Mini Normal 2183 | Innocent Things | Game Over!

[Flavor Leaf]

Andres setup a situation where Geraint gets voted out today, then gets to beat me in the 1v1.

And Not Mafia to surface level to figure it out, and Plus still too new.

[Flavor Leaf]

Andres setup a situation where Geraint gets voted out today, then gets to beat me in the 1v1.

And Not Mafia to surface level to figure it out, and Plus still too new.

[Flavor Leaf]

the fact only like Shelly stated anything about my wall post likely means I have strong reads considering not only did I actively do more work, my wagon sped up afterwards.

I thought your wall of reads was reasonable but I’m also biased since it looks like I’m your strongest TR.

^I would maybe disagree on nopoint though. I don’t see the slot as Scummy. I thought that acknowledgment that the slip maybe wasn’t that to be a Towny response.

[Flavor Leaf]

Towns are unwnd, andres, johnny, fuzzy, Plus. scumies are dunn, maybe FL

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like while it does implicate shelly from end of day play, it's too obvious for shelly to kill titus. That's not really shelly's scum style at least in a vacuum. Shelly usually goes for PRs and is confident in their dayplay that they'd go another target. Rather I think scum is trying to get us on shelly.
Following that I think nopoint is more likely since they were on each other. I also think there's very likely at least 1 scum in the lurkers from end of day 1 or the inactives.

There’s no such thing as too Scummy to be Scum. If the end of day play makes shellyc look bad, then we shouldn’t shy away from looking there closely.

[Flavor Leaf]

Nah I've got a solid TR on shelly despite them seeming scummy based on titus suspecting them. I'd rather go nopoint

Yeah, I’ll vote Nopoint. Right now, I’m thinking

Nopoint, Plus, Shelley, could be wrong with Shelly, but they’re town reading me too hard for my liking.

I feel like Plus is scum who is trying to figure out if their partner is guiltied.

[Andresvmb]

What? I didn’t set anything up. That’s ridiculous. I would never have tried to steer the shot towards my Partner there, ever. I would have either kept quiet or agreed with you then, since if I’m Scum you had it all wrong Flavor. I don’t understand why you’re going down this path. Like I said I made a few mistakes, but c’mon you don’t seriously think I get this emotionally invested as Scum. You have said that yourself in the past.

[Flavor Leaf]

not so spicy take

VOTE: Unwnd

Dunn
Not Mafia

Geraint
Andres

Shelly
Hank
Johnny

Plusjoyed
Fuzzy
Nopoint
Unwnd

Probably where I'm at.

I'd say at least 2 scum in bottom group, possible scum in that shelly, hank, johnny. But all 3 could be in that bottom.

No ranking between tiers.

geraint i think has been genuine, I thought they were townie day 1 too, their comment is weird if coming from scum on Dunn/Not Mafia.

Andres hasn't done much, but they've been here to talk, and I feel they would have done more if they were scum.

Shelly put me as a town read in a spot I think it would have been good to let me get momentum, so if she is scum, she actively prevented me from gaining momentum, and with the no fade, I think this is weird, however i'm weak to pocketing, and Titus was pushing her.

Hank hasn't done anything scummy to me, day 1 it's more okay than day 2. I hope they can town it up.

johnny, eh, i remember them a bit day 1, and they were doing stuff, and voting around, but they werent able to get momentum, that's why they're there.

plusjoyed I mentioned earlier. I think they were distancing from Nopoint in case one of them were guiltied, but this is more reliant on both of them. I still think Plus probably thought someone was guiltied and got worried.

Fuzzy has played pretty poorly this game, I feel. most of their playing has been "flavor and titus are good, let's kill them because they have a good scum game.", and Titus dying I think leads back to them more.

Nopoint has been scummy most of the game, this carries over from my day 1. Their posts just seem kinda fake, nothing in particular has been "bad", but they seem like they don't believe what they're saying, also I think they have connections to Plusjoyed because of my Plus case.

Unwnd was playing the "this is how it should be played" game, and i thought it was NAI at first, but I feel they can be using that as an excuse and almost choosing to play that act this game.

I think all 3 scum are in those 4, however, if I'm wrong in that, it's 1 of the 3 in the tier above.

1.04

Flavor Leaf

[3]: nopointinactingup#293, unwnd#339,

Dunnstral#343

1.05

Flavor Leaf

[4]: unwnd#339,

Dunnstral#343, Titus#503, Not_Mafia#509

Not_Mafia [2]:

Hank Spankems#69, PlusJOYED#365

Dunnstral

[3]:

Flavor Leaf#381,

Andresvmb#403, nopointinactingup#548

1.06

shellyc [3]: nopointinactingup#599,

Titus#638

, JohnnyFarrar#647

Flavor Leaf

[4]: unwnd#339,

Dunnstral#343, Titus#503, Not_Mafia#509

Unwnd is scum by VCA. 1.04 to 1.05 no point looks like scum trying to get off the wagon that looks to be gaining, but the Not Mafia wagon likely has a scum on it, which does fit with my Plus theory.

Dunn
Not Mafia

Geraint
Andres

Shelly
Hank
Johnny

Plusjoyed
Fuzzy
Nopoint
Unwnd

Probably where I'm at.

I'd say at least 2 scum in bottom group, possible scum in that shelly, hank, johnny. But all 3 could be in that bottom.

cool, let's go nopoint together.

[PlusJOYED]

well, I'll wait what dunn has to say before voting

[Not_Mafia]

Towns are unwnd, andres, johnny, fuzzy, Plus. scumies are dunn, maybe FL

So nopoint lists her partners as her top two townreads?

[Flavor Leaf]

A lot of my previous reads sorta became fleeting. I disliked Nopoint but it's been actual days and I can't remember the reason why. I can't read someone's mind but I imagine Shelly feels close to the same in terms of me. The M/O of most scum team is either 1) Control the gamestate 2) Operate in the gamestate. If scum were

controlling

the gamestate, then logic persists that Me/Flavor/Shelly would be in contention purely by the amount of seeming effort. I think Flavor is wrong about me and I think he's done some absolutely nonsensical posts, but that's a lot of extra for nothing gained. This gives me pause even if I initially was a bit annoyed people were townreading him. I think those people who are seemingly just being like, 'well, that's flavor being flavor' have more possibility to be scum who are only operating in the gamestate provided for them. This is not an absolute rather just an observation.

I mean this literally, but me and FL have provided provided more than 20% of the posts made, and then most of them are interacting with each other.

[PlusJOYED]

What? I didn’t set anything up. That’s ridiculous. I would never have tried to steer the shot towards my Partner there, ever. I would have either kept quiet or agreed with you then, since if I’m Scum you had it all wrong Flavor. I don’t understand why you’re going down this path. Like I said I made a few mistakes, but c’mon you don’t seriously think I get this emotionally invested as Scum. You have said that yourself in the past.

if you thought you were gonna get shot it might've been to set uwnd as the deepwolf or reverse psychology since I said I wouldn't trust you after shooting fuzzy.

[Flavor Leaf]

Do you wanna be cheeky adhominem or do you want to actually respond to my points?

Shelly, so instead of reading and meta-ing me yourself you went and asked Johnny? Seems a bit theatrical. And one thing I have to add, there's no use in meta-ing someone if you only read their scum game. For example, you keep saying I'm lurking but if you read any of my town games (from waaaaaaaay before) you will see that I have similar post frequency regardless of alignment because I like to read a whole bunch of stuff in succession it helps me keep track of what's happening in town

The difference is that I’m town-reading Johny despite the only game I’ve played with him he was scum. If you had the time to read my scum game why not skim my town game? Or is it just convenient not to? You pushing Johny to see me as scum was my point against you not the fact that you didn’t read my town game

That Nopoint chainsaw.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dunn
Not Mafia

Geraint
Andres

Shelly
Hank
Johnny

Plusjoyed
Fuzzy
Nopoint
Unwnd

Probably where I'm at.

I'd say at least 2 scum in bottom group, possible scum in that shelly, hank, johnny. But all 3 could be in that bottom.

@unwnd remember, Flavor is saying that all of the Scum are in {plusJOYED, Fuzzy, nopoint, you}. Do you buy that? Because I don’t. Hank should be in everybody’s suspicious or null pile, for example. plusJOYED is actually trying even if I think they have a few things wrong.

TMI

UNVOTE: Flavor

[PlusJOYED]

I'm gonna check d1 vote count since I think that'll give me my answer

[Flavor Leaf]

fwiw i now sorta want to reverse my unwnd read

I feel like unwnd wants to strongarm the gamestate here

@unwnd talk to me about this post. Are you really all that sure about your view of the game? You seem to be partly defending two players {Shellyc, Flavor} that are more than happy to vote for you and throw you under the bus, because they post a lot? Quantity of posting for the two of them is not indicative of anything at all. Particularly for those two.

I've a reassessment about myself slightly unrelated to this game and I would like to follow through on it. The gist of it being that predetermined lims are almost always bad and give scum a lot of space to maneuver. Regardless of thieir post-count, the aimlessness I see is mostly because you have fleeting reads without prior substance. Do you think this would be an intentional move on Shelly's part? Flavor? Both of them feel like stubborn people and I'm not sure of what's left is actually AI.

Dunn
Not Mafia

Geraint
Andres

Shelly
Hank
Johnny

Plusjoyed
Fuzzy
Nopoint
Unwnd

Probably where I'm at.

I'd say at least 2 scum in bottom group, possible scum in that shelly, hank, johnny. But all 3 could be in that bottom.

@unwnd remember, Flavor is saying that all of the Scum are in {plusJOYED, Fuzzy, nopoint, you}. Do you buy that? Because I don’t. Hank should be in everybody’s suspicious or null pile, for example. plusJOYED is actually trying even if I think they have a few things wrong.

He says a ton of things that feel really hard to grasp. I have to read mostly what he's pushing. If I were to separate Flavor from well, himself, I would definitely say that his posts are made only for show. I dislike this innately but I'm giving him space to show me if there's method in the madness or not.

literally talking to each other discrediting me.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dunn
Not Mafia

Geraint
Andres

Shelly
Hank
Johnny

Plusjoyed
Fuzzy
Nopoint
Unwnd

Probably where I'm at.

I'd say at least 2 scum in bottom group, possible scum in that shelly, hank, johnny. But all 3 could be in that bottom.

@unwnd remember, Flavor is saying that all of the Scum are in {plusJOYED, Fuzzy, nopoint, you}. Do you buy that? Because I don’t. Hank should be in everybody’s suspicious or null pile, for example. plusJOYED is actually trying even if I think they have a few things wrong.

I specifically stated at least 2 scum in the bottom group in the post that you quoted, and said "but all 3", why the misrep?

I caught Plusjoyed earlier in the year, and they were trying there too, what's that have to do with it? I specifically stated scum can be in the 3 person group, which includes Hank. That is my suspicious/null pile.

Misrepped me here.

[Flavor Leaf]

If you ask me, I think Flavor needs to more conclusively demonstrate why nopoint makes sense as the execution.

I don't want Nopoint as the execution.

I want Unwnd.

I'm unsure why you keep misrepping my posts? I don't feel like it's on purpose, if that helps, but you probably need to reread my posts.

I did my VCA on Unwnd already to explain Unwnd Scum.

[PlusJOYED]

Vote count 1.Final

with 13 votes in play, it takes 7 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2020-12-14 10:06:13).

elimination

1. Titus [0]:

2. Andresvmb [1]:

geraintm#33

3. unwnd [1]:

Not_Mafia#597

4. Flavor Leaf [1]:

Dunnstral#343

5. Hank Spankems [1]:

unwnd#596

6. shellyc [3]:

nopointinactingup#599, Titus#638, JohnnyFarrar#647

7. PlusJOYED [0]:

8. Not_Mafia [1]:

PlusJOYED#365

9. JohnnyFarrar [0]:

10. geraintm [0]:

11. TheFuzzyLogic99 [0]:

12. Dunnstral [3]:

Flavor Leaf#381, Andresvmb#403, Hank Spankems#602

13. nopointinactingup [1]:

shellyc#587

no elimination [0]:

Not Voting [1]:

TheFuzzyLogic99

mod notes

~ Apologies for lack of VC over the weekend, forgot this day was ending so soon.

Spoiler: vote log

Day 1 vote log

Post 5: Andresvmb votes shellyc
Post 6: Dunnstral votes geraintm
Post 7: shellyc votes Andresvmb
Post 10: PlusJOYED votes shellyc
Post 11: Dunnstral votes unvote
Post 13: unwnd votes TheFuzzyLogic99
Post 19: Not_Mafia votes Not_Mafia
Post 23: nopointinactingup votes Not_Mafia
Post 26: Titus votes nopointinactingup
Post 33: geraintm votes Andresvmb
Post 38: Flavor Leaf votes Not_Mafia
Post 69: Hank Spankems votes Not_Mafia
Post 75: shellyc votes unvote
Post 89: shellyc votes JohnnyFarrar
Post 94: nopointinactingup votes Dunnstral
Post 108: Flavor Leaf votes Dunnstral
Post 149: unwnd votes nopointinactingup
Post 157: Not_Mafia votes nopointinactingup
Post 172: Titus votes shellyc
Post 183: Andresvmb votes unvote
Post 185: shellyc votes Flavor Leaf
Post 186: Flavor Leaf votes Flavor Leaf
Post 228: Flavor Leaf votes unvote
Post 229: JohnnyFarrar votes Flavor Leaf
Post 232: JohnnyFarrar votes Andresvmb
Post 249: Andresvmb votes unwnd
Post 291: shellyc votes unvote
Post 292: shellyc votes unwnd
Post 293: nopointinactingup votes Flavor Leaf
Post 315: Flavor Leaf votes nopointinactingup
Post 339: unwnd votes Flavor Leaf
Post 343: Dunnstral votes Flavor Leaf
Post 359: PlusJOYED votes unvote
Post 365: PlusJOYED votes Not_Mafia
Post 381: Flavor Leaf votes Dunnstral
Post 403: Andresvmb votes Dunnstral
Post 503: Titus votes Flavor Leaf
Post 509: Not_Mafia votes Flavor Leaf
Post 548: nopointinactingup votes Dunnstral
Post 578: JohnnyFarrar votes nopointinactingup
Post 583: JohnnyFarrar votes Not_Mafia
Post 587: shellyc votes nopointinactingup
Post 596: unwnd votes Hank Spankems
Post 597: Not_Mafia votes unwnd
Post 599: nopointinactingup votes shellyc
Post 602: Hank Spankems votes Dunnstral
Post 638: Titus votes shellyc
Post 647: JohnnyFarrar votes shellyc

hmm I thought uwnd and nopoint would vote together but maybe I was wrong

[Flavor Leaf]

I am 90% sure Unwnd is scum, and I would have been okay flipping them with a coinflip odds.

[Flavor Leaf]

770 - unwnd I can’t fully understand what you’re saying here, so I’ll ask some questions.

Who do you think is pushing pre-determined executions? And who are you saying has reads without substance? If you’re speaking about my reads, I very much explained my read on Shellyc towards the beginning of today. Are you complaining about my TRs? I have made some arguments about nopoint before in D1. None of that has really changed.

If you’re speaking about Shellyc, she doesn’t have a choice. She had 3 people as Scum, one of which was NK’ed, one who claimed Cop (with no CC), and the other one who was the result of a check.

I also don’t get what being stubborn has anything to do with it. Flavor and Shellyc are stubborn, yes. So am I. So is Titus. What’s your point?

If you ask me, I think Flavor needs to more conclusively demonstrate why nopoint makes sense as the execution. There were some arguments about how the votes stacked up, but it’s an inscrutable argument because it has to assume that Flavor is Town, and no one knows that but Flavor. If you noticed, Flavor was voted yesterday by a Confirmed Town, and by Dunn/Not_Mafia at one point. Which is why Flavor is throwing shade to the only other person on their wagon. Again, I’m not buying it.

^see 720. And that was about you unwnd, not nopoint. That last paragraph.

[Andresvmb]

What? I didn’t set anything up. That’s ridiculous. I would never have tried to steer the shot towards my Partner there, ever. I would have either kept quiet or agreed with you then, since if I’m Scum you had it all wrong Flavor. I don’t understand why you’re going down this path. Like I said I made a few mistakes, but c’mon you don’t seriously think I get this emotionally invested as Scum. You have said that yourself in the past.

if you thought you were gonna get shot it might've been to set uwnd as the deepwolf or reverse psychology since I said I wouldn't trust you after shooting fuzzy.

Do you really believe I would have trusted unwnd as the deep wolf? If I’m Scum I’ve played it a lot better. I would have used whatever clout I had left with you to try and direct the shot away from the Team, not towards my Partner. The Scum are in a horrendous position right now, where they have to win 2 1v1s to win. Nobody would willingly put themselves here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like Unwnd is also trying to match his progression of me in Xenoblade, but I think it looks fake.

Him and I went at it all Day 1 there, then Day 2 he town read me, and I town read there.

[Andresvmb]

Flavor what the hell are you doing?

[Flavor Leaf]

I have you considering me scum, Dunnstral/Not Mafia will hop on. Im sure Unwnd will hop on. Plus has stated their willingness, Nopoint is voting me, and Andres is setting up a turn as well.

Who do you have?

My gamestate analysis might have been incredibly correct. Nopoint/Unwnd/Andres setup was there to gain momentum on me. I felt it a lot at the time.