TM 2021 Large Normal: OEIS Mafia (Part Two Is Out)

[unwnd]

The read is absolutely true though, I just wasn't satisfied naked voting though

[implosion]

A001371: Number of n-bead necklaces with beads of 2 colors and primitive period n, when turning over is allowed.

1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 6, 8, 16, 24, 42, 69, 124, 208, 378, 668, 1214, 2220, 4110, 7630, 14308, 26931, 50944, 96782, 184408, 352450, 675180, 1296477, 2493680, 4805388, 9272778, 17919558, 34669600, 67156800, 130215996, 252741255, 490984464, 954629662, 1857545298

Link

Vote Count 1.11

AGar

(4): Titus, Cephrir, Dannflor, Ythan

Titus

(3): AGar, innocentvillager, the worst

Ythan

(2): Almost50, DrippingGoofball

the worst

(1): Albert B. Rampage

Winter Flakes

(1): hercule

innocentvillager

(1): Dunnstral

JacksonVirgo

(1): Winter Flakes

hercule

(1): JacksonVirgo

Xtoxm

(1): OkaPoka

Hopkirk

(1): unwnd

unwnd

(1): Hopkirk

Not Voting

(1): Xtoxm

With 18 alive, it takes 10 votes to eliminate. Deadline is set for January 29, 5:00 PM PST, in (expired on 2021-01-29 21:00:00).

[Cephrir]

jeez idk ive played like 1 game with hopkirk but i thought he was kinda lighthearted and funny all the time so this sudden anger is pretty jarring for me and i don't want to piss him off more because i get uncomfortable with confrontation but i gotta admit i had the same gut reaction as dgb

[DrippingGoofball]

I am a bit fascinated by this push on hopkirk from unwnd.

And I'm fascinated by the reaction.

[DrippingGoofball]

We can discuss whether the anger came from a scum place or a town place until sundown without coming to an agreement.

But to me, it sounds pretty scummy because it's missing all the townie soundbites that I would have vomited all over the disagreement.

[hercule]

what did menalaqe say. last time i'm asking this

Why is this what you care about the most?

because i know menal doesn't scumread me here so why are you pretending he does?

this is very explicitly a playstyle point that 3 people who i've never played with have decided is scummy after discussing it with someone who knows it's town indicative or NAI at worse? bullshit. that discussion didn't happen and you're faking that it did.

so I have two thoughts here, first one is I don't really see this as a scummy reaction as a couple ppl are saying (DGB, Cephrir). I know some people scumread AtE de facto but this felt genuine to me, like it comes across that Hopkirk genuinely doesn't believe menal would scumread them and I also think there are circumstances that we can't really discuss that made the claim of most of unwnd's team having legit read hopkirk and come up with that read a bit unbelievable. it just doesn't feel like a faked perspective to me.

I am a bit fascinated by this push on hopkirk from unwnd. I townread hopkirk, though I presume when you say he "silvertongued me" that you mean he is pocketing me. I'm not seeing what you are seeing,

and suggesting that they are trying to prove a point when they speak, being petty, ridiculing things they think are dumb isn't scum-indicative for me, if anything it's town-indicative.

I am also curious as to the comment that "almost all" of your teammates scumread Hopkirk / agree with the vote. Can we get rundown of each one's thoughts in particular and how much of the game they have read? Doesn't have to be longform just a general idea

I think that's just perspective. The scathing criticism would be more potent if it lead to something, or had some greater purpose. I came away from this interaction pretty confused in the way he addressed my points, instead of focusing on singular tells based on if I was lying about my whole team agreeing if he were scum or not. It's all very showy and presentation-oriented. As far as the others, me and Mena went back and forth about a few things with me just mostly leading on my logic which turned into minor complaints about how I think scum play in very boring ways and that I'd be disappointing if my read actually turned out to be correct. Amy replaced out and Maria agreed with me when I was just like 'yeah I think he's scum', but I was biding my time to see what Hopkirk would do before I came back to it.

The result was nothing.

the other thing is, I think that unwnd knows that their case is weak, i.e. they admitted it was lazy, but they wanted to out it in the thread regardless on a player that didn't have any suspicion on them, that feels +town to me to use a mafiascum term, and their explanation about the conversations they have feels plausible even if they overstated the strength of their teammate's reads. obviously, unwnd is not going to be able to lead a wagon on hopkirk from their suspicion alone, and I think they know that. But I will do them the respect of considering their stance when I ISO hop.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Cephrir if you had my vote who would you want me to place it on

[Ythan]

question for @Ythan - how do your teammates read our interactions?

I will ask.

[Hopkirk]

jeez idk ive played like 1 game with hopkirk but i thought he was kinda lighthearted and funny all the time so this sudden anger is pretty jarring for me and i don't want to piss him off more because i get uncomfortable with confrontation but i gotta admit i had the same gut reaction as dgb

which game are you talking about? last year's team mafia right? what do you remember about my play that game?

[Hopkirk]

i'm not really online, i'm doing stuff over discord with friends. one happens to be hectic who dropped some thoughts. that's going to be fun sometime

[OkaPoka]

hercule lets use the power of friendship to make hopkirk and unwnd friends at least for today

[Cephrir]

Cephrir if you had my vote who would you want me to place it on

Well, naturally, I'm voting the person I most want to vote. But pressuring hopkirk is something I'd be more likely to do with your vote than my own so he'd yell at you and not me. :p

[Cephrir]

jeez idk ive played like 1 game with hopkirk but i thought he was kinda lighthearted and funny all the time so this sudden anger is pretty jarring for me and i don't want to piss him off more because i get uncomfortable with confrontation but i gotta admit i had the same gut reaction as dgb

which game are you talking about? last year's team mafia right? what do you remember about my play that game?

Yes.

Not that much except that your opening here was in character and unsurprising to me; I feel like most of that game followed a similar path to where you started here and I remember town leaning you pretty much the whole time we were both alive.

[Hopkirk]

jeez idk ive played like 1 game with hopkirk but i thought he was kinda lighthearted and funny all the time so this sudden anger is pretty jarring for me and i don't want to piss him off more because i get uncomfortable with confrontation but i gotta admit i had the same gut reaction as dgb

which game are you talking about? last year's team mafia right? what do you remember about my play that game?

Yes.

Not that much except that your opening here was in character and unsurprising to me; I feel like most of that game followed a similar path to where you started here and I remember town leaning you pretty much the whole time we were both alive.

so last year i went on many long drunked rants where i was telling everyone who was voting for me that they were bad at the game while swearing at them a lot
then you voted me off, i flipped town, then you flipped my top scumread the next day and we won
you don't remember that? it feels memorable. i got very drunk and angry.

[Hopkirk]

that townleans ceph more for me, hectic agrees

[innocentvillager]

hercule lets use the power of friendship to make hopkirk and unwnd friends at least for today

random note but i was trying to remember what game we played together and i found it (did we play more?? idk)

good times <3

[OkaPoka]

never bring up pre 2018 okapoka those were some darker times

[innocentvillager]

ikik same but what a g a l a x y b r a i n scum win that was

[Cephrir]

jeez idk ive played like 1 game with hopkirk but i thought he was kinda lighthearted and funny all the time so this sudden anger is pretty jarring for me and i don't want to piss him off more because i get uncomfortable with confrontation but i gotta admit i had the same gut reaction as dgb

which game are you talking about? last year's team mafia right? what do you remember about my play that game?

Yes.

Not that much except that your opening here was in character and unsurprising to me; I feel like most of that game followed a similar path to where you started here and I remember town leaning you pretty much the whole time we were both alive.

so last year i went on many long drunked rants where i was telling everyone who was voting for me that they were bad at the game while swearing at them a lot
then you voted me off, i flipped town, then you flipped my top scumread the next day and we won
you don't remember that? it feels memorable. i got very drunk and angry.

oh that sounds vaguely familiar i guess

[OkaPoka]

ikik same but what a g a l a x y b r a i n scum win that was

mechanically id still make similar plays but oh god the way i posted was so cringy

[Albert B. Rampage]

Hopkirk if you had my vote who would you want me to vote

[Titus]

Maybe it's my own impatience but I've mulling over my vote on AGar and came to my own conclusion he isn't going to respond. The game has changed and so too is the way I read most players. Back in the day I'd come through their words to spot contradictions but I find scum nowadays don't really give a shit about making convincing arguments, no, it's more about the presentation. Something that makes townies go 'well, by effort and substantiation he must be town!' because people have gotten so traumatized by a red PM these days and believe scum just won't effort as much as town that it's almost bordering ridiculous. I am against this mindset because it assumes that people enjoy losing, which I'm pretty sure if you're playing any game the objective is to win.

This vote is something almost all of my team agree on. I don't really bode well with (post) (post) (post) analysis and instead giving a general description of what I see. As for what I see? I sorta let it slide but there was a moment where Hopkirk responded to me saying 'i kinda like to work list up and then down first, getting townreads'. This is fine in practice, yet he remained quite passive-aggressive. I also think that line alone is disingenuous but is playing a part of his style right now, which all seems quite excessive to me. I think Hopkirk in that instance only responded that way because it sounded good, not that he really believed it. If his MO was to look for townies and form townblocks, then what is his explanation of splintered ridicule throughout the ISO. The shift in dynamic doesn't bode with his own words. Go look at the way he silver tongues Hercule then ridicules others. This is not paraphrasing but this man really said 'don't like it when there's consequence for your actions, huh?' It's all based on

proving a point

which is both petty and scummy.

It'd be really easy and really lazy to say 'he is being LAMISTy' but seriously that's boring and using umbrella terms like that caution back to the days where people would do things like Why me = Fry me. Mafia Jargon doesn't make someone scum guys, and I actually think scum are more prone to be lazy about their reads because it's pretty difficult to try and convince people.

I am confused.

You say scum don't give up, but they don't try and convince people. This is contradictory. Can you clarify?

[Hopkirk]

Hopkirk if you had my vote who would you want me to vote

i'm going to need until end of Saturday to let you know. i've been looking for town so far.

[Titus]

Ythan
Almost50
Cephrir
innocentvillager
Hopkirk
Dannflor
hercule
OkaPoka
Dunnstral

townreads in no specific order. i'll sort through all the isos on saturday

I can agree with IV Dannflor Hercule A50 and OkaPoka (based on Chennisden). Maybe Dunnstral and Cephir but weaker there.

It seems to be a good list overall.

[unwnd]

Maybe it's my own impatience but I've mulling over my vote on AGar and came to my own conclusion he isn't going to respond. The game has changed and so too is the way I read most players. Back in the day I'd come through their words to spot contradictions but I find scum nowadays don't really give a shit about making convincing arguments, no, it's more about the presentation. Something that makes townies go 'well, by effort and substantiation he must be town!' because people have gotten so traumatized by a red PM these days and believe scum just won't effort as much as town that it's almost bordering ridiculous. I am against this mindset because it assumes that people enjoy losing, which I'm pretty sure if you're playing any game the objective is to win.

This vote is something almost all of my team agree on. I don't really bode well with (post) (post) (post) analysis and instead giving a general description of what I see. As for what I see? I sorta let it slide but there was a moment where Hopkirk responded to me saying 'i kinda like to work list up and then down first, getting townreads'. This is fine in practice, yet he remained quite passive-aggressive. I also think that line alone is disingenuous but is playing a part of his style right now, which all seems quite excessive to me. I think Hopkirk in that instance only responded that way because it sounded good, not that he really believed it. If his MO was to look for townies and form townblocks, then what is his explanation of splintered ridicule throughout the ISO. The shift in dynamic doesn't bode with his own words. Go look at the way he silver tongues Hercule then ridicules others. This is not paraphrasing but this man really said 'don't like it when there's consequence for your actions, huh?' It's all based on

proving a point

which is both petty and scummy.

It'd be really easy and really lazy to say 'he is being LAMISTy' but seriously that's boring and using umbrella terms like that caution back to the days where people would do things like Why me = Fry me. Mafia Jargon doesn't make someone scum guys, and I actually think scum are more prone to be lazy about their reads because it's pretty difficult to try and convince people.

I am confused.

You say scum don't give up, but they don't try and convince people. This is contradictory. Can you clarify?

Not a great post and I apologize. Focus on our interaction instead and tell me what you think

Just think of that post as necessary filler