about fake role claims, which still rings true)
this is why gimli is scumclaimed right now -> they cannot explain their read progression AT ALL. because: their reads are fake. Because they are scum who got caught with their pants down being asked the right questions at the right time.
In post 642, DkKoba wrote:hi im home from work and am willing to toss aside my previous reads into the trash.
i admit in my eagerness to find scum and use my methods I went and pushed myself too hard to the point of being stressed.
the only read im retaining atm is the clidd scumread. the very fact they sat there and let me tunnel onto gimli like that just doesnt sit right with me.
idk
im fucking lost.
i hate d1s.
People in this game have played with koba before yeah? The energy in that clidd push and the gimli push are so "haha I caught you", I can tell they're trying they're hardest to try and make scum scared. Then the re-evaluation when people say that they're going too far doesn't make a ton of sense from scum because the push served a purpose for scum!koba. Ime koba is totally ok with being toxic as scum. In bending when they were scum, everyone was asking them to tone it down and they sorta acknowledged it but went back to doing the same thing because it was all an act to begin with. This whole sequence is really hard for me to see if koba is scum.
I'm not confident in the read, but I don't expect to be confident this Day phase. 3 scum to 6 townies is rather strong with no flips for scum, so realistically, scum are going to be trying not to pair up, but probably make sure the game lands on a misfade somehow.
I think a List Publish tomorrow forces sides to be chosen, and scum are going to do their best to make sure that doesn't come across as black and white, so scum probably have been staying on separate sides this game and not voting together.
I could be overthinking about it, but that's what I would do. It's the safest route that doesn't take a lot of coordination between teammates.
infinity, that's a fine way to interpret my posts and I have nothing to say to that.
I understand the townread on koba now logically but I don't see much sincerity in their posts, it all looks like theatre and especially when you quote those in sequence. they said they caught me cause I said I needed coffee for instance. I don't think that's ever a genuine read.
They said the idea was that saying you might need coffee means you're self-conscious/excusing scummy posting, which I don't necessarily agree with, but I don't see why that couldn't come from town.
Ok, if you're town I think you should try to put in a bit more effort to think "does this player's actions make more sense from town or scum?" The fact that you seem to be putting quite a bit of effort into this game and aren't already doing that is part of why I think you're scum here.
I search for genuine or fabricated thoughts, it's hard to know what scum is plotting to tell whether something 'makes sense' or not. we don't have all the info to know what makes sense.
sorry for spamming one liners but this is something you and clidd might have an easier time doing. If I look for what makes sense the way you're suggesting I'm never going anywhere.
Maybe describing your playstyle in a spoiler would help me a bit. There are certain things that scum always want to do, like get townread, so I try to think about what scum thinks would get them townread and what wouldn't. Of course we don't have all the info but there are patterns in how people tend to think. Meta can help but isn't necessary.
It turns out that DKkoba's theory was wrong and redflavor's opened came from town. I liked the theory, I think it's towny that dk thought this long and hard about it, and part of me was just curious enough to know so I decided to replace in when the chance appeared.
This feels show-y. I took a brief glance at the game before I replaced in and was also curious what alignment Radja was but I wasn't planning to say it. This can go in my null for now.
In post 84, clidd wrote:I had a hard scumread on DK in our first game together, but after a while I learned that he plays
like that
in both alignments. Nothing he said in this game, so far, is ai in my opinion.
Please pay attention to pronouns.
What do you mean by "they play like that in both alignments"?
Specifically, what is "that"
In post 86, clidd wrote:Many of Gimli's reads in relation to DK seem like things that I could manufacture as scum to push someone, but I still believe that there is a scenario where he is not used to DK and, by default, interpreted his entire line of action as too weird to be town. I'm waiting to see which way my impression on him will go.
I agree with Gimli on Dkkoba.
In post 94, Gimli son of Glóin wrote:last post of the day is a retraction of that ahsoka townlean after much consideration.
in fact I think her entrances in the thread are very bad with the flow of everything and point to scum.
will develop on this read tomorrow.
VOTE: ahsoka
I dislike the timing of this. It is right after clidd says Ashoka isn't obvtowning.
Reads look like this right now:
Town: Redflavor, Not Mafia
Null: Clidd, Gimli
Scum: Dkkoba, Raya36
Gimli and Ashoka's avatars are very similar and I apologize in advance if I start mixing them up.
In post 98, clidd wrote:DK is the type of person who is easily misunderstood if you don't like their post flow, and is a very sensitive slot in terms of what can be considered AI or not. I would say that none of their posts so far have given me the impression of "this is town!DK" or "this is scum!DK", which is why I am warning you (assuming you are town, of course ) to keep an open mind towards them.
What is ai for them then?
In post 99, DkKoba wrote:gimli basically is approaching my slot in the worst faith possible, and anyone who is skeptical of me = towny.
thats how u can sum up their reading process.
this isnt how town approaches reads.
this is how scum discredits.
as soon as clidd pointed out that this is NAI for me > pivoted off.
this implies clidd is not aligned with gimli(like 50% sure, but gun to head would bet on not teammates rn)
clidd, as someone who plays at tables with myself in every game I play, I know that that is exactly what scum does in relation to my slot very often when they do not know me. Those that know me will more often attempt to pocket me as that's my weakness, or something in between if they're especially smart(pooky from coalition a few months ago comes to mind).
im a bit of a self aware player. I know what's scummy. I know whats towny. I know whats NAI. If you think you have caught me being scummy it better be because my reads are horseshit, not some NAI garbage like a townslip. Can I fake them? Yeah. But the reason I do is because i genuinely make them regularly as town(and sometimes i fake them as town too). Basically, even if I were scum here, I would have posted nearly the same exact thing. But it could have been slightly different depending on partners. If you really care about sorting me i have games where I show that lines like this are NAI, just read my history lmfao. I won't ever push meta that says im outside my scumrange, but I will push meta that what you're pushing is fully NAI.
anyways self meta over -
gimli have you considered its RVS and that people who know eachother and have played with eachother are liklier to have implicit bias towards eachother? I tend to push people early who annoy me or who i dislike. It's easier and more natural for me. I don't tunnel them forever unless I genuinely scumread them. This is probably also true of raya wrt the lighter tone towards me - we've played together and i've played in a game she's modded. We're chill and don't wanna go at eachothers throats like that.
I will say the ashoka vote isn't bad, that entrance is pretty flimsy. I'd rather figure out if this is just playstyle > scum being unsure and playing aloof. but lets play with it VOTE: ashoka
You say Gimli is approaching in terrible faith but then vote the person Gimli is voting. Why is that?
If I remembered correctly, Gimli is the one with the entrance I found show-y and Ashoka is the one that I can't remember anything about but both have similar avatars.
In post 108, clidd wrote:
It reflects me as malicious, but not explicitly. It is a personal feeling.
I already made some posts of mech stuff (as scum) and even though it should be seen naturally as nai, I noticed that some players seemed to trust me more.
Not saying it is scummy, but in the context of Volxen, who is a very competent player as scum, it gave me a shiver.
I remember other example too about I correctly scumreading scum with the same feeling, but I need to take a look to see if I can find the game.
I have never seen someone make a mech post likely due to me not playing any complicated games like this one but I don't see how it would make anyone look more towny.
In post 131, Raya36 wrote:I'm a little worried this is setting up for pushing but I guess we'll see.
This is really a stretch. My scumread here stands.
In post 139, Raya36 wrote:I don't know Volxen but I'll keep this in mind. That was a long explanation to say that's not who you'd push as scum. Self-meta like that isn't something I read into much. For all I know the reason you're potentially setting up a push on volxen instead of the other options you gave is because the other options include your partners.
Once again, what is this? I hate nearly every post she makes.
In post 147, Ahsoka wrote:People play expecting town to have reads, but a townie shouldn't have strong reads at this point in the game. I will converse as I see fit, and these conversations will look good to look at in hindsight, which is why I converse.
I have given my thoughts on the stuff that stood out the most.
you're lockscum
I don't have a specific opinion on any one of Ashoka's posts but I definitely do not find them scummy.
In post 162, Ahsoka wrote:I don't know Gimli, but I know you and Kkoba, so let's fight. Shall we?
I believe this push on me is fabricated. I believe there are town on my wagon currently, as I specifically do not think Gimli and Dkkoba are both scum voting me.
Clidd can be scum because they hard misrepped me right when momentum on me could have gone either way. They can be impatient town. Either way, this should end up amusing.
This I hate very much for how defensive it is. I am considering moving this down to scum read.
In post 78, Gimli son of Glóin wrote:ow about you let other people decide if that is a townslip? also fair to note DK was annoying my slot cause redflavor had like a small hint of being mechanically aware, and now they're looking like they don't know anything at all about the game they're playing. so how does dkkoba know there's a doomcounter and they don't know there's 3 mafia?
DK can correct me if I am wrong, but I interpreted their reasoning behind their early Red scumread as that, if Red rolled scum the doom counter would be fresher in his mind since it’s mentioned in the scum role PM, whereas the DC is not mentioned in the town role PM. I don’t think it’s a great reason to be scumreading your slot, but I believe that is where DK is coming from regarding the scumread of Red’s opener.
I don’t think it’s really far-fetched that town!DK could have been aware of the DC early on but glossed over the fact that there are three scum vs two scum. DK might have simply focused on the DC part of the setup information and overlooked the number of town vs scum if they were reading the setup primarily to learn about the DC mechanic.
The alternative explanation is that DK is scum and faked all of these “mistakes” by pretending to think that there were only two scum, and that scum could also nightkill. I don’t think this is as likely because DK’s progression that started with incorrect analysis (2 scum and nightkills) and ended with them realizing their mistakes seemed genuine to me.
Also, if you look back at the early interactions between Red and DK at the very beginning of the game (5, 6, 7), DK’s posts where they called Red’s opener scummy and said it was a somewhat serious vote came 2 minutes after Red’s “hardclaim DC” opener. Scum!DK couldn’t have possibly pre-planned that opener, unless they are scum with your slot. And if you are town and DK is scum, I don’t know that DK would be able to come up with that fake reasoning to scumread Red over his opener that quickly. Granted, DK only initially said that Red’s opener was scummy without explaining why, but they knew they would have to eventually explain why (and DK did as soon as Red replaced out), so I think that regardless of DK’s alignment they knew what the explanation of the scumread was going to be at the time that they called Red’s opener scummy. I think it’s more likely to be a genuine thought process coming from town!DK rather than a fake thought process coming from scum!DK, especially when the short time lapse is taken into account.
I'm going to have to ask you to explain exactly where you stand because this post is not faring well with my brain after an entire day of work.
In post 184, DkKoba wrote:volxen im feeling that vibe u fit into a very similar archaetype of player like I do
Volxen is a townread because Dkkoba posted this.
In post 199, Gimli son of Glóin wrote:just so you won't think I'm picking on you, I just found all your posting to be scum indicative as I was catching up. I could be wrong of course.
There were a few instances where I had to get my glasses and make sure I was reading correctly but I disagree that all of it was bad.
In post 159, clidd wrote:So you don't have any strong read that you like to talk and that's ok because it's page 6 and I'm the villain for wanting to force something that theoretically you would not be able to deliver bc you're town and town don't have real reads early game. Is that it?
I don't like clidd twisting this to make it sound like he was being targeted. I never interpreted anything Ahsoka said as calling him a villain or even sussing him.
I'm going to move over here VOTE: clidd
In post 163, clidd wrote:pedit: I feel like a villain by the tone you approached the subject, but don't worry.
The tone felt fine to me too. Maybe just because it wasn't directed at me but I don't see how it made him feel like a villain.
I'm a little worried this is setting up for pushing but I guess we'll see.
I usually push players who are vocally weaker compared to me as scum, and Volxen doesn't fit that criteria.
Unless I have a specific context for pushing a player that is vocally difficult to eliminate (as I did on partition with ABR)
After our last game together -- where we were both town and I incorrectly scumread you early on in the game because I was suspicious of your "easy" townread on me -- I think it's plausible that scum!you would be aggressive towards my slot and push me in the beginning. You know I'm skeptical of people who townread me if I can't follow their reasoning. So if anything, I would expect scum!you to err on the side of being too aggressive towards my slot (rather than whiteknight me), at least initially, because you could always pull back later and have your read of me "evolve" into a townread if I started to become more widely townread.
I don't know if scum!you would necessarily deathtunnel me, but I am convinced after our last game together that scum!you would be very cautious with things like the timing of when you might fake a townread on me and your fake reasons for doing so, because you know that I would call you out on it if I felt that your reasons for townreading me were not genuine.
So I don't buy this narrative at all that scum!you would always start off by pushing the less vocal slots.
Then this further supports my point earlier that clidd might be setting up a push.
I hate Raya's posting way too much. Every post looks so scummy. This is my top scum read.
In post 219, clidd wrote:An example of this type of impression is this post (
I can feel it when Volxen presents a line of reasoning that I look at and think ''gee, this analysis is super towny, I think I would think the same if we switch places''.
I feel like this comes from town more than scum. I'm going to lift this to null.
In post 274, DkKoba wrote:horsewoman is avoiding this thread for some reason?? also who are they cause i suddenly saw them post in a certain thread that i have never seen them post in!!! im suspicious of u in the context of site user not necessarily in the context of being scum
In post 251, Radja wrote:
I'm not really following what Raya and clidd are arguing about.
Gimli's "regardless of clidd's alignment, Raya is locktown" seems really weird to me. Why would a clidd flip not make you reconsider your read?
Maybe if you understood their argument you'd understand why I'm so hard in leaning raya town. It does appear to me that raya, volxen and clidd are playing something of a game of their own, with all that combined meta and wits between the 3 of them. Raya caught clidd being too hasty in townreading volxen for something volxen did that isn't supposed to be read as towny, and I think the push in that direction was too nuanced to ever come from scum. Even if clidd is town, that doesn't diminish the towniness in raya's thought process.
Speaking of which, I was a little uneasy with clidd's strong TR of me, because my TR of clidd was weaking at that point and I think he noticed it (given I was open about strong townreading raya), and I felt that maybe clidd decided to try to maintain himself on my good side by pocketing me. I'm not sure my posts were towny enough to be townread that strongly.
I absolutely hated the push on clidd. It looked very slimy. I don't think past experience with a player justifies nasty pushes like that.
In post 278, Gimli son of Glóin wrote:Ahsoka seems like a bit of an oddball type of player, and as an oddball myself I sympathize with how hard it is sometimes to make yourself understood. That is to say I might have been too hasty in identifying the oddity of her posting as scummy, and a post such as this appears to have layers of genuine solvey thought processes. It's not a strong read but I've been liking the way she responded to all the pressure.
This switched too fast but I still think it's a towny thought process. I think I'm going to officially move Gimli up to a townread.
clidd is a stronger townlean now than before the re-read. I think what bothers me the most about him is townreading volxen based off nothing, then trying to act smart about it. I'm also townreading ahsoka now. I think the way she developed her posting in thread was very natural and the way she responded to pressure was good. it's not much but I gotta work with this townpool for now <raya, ahsoka, clidd>.
if I squint real hard, I can see something towny about radja. NM did nothing either way.
that leaves me with volxen, dkkoba and horsewoman. volxen's wall defending dkkoba's tripping over themselves at the beginning of d1 and then dkkoba going 'i feel naked uwu' and then defending volxen when no one was pushing him are all suspicious to me. + no one pushed horsewoman yet, someone who was just here to complain about a game having 6 pages 36 hours into it. if she was town there'd be a wagon already.
Volxen was dropped to a null once my scum read on dkkoba faded out.
I agree with the clidd townread.
Ahsoka is a null for me for now. I've wavered in between townread and null for them so I think the townread is reasonable.
Raya I disagree with entirely. She hasn't posted a single post that I haven't felt was extremely scummy.
In post 274, DkKoba wrote:horsewoman is avoiding this thread for some reason?? also who are they cause i suddenly saw them post in a certain thread that i have never seen them post in!!! im suspicious of u in the context of site user not necessarily in the context of being scum
new user posts in thread for first time. absolutely shocking. i should have just used quantum time travel to post in a thread before having posted in it for the first time.
Like come on man, bring the game into the game, bring your paranoid crap into the admins DMs not here.
This level of anger and frustration doesn't feel fake. I'm going to call it town.
In post 286, Horsewoman wrote:I mean obviously this is forced and ridiculous (doing actual game-related catchup now)
This can be my new top townread.
In post 288, Horsewoman wrote:This, however, is a relatively lazy read from Gimli. Just finished a game with him (my first game onsite so don't expect any other meta from me) where he was scum and he was universally townread and really competent. So he's someone I want to have my eye on throughout this one.
I'm honestly unsure what I think of Gimli currently. His entrance made me think scum but after that mostly everything was null or townread material. I can't remember most of his posts also. I can only think of off the top of my head one readslist that I agreed with except for the Raya read.
I'm caught up, it was super easy and fast because most of the 12 pages was dkkoba spewing nonsense. Although I don't mind making short multiposts, I think posting as much as koba is is kind of anti-town (at least on mafiascum, where games are soooooooo slow), so I would advise koba to cut that aspect out of his playstyle/this game.
Gimli's playing pretty differently than he did in our game together. And by that I mean worse. I think paradoxically that makes him more likely to be town here? He's producing less reads and less analysis but that might be because he's only producing genuine reads/analysis. Want to see more from him. Koba has made a lot of posts I disagree with and posts like 223 really rub me the wrong way. Radja's reads list is so atrocious I don't think it can come from anyone trying to solve/read the game. I'm kind of biased against koba because he's accused me (without evidence) of being an alt of a guy who was apparently banned for sexual harassment, and that's a really fucking uncool thing to do. So I've got personal animus there. Post 217 from clidd I really dislike, the thought process of 'I agree with him so he's town' is itself, really artificial. I liked ahsoka's posting a reasonable amount.
Now I'm having problems with this readslist.
Clidd is solid town. Occasionally I question it but overall, I'm pretty sure he's just town.
Gimli and Dkkoba are still nulls. I dont think I'm willing to give either a townread thinking back on that.
I think I was too quick to townread this and am dropping it to null now.
This sort of interaction is the sort I'd usually say wouldn't be between two scum but I think it has a high chance of being so here. That's because the setup of 3 scum out of 9 heavily incentivizes the scum to buddy up and stick together, because if all 3 are going the same way they only need 2 town to join them. So basically I'm saying that bussing is incredibly unlikely and scum overtly allying is much more possible.
I don't think they are scum together.
In post 536, Horsewoman wrote:I'm saying that close buddying up in this game is more likely to be scummy in this game than other games. You and N_M have closely buddied up, which in the context of this game, is scummy behaviour. Please don't immaturely attempt to own me.
Nevermind. I think this has to be town. Back to town reads.
last post of the day. love the catchup and I think this wagon is officially bad. scumreading raya strongly has such a nice ring to it. I don't know if I'm here tomorrow but I'm against eliminating amélie.
Horsewoman was kinda a weird slot for me to read before I replaced in, but the fact that gimli and amelie are going "she's town!" "wait no she's scum!" "wait I changed my mind she's town!" instead of trying to weigh the towny things against the scummy things is scum-indicative to me. Weighing evidence is harder to fake than looking at the most recent horse post and saying whether it's towny or scummy in a vacuum.
