Micro 998 | The Binding of Isaac Mafia | Game Over

[Ydrasse]

Genuinely sorry about 844 by the way-it did describe how I feel/felt but having read the full post now I 100% would not make that in hindsight

it's okay, i just don't find this game like... yeah.

can you just, succinctly write up at some point why you think i'm the flip? i know the reasons are spread out throughout your iso most likely, or if there are some you haven't posted could you do that, or like. like 844, why is what i am posting not doing it for you? what do you take issue with?

my issue with interacting with you/reading through your iso to see these things is that i feel a lot of it gets eaten up by like, you just saying elim me, yeet me, etc, and it's like. difficult to really... fight against someone saying that repeatedly, and it's even more draining because i do think you're most likely town and i don't know what the disconnect is between us.

[Costello]

Essentially, I find everyone but you hardtown in ways that I think are out of their range.

Spoiler: Specifically for each player

madeline's weird progression around me, some of the interactions with Gamma. Flea's reaction to you pushing them, fae's treatment of madeline, and Flea's mechanical solution. Farkran's progression/interactions with Gamma are pretty bad but his reads Day 1 were quite natural and organic in a way that I think he really struggles to fake as scum. The saving grace for Farkscum here would be that early on, with the game wide open, it's a bit easier for him to just work forwards/react to things organically inthread, and here we're very much limited to the early game. bugspray is a lot more of a crapshoot but I townlean them based off the bodyguard claim/them clearly having not read catboi at all. Hectic's progression around Gamma was quite good imo-at times defending him but at others very aggressive, and

correctly

aggressive in reaction to bad Gamma posts.

In contrast, I think the reasons for you being town are mostly based off tonal oneliners that are trivial to fake, and the interaction with Gamma was far from clearing even if you look decent from it. Instinctively, I also think the engagement with Flea was in bad faith, but I'd need more meta on you to really get to the bottom of that.

[Costello]

Just to be clear: The above is just what I'm currently thinking/based off what I've seen from this game: I'll revisit Flea's meta and compare it to this game for you when I can.

[Ydrasse]

the main games i'm basing my meta off of are here and here.

i don't think booneytunez will give you much, because i didn't post a lot on that hydra (rei and asuka, i'm rei), but in private when talking about the game flea wasn't in my personal solves and though fae got eliminated, we weren't on that wagon because, yeah; though i didn't interact a lot from reading flea fae felt more genuine to me that game coming off of ss. silent star is the meat of my feelings though and there are more actual interactions there to read.

[Ydrasse]

like, idk, maybe it's frustrating to me because i don't feel like it's bad faith since the same thing is happening again except this time i don't spend half a game dismissing my paranoia on flea, and this time i'm trying to make an effort to verbalize why instead of saying, gutping, paranoia, etc.

and i don't think my reasons are bare/weak, like, they're in the context of my interactions w flea and those interactions feel bad, like i'm being taken out of context and twisted in a very subtle fashion, and a lot of that is how flea's posts present (and like, i feel bad about being wrong on this bc i like... i don't want flea to not act like faerself during a game bc of this sort of stuff) in this dramatic way that play up when people do something ""bad"" or something to jump upon, and when it comes to continuing on when interacting w that person just slowly drop in things to make faerself look better. idk. i'm willing to admit i might be tunneled but for playing w someone who has seen me before i don't get the things fae's saying about my game at all.

[Ydrasse]

and also like... whether or not you're the de facto leader of this game, you've claimed in essence a shot on scum which does make you one imo; there's some paranoia but like, it doesn't make sense to consider you as scum unless it's necessary i think? or at least, that's how i'm treating my tinfoil theory on you. and so people listen. and it's just another thing on the table for me i guess, to have someone who has this status in the game keep pushing on me is like...

idk, i don't know you as a player but it doesn't seem like (@costello obvi. i should make this stuff clear) you're really reconsidering any of them + have locked into your reads for the day and that's that. that's the impression i get from you and now we're ~talking~ more at least so maybe that can change.

[Ydrasse]

it's also like, the mech plan, the thing about it is is that if the right prs are town in it (pt checker, the neighborizer?/closing neighborhood, whatever) it makes sense to kill me which. sucks. i get it but it just sucks. and this all feels for not.

[Costello]

When I said "instinctively seems in bad faith" I meant more that I found fae's reaction very natural and town-indicative, but that you willfully chose not to see that. And yeah, if you're town that's just not the case, and hopefully by getting a better background on Flea I can see that.

I don't think your points were outright wrong/bad, but that's only half the story if that makes sense.

I definitely feel confident, and perhaps wrongly so, but I have read the entire game through 6x and will do so at least twice more, and easily another 5+ if it goes past today. Arguably that's worse if I'm wrong on you given how much time I've sank, but rest assured I will go over every inch of every post you want me to look at-and then some.

[Ydrasse]

no, like, there's part of me that recognizes that i might be tunneled, but i also don't want to ignore the feelings that i had in a previous game when that could have cost me that one. it'd feel wrong. flea could be town here, but i just don't... get that. and i know that pings are very nebulous too which isn't a very helpful case but if it worked before for reading a specific person i'm inclined to trust it again.

i don't really know what else to say to your confidence right now though because i /know/ that it's wrong, and i have opinions on who it's wrong on but i don't know if you'll really reconsider that i guess until the proof that you are wrong is dished out, i guess? that sounds mean and i really don't intend it to be like that, but, that's just how it is for me rn.

don't wear yourself down over one game though, if you're mafia'd out it's best to give it a rest, don't reread it those other five times, maybe once or twice or something since it is short but, yeah.

[Flea The Magician]

Phoneposting

I HATE when people call bad faith on things. I know exactly what ydrasse is talking about, and yeah she's 100% on she was constantly calling her paranoia on me.

Thing there was "I don't know what it is... But it is". Over here she's trying to use meta arguments against me. I know people are going to meta dive, I have all my games on my wiki page, as well as various health conditions that do have an impact on my play and can often make me inconsistent - these don't dismiss my play, just provide some insight.

In this game I am WAY less fluffy than I usually am as either alignment and it's a site wide trend at the moment that I've lost my fluff. If anything that should make me easier to read :p

Ngl it blows being the logical elimination. Because mechanically that's me rn as the anomaly.
I know I'm town, I'm confident Madeline is as everyone else is pretty much clear. Bugspray will in theory protect Farkran tonight, Farkran investigates them and either me or you are eliminated.

Ngl I'm going to fight to survive. I loving this game <3

[Flea The Magician]

Going to reread my PT with Madeline, but that I recall she's been quite well guarded and hasn't attempted to convince me of much. Basically treated it as a neighbourhood where I'm not alignment confirmed.

[Farkran]

Thanks for your answer, ydrasse. I have to say that i disagree with your game strategy, but as a player i must also admit that eliminating the people you have a hard time reading is often better than eliminating your highest scumreads.

There's two things i feel from you, the first and main reason why i don't scumread you is that your tone is as pristine as it can get. If there is one thing that i don't see coming from you is bad faith - all of your arguments sound true and despite other people saying otherwise, i believe you are being honest to yourself.

The second thing though is that this is exactly the position i would expect from scum!you, i.e. rn you do not have a strong stance on anyone except flea and yet you would have been happy to wagon me instead of pursuing your one and only scumread. This is what pings me right now and i think you could help your case by taking a more clear stance on the other players.

For instance, how satisfied would you be if today ended in a bugspray elim?

[bugspray]

i did have a strong tr on catboi and really considered bging him but thought there was no way scum doesn't shoot costello hence my dismay at the beginning of today

[Ydrasse]

i have defined stances in my head and i outlined them vaguely but to be more concise it’s

(hectic, costello***)
(farkran, bugspray)
(flea, madeline)

bugspray right now isn’t someone i’d prefer but that’s more for mechanical reasons; i can’t really read them this game and if they’re town i don’t want to get rid of our protective. content wise i don’t get pulled one way or another strong enough to care if they were elimmed if it was based just on that. actually that’s a lie, thinking about it when i’m being pinged elsewhere more heavily gives me less reason to want to elim them. also in theory i think if they’re mafia claiming protective if we get down to 3p with them still around it might be a little telling? unless mafia gets frisky with what they’re doing at night but, yeah.

[Ydrasse]

the thing about madeline is that we share the same theory on costello right now which, i don’t know what that says about madeline to me. like, she’s right, it’s convenient for costello how things played out and it’s a power move and a half if he is mafia but what would that like... how does it play out?

i’ve been thinking about this a bit like my mind keeps going to this theory, maf!costello picks catboi to work with, he sets up the crumbs because like he doesn’t have a choice w/o looking scummy to catboi i think? they discuss it privately, and like. the thing is is that we don’t actually know if catboi deferred to costello; we’re just taking his word for it right now. catboi didn’t get a chance to talk with anyone about what happened in the pt, it’s entirely possible that costello was defending gamma and then they disagreed, and post flip they’re stuck in there together until catboi gets shot — in this world too there’s rarely going to be a protective/watcher/etc on catboi, only the person who’s in the spotlight.

i think that might explain the lack of reroll from catboi too? like it’s already chaotic but also you don’t wanna give mafia another role/power when they’ve used what they’ve got.

[Ydrasse]

that is very... convoluted though, and we don’t have proof of it going down like that but that’s basically my asterisks next to costello this game.

it just seems easier to like... treat costello as town despite this for now and deal with that world when/if we need to.

[Ydrasse]

oh actually, catboi’s ability was a day ability so he couldn’t have even rerolled if he wanted to, my bad

[Ydrasse]

i almost want that theory to be true though because, what a play if so

[Ydrasse]

Phoneposting

I HATE when people call bad faith on things. I know exactly what ydrasse is talking about, and yeah she's 100% on she was constantly calling her paranoia on me.

Thing there was "I don't know what it is... But it is". Over here she's trying to use meta arguments against me. I know people are going to meta dive, I have all my games on my wiki page, as well as various health conditions that do have an impact on my play and can often make me inconsistent - these don't dismiss my play, just provide some insight.

In this game I am WAY less fluffy than I usually am as either alignment and it's a site wide trend at the moment that I've lost my fluff. If anything that should make me easier to read :p

Ngl it blows being the logical elimination. Because mechanically that's me rn as the anomaly.
I know I'm town, I'm confident Madeline is as everyone else is pretty much clear. Bugspray will in theory protect Farkran tonight, Farkran investigates them and either me or you are eliminated.

Ngl I'm going to fight to survive. I loving this game <3

also: it isn’t just meta, that i am reading you on. like, the contents of your posts irrespective of that ping me; i’ve pointed out that really dramatic one where you made text big, the place where you call me paranoia, little things here and there that i would dislike from your posting whether or not we had played together before.

i’m using meta against you, but not just that, and even /that/ is the very sort of thing that i’m talking about with your posting flea. it’s reductive to elements that are part of things sure, but ignore the context of what i’m actually doing or only say the bare minimum about me.

[Farkran]

I want to do flea today and investigate ydrasse

[Flea The Magician]

I'm going on what I remember at the moment, I don't remember making a big post...

[Flea The Magician]

In fairness I think its within us 4, barring a play like above requiring some mega orbs, town wins.

[Flea The Magician]

OK the bold caps wasn't just aimed at you ydrasse. It was more me finding something amusing. The paranoia I feel was a legitimate tell, given you'd been quite chill all game then reacted to the unvote as you did, that was some amazing aggression from nowhere and you immediately fell back quite passive.

UNVOTE:

how am i not engaged in this game though? where do you see that?

what of my posts isn't a lot coming from me? i'll give you the ones where i explicitly /said/ i wasn't going to post a lot yesterday but like

i literally have the third highest post count LMFAO

no no, why are you backing off now that i'm calling you out on this?

That you had the 3rd highest count and were that forgettable to me says what I thought of your content at the time if I felt you were distant.

I'm happy locktowning madeline based on our PT. To the point I've even said in the PT I am never trusting them again if they're a baddie.

[Flea The Magician]

VOTE: Ydrasse
In the pool of uncleared peeps, you;re the only one that makes sense for me to eliminate. Lets do this

[Flea The Magician]

Anyone not on me or Ydrasse needs to have some solid reasoning IMO, Bugspray is not a viable elimination due to being a protective, Madeline can be done, but eh. I don't feel much happens there information wise.

Whoever of me and ydrasse isn't eliminated should be investigated. Bugspray should be protecting Farkran.