TM 2021 Large Normal: OEIS Mafia (Part Two Is Out)

[the worst]

I assumed 1644 was a shitpost, lol

[unwnd]

If Hopkirk is secretly a jokey shitposter I'm uh

Not seeing it

I've been reading this as if I've threatened his whole being and I must pay

Like yeah I scumread you, but I'm not going to condemn your slot immediately

[OkaPoka]

bleh

anyways i was thinking maybe abr collecting townreads might be scum TMI'ng him? from what i hear is abr is someone you don't want to make an enemy out of and i dont think townies are going to be thinking much about who they want to make enemies out of early d1

[the worst]

I think 1644 is still talking about a towntell

[the worst]

If Hopkirk is secretly a jokey shitposter I'm uh

Not seeing it

so to be clear I think that post is satirizing your perceived disbelief at him not being able to post more often

I think he flits between serious and jokey at the drop of a hat but it's still worth calling what you see and whatever

[Cephrir]

mmm okay we think we know what you're talking about @Hopkirk, but we're not entirely sure. only thing that peta wants to say is that if it's what we're postulating at is that he thinks unwnd has more integrity than what we think you're accusing him of. spf thinks it's such a specific/complex thought process from you that it probably is town indicative.

and this convo is now so far in the weeds that I am considering it closed.

o have no idea what this conversation is about but it sure smells like angleshooting

[Cephrir]

so now that i've done my amazing response to 1616 this & his previous stuff is pretty much an outright scumclaim from unwnd.

it's not, and furthermore shut up.

[Cephrir]

oh i guess it's a joke well shut up anyway i guess.

[OkaPoka]

maybe hopkirk needs one of those avatar upgrades

[unwnd]

If Hopkirk wants to find understanding through jokey shitposting I'm not like against it

Or combing through my words

Either one is fine

[the worst]

oh i guess it's a joke well shut up anyway i guess.

I feel this

pedit: yeah I think he's just upset about being scumread when he feels he's playing a towny game so he's reacting through ridicule; I don't feel like it's super ai, it'd help if you could explain what you're scumreading, but I think this is just something that rides out

[Hopkirk]

Yeah sure, I'll play hardball.

I want to take away from the things I said in my #1250. Not repeating myself but this point to me is very integral to my thought, and generally speaking I do maintain that I don't like highlighting specific posts and instead create a general picture.

Hopkirk's demeanor on the surface seems OK, but when it comes to aggression it all becomes merely proving a point. I believe that the former is a merely a veil and something he uses to establish tonal presence in the game, which is something I very much expect scum to do.

I

t's one thing to just be a happy/friendly guy but the way he uses said friendliness just gives me the absolute creeps. Compare his earlygame to now and it's like he was tired of putting up the front. The poking and observing he was making in relation to what was going on all feels manufacted

, such as the way he navigates coming around to Hercule (you can look at ISO if you want).

Actions speak louder than words, and maybe Hopkirk is aware of that.

I think Hopkirk display a lot of self-consciousness if you dig into the way he words his posts to people as well. Just a ton of 'oh haha, was joking' or a necessity to over-explain an interaction by adding two more unprompted posts.

How do I make this more clear? When I'm scum and I know I don't really believe what I'm saying, the best thing I can do is pretend it matters to me. Yet, referring back to what I said before.

What does Hopkirk really have to show for his activity early on? Why is he not here and keeping up the same pace. I'm sure there will be a hipfire response from Hopkirk saying 'I'm just busy!

Your case on me sucked! Grrrr' but I think my point absolutely stands.

The pressure is on himself and I think he's playing a game he hates to be in. Sure, call that a stretch by why would me calling him out with a shitpush just boil his blood so much?

Probably because scum feel indignant towards townies and don't wanna feel like they're catching onto them. Is this confbiased on my end? Maybe a little, but it should make you all realize that Hopkirk is only looking out for himself and everything he did earlier on was fake, and time has only solidified that stance.

how much are you engaging with menal here? me + multiple people who've played with me have told you that this isn't unusual. you skated around the question i asked you many many times about menal's thoughts that you intentionally decided not to engage with

this is too unspecific to respond to?

You're saying a lot of things that you're linking to be 'scum indicative' that are very much present in my towngame. how are you forming the link of 'x behavious is scummy so hop is scummy for it' without considering that it's probably just a personality tell since people have told you that's how i normally post and engage with the game?

like honestly this is shit. i literally spent the entire day across two games on saturday, more into this one, then more time on sunday. how the fuck do you expect me to do that when i clearly have a job and i've mentioned very clearly that i am busy in evenings? want my weekly schedule during the current pandemic? here. it's not very exciting.

9am-5pm every week day - work
7pm-12pm+ on tuesday/thursday - playing mafia/social deception games/other games with friends
7pm-somewhere between 10-12pm fortnightly (finished at 10 today) DnD campaign i'm Dming, including hectic and flopz as players (and zaiden planning to join next time, i'm not going to explain in depth why he's able to do it now when he initially wasn't sure)
sunday - DnD for most of the day. no MS friends involved in this. did not happen last sunday

Monday/Friday evening - days i can potentially do this stuff. amount of this time i can dedicate to mafia depends on general stress levels and if i want and/or need to do something else during the evenings
this saturday evening - plans with friends
saturday during the day - as per monday/friday evenings

it was quite a bit more varied pre pandemic, but this is roughly what it'll look like until the current lockdown is over. i don't currently have any holiday booked from work but i'll probably try and book some at the end of feb. i'll be sure to let you know in advance if this is the case

maybe you haven't noticed which post you made that made be actually angry. i'll quote it. then the rest where you decide to stick to it. hint, it's the one where you decide to ignore me and act superior about it. that turned my response from joking to pissed off

quick proof that this is my town play btw, take a look at my engagement with Lady L in Death curse: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=84709
this is pretty typical. she pushes me for garbage reasons including and mostly limited to 'dropped his posting gimmick when he realized it was impossible to maintain and actually play the game too' i hard townread her while continually throwing passive aggressive shit and shade at her. here's a fairly typical post of me throwing shade of the kind i was throwing early game. it doesn't get angry like my responses to unwnd because i wasn't angry and i'm not talking about my response to UW here - i'm talking about the stuff that he initially had a problem with me for (including my jokey shade being apparently scum-indicative for me). please note, this is just one example, it's very common and unwnd's partner menal who should know this is why my read on unwnd isn't as strong as my other trs now:

Currently I'm not the biggest fan of lady. Don't get me wrong, I think she's obvtown here, the bit I don't like is the whole 'look at me' ego thing.

Fortunately, I have a strategy to address this. I know I was planning to do more stuff tomorrow, but I feel like a much more valuable use of my time (in addition hopefully rather than instead of) is going to be reading up on lady a bit.

I've already found the perfect straying point. I plan to have a quick deep dive into lady's thoughts and perspectives on relationships. This feels like a great starting point where we can begin to build a better, more cooperative and sustainable working relationship.

I'm not entirely sure what I'm hoping to get out of this, and there's several hundred posts worth of content that I'll need to get through, but I'm fully expecting it to be both incredibly productive and only about half as creepy as it sounds.

[Titus]

I have stopped reading H v U.

[unwnd]

I feel like your response to me boils down to 'check with Mena on my meta, btw here's my meta and I'm very busy'

OK, that's fine. Understandable. I have a lot of time on my hands but that doesn't mean you do. That isn't what I was trying to explain. You could spend your time more efficiently or in ways that I would percieve to be townie. If you felt my argument was semantics then you could've addressed that, but instead I now know your life schedule because ????

[Dannflor]

I have stopped reading H v U.

nice

[Hopkirk]

3- unwnd has said all of his team agreed with voting me
4- look at who's on his team. look at who's on my team

i could be misremembering but didn't we like specifically establish that he said 'nearly all' or something like that

it's irrelevant to my read on unwnd, it's relevant to my earlier mindset before i realized it wasn't his 'whole team'. vaguely relevant to other stuff after that, but not meaningfully

3- unwnd has said all of his team agreed with voting me
4- look at who's on his team. look at who's on my team

i could be misremembering but didn't we like specifically establish that he said 'nearly all' or something like that

I still feel like this is a really sloppy misstep to make for scum!unwnd and doesn't actually lend any credibility to their push on you

duck
IV, dgb, unwnd
Dunnstral (I like him but I'm sheeping)
Oka, Cephrir, Hercule
Dannflor, Flakes, A50, Ythan
Titus, AGar, Hopkirk
JacksonVirgo, ABR
Xtoxm

I'm probably wrong on someone in the 4p core, they're my adorable weak town tonereads

actually this reads list feels weird when i take it with the thing you posted about struggling to get scumreads that i thought was townie since it feels like you very much do have scumreads...

can you explain what each person did that makes you want to think they're town - especially for the bottom 6. just like a single sentence/point is fine since you just said it felt like there was reasons to like everyone and... i'm not sure i get that impression from the couple of pages of posting from you here?
also interested in your reads on Flakes/A50 and why they're there. I'm assuming that's around a town-lean?

god I feel like I've already roundabout done this but I also recall you being a fan of making people do work so yeet

dann, flakes, A50, Ythan are there because all four of them have given me underwhelming tonal townpings. I feel like Dann hasn't been suffering silliness in a way that detracts from his ability to pocket. I feel like Flakes has defaulted to prickly & earnest before assertive which pings me as coming from a genuine mindset. I think A50 is drawing an absurd amount of attention to himself in a game which he might be able to deepwolf which is a very strange things to do as scum, but I don't understand his reads at all and he's not actually doing anything technically towny. Ythan seemed to respond kinda fine to pressure earlier and has slipped into a bunch of townpools so :shrug:

JV I'm legitimately struggling to townread but I also don't really outright scumread them atp? like I don't really pick up what they're putting down but I'm also just having a really hard time parsing it.

ABR I give exactly 0 fucks about but he seems really widely townread???

Xtoxm is the only person who I think is like, overtly scummy and it's really only because his Titus read felt too flourishy and underconsidered. Even then I'm surprised by that because he's technically a strong scum player, and he clearly wanted the read to look good.

Think of that readlist as an effort to solve bottom-down and I think it makes a lot more sense.

you probably have already done it, but i want to look at this summary while i'm going back through your iso on saturday. i kind of had the impression a lot of these were nully to you which is why i asked when i realized 'hang on, does TW read the game that way, they've given a readlist and it reminds me that they do kinda have a lot of neutral reads right?' not sure how i feel about your slot. should help sorting/looking at your mindset then

mmm okay we think we know what you're talking about @Hopkirk, but we're not entirely sure. only thing that peta wants to say is that if it's what we're postulating at is that he thinks unwnd has more integrity than what we think you're accusing him of. spf thinks it's such a specific/complex thought process from you that it probably is town indicative.

and this convo is now so far in the weeds that I am considering it closed.

it's not relevant to this game as it doesn't make me scumread unwnd
it might help understand part of why i was irritated with him. that + his 'lol fuck you i don't need to answer your questions' response when i asked him about it

[innocentvillager]

hot take Hopkirk v unwnd is SvS

[the worst]

hopkirk, do you have breakfast? when is dinnertime?

[Dannflor]

hot take Hopkirk v unwnd is SvS

also nice

[hercule]

hopkirk, do you have breakfast? when is dinnertime?

LMAO chillll

[OkaPoka]

only way hopkirk v unwnd is svs is if hopkirk really wanted to advertise his dnd campaign

[hercule]

only way hopkirk v unwnd is svs is if hopkirk really wanted to advertise his dnd campaign

yeah I think I need to hear more about the campaign to really sort him

[Dannflor]

7pm-12pm+ on tuesday/thursday - playing mafia/social deception games/other games with friends

plays mafia for 17 hours but cant be here for all of them?

eliminate all liars

[Hopkirk]

I assumed 1644 was a shitpost, lol

yep

If Hopkirk is secretly a jokey shitposter I'm uh

Not seeing it

I've been reading this as if I've threatened his whole being and I must pay

Like yeah I scumread you, but I'm not going to condemn your slot immediately

i think i mentioned it in a previous post: menal has played twice with me. i have jokey shitposted in every game for the last two years except

maybe

for 1 where i subbed in midgame (thus losing the early game pure shitposting time) and was more concerned with proving that a 'new player' was secretly a hectic alt (they were)... also because nobody else seemed to be doing setup spec and i had to stop people voting off multiple townreads. that was not a fun game because it felt like i was screaming into the void the whole time. menal wasn't in it though

i'm seriously confused if menal hasn't pointed out i'm a jokey shitposter because
- we've played together several times
- in one of those games we were shot by a town vig because they thought the hectic/hopkirk/flopz hydra was making too many jokey shitposts. i am 100% sure he is aware of this
- in another (ydrasse's one that just finished) multiple players in this game and that one can confirm my style
- we might have played a third time but not sure, could have just been 2 because i can't place a third. doesn't matter either way
- menal has actively responded to 2-4 threads where i've made ~1500 word jokey shitposts by quoting his response from the previous ones. he knows i'm a jokey shitposter and i don't get how he hasn't told you (... but scum menal would have told you here ugh)

-if you want to see my style check my wiki page. i made that post instead of scumhunting that day in mid game. yeah.

I think 1644 is still talking about a towntell

i don't think any of 1644 was serious?

If Hopkirk is secretly a jokey shitposter I'm uh

Not seeing it

so to be clear I think that post is satirizing your perceived disbelief at him not being able to post more often

I think he flits between serious and jokey at the drop of a hat but it's still worth calling what you see and whatever

see death curse where a lot of people thought this was scum indicative from hop and it objectively wasn't. this is personality. i throw in the memey posts in an almost worryingly compulsive manner.

[hercule]

7pm-12pm+ on tuesday/thursday - playing mafia/social deception games/other games with friends

plays mafia for 17 hours but cant be here for all of them?

eliminate all liars

um he clearly said 7pm-12pm, thats 5 hours, why are you being willfully ignorant of his schedule? scumclaiming?