newbie 2060: creatures, game ofer

[unwnd]

I don't have a godtier town read on Ivy.

I'm not going to try to dig into this again until maybe tonight. But, here's my bedrock assumptions

I really can't conceive of Bell not being scum.

I would be hammered by now if he were replace-out town and left a vote on me.

I'd be yelling about your not unvoting me, except if Luke and Ivy were both scum this game would be over already.

Egix is cop-cleared town. There's no third option here.

So

Egix (cop clear)
Wheme
Myself
Ffery
Ivyeo
Lukewarm

Right? Schadd doesn't post alive people and I am habitually lazy

[fferyllt]

Wheme was elimmed on day 1.

Egix
You/Bell
me/Endless
Ivyeo
Lukewarm

[unwnd]

Actually Egix being the cop clear puzzles me a bit further in regards to what I asked Ivyeo

[unwnd]

Wheme was elimmed on day 1.

Egix
You/Bell
me/Endless
Ivyeo
Lukewarm

The easy route for me then is to just say and Ivyeo/Lukewarm team has been letting us joust this whole time then

[fferyllt]

Why wouldn't they just hammer me?

That makes no sense.

You have no choice but to put me in your scumpile whether you're town or not.

[unwnd]

It would actually explain why Lukewarm is the only person really entertaining your push, but also trying to make it seem You/Bell are scum together. Frankly that just isn't very sensible, and I know from observing your scumplay (and just general degree of competence) that getting into an overbloated fight with your partner who you especially are cognizant of behavior and pointed them out to some degree

Is not a winning move

[unwnd]

Why wouldn't they just hammer me?

That makes no sense.

You have no choice but to put me in your scumpile whether you're town or not.

You were at E-1? You might give me war flashbacks to myself where I assumed the lack of hammer with Lunar/Peta meant Lunar had to be town. That was your game too lol

[fferyllt]

I AM AT E-2 WITH 2 SCUM ALIVE

If YOU ARE TOWN WHY AM I NOT HAMMERED?

from my perspective you must be scum. From your POV I must be scum.

If my perspective is wrong, HOW?

[unwnd]

Well first of all

UNVOTE:

And second of all, it's a newbie game. I had to ask myself the same exact thing here. From what I gather as well Egix is the only SE slot here, so it could potentially be two newbies who are being overly cautious or even just not here to coordinate two votes. How long has he kept his vote there?

[unwnd]

Alright since last night and both Ivyeo/Lukewarm have pitched in

I don't like that I could be possibly wrong about you here

[fferyllt]

It's been almost 24 hours and everyone has posted since then.

Luke has been very active since I joined the game. Most of the time when I'm posting, he's right there and replying.

Ivy posts infrequently, a few once a day, I think.

I wish I could believe you're town. Posting while not caught up is something I have trouble seeing you do as scum. But the GAMESTATE screams to me that you're scum. and Bell's play definitely points that direction, too.

[unwnd]

Yeah I do see that, but I also see this and wonder if the rabbit hole isn't that deep

I'm really sorry, have been busy IRL, reading from start of day now.

Meaning Lukewarm has potentially been coaxing the situation and Ivyeo's own lack of know-how has been getting in the way of just voting together?

[fferyllt]

Luke and Ivy are both at least somewhat experienced in shorter mafia game formats. Luke has been a fairly logical player all along. I've been wondering if his tunneling is genuine or not.

It's hard to believe that they'd be unaware of quickhammers if they are both scum.

[unwnd]

I really think you're town here too ffery and if you're not it won't be me to say it

[Lukewarm]

Ivyeo I ISO'd your slot and noted that you believed it was Demainer>Egix in terms of your evil team, yet somehow the conversation has been more about me and FFery. Some other notable feelings I saw is this strange inference of 'not wanting to get it wrong' earlier in the game with a lot of loose dialogue, and then coming in with strong convictions towards your team. Where exactly did this change and more importantly, why are you not fighting over it?

Actually Egix being the cop clear puzzles me a bit further in regards to what I asked Ivyeo

Because the amount of information available to players change over time...

Ivy's demainer>egix post was 341. Egix was cleared by a cop on 343. So discussing Egix's alignment compared to other people became a moot point almost immediately after she made that post.

We are not pas post 750, Demainer is dead and Egix is cop cleared. Of course the conversation has moved past those two.

Maybe only looking at ISOs is making you lose the context of the gamestate when various posts were made?

[unwnd]

I'm aware that looking at ISOs is only one chunk of provided context, but I very much believe in just getting out whatever is on your mind

[Lukewarm]

@luke
I may be missing something, you're scared to go for bell because you're afraid of a FF+You+Me in F3 right?

Basically. If we vote Bell, then we will start day 4 with ff+me+you, and the whole game, win of lose, will hinge on my ability to convince you to vote ff more convincingly then ff's ability to convince you to vote for me. And that terrifies me.

I would much rather the town's win be determined by Egix making a decision today, then for it to all rest on my persuasive ability compared to ff tomorrow.

[Lukewarm]

Hey ffery and everyone else

I haven't read much of anything but did feel like ffery/bell (myself) could be potentially warring against another as tvt

Imo, this is not an option that anyone, including a Town-you, should entertain.

If your slot was town and voted ff who is also town, then replaced out, then mafia would have had an certain victory. Both mafia could have voted against FF, and won. With him replacing out, they could have done so very safely because they knew they had a while before the slot could change the vote.

From any perspective, bell's vote on fferyllt has confirmed that there must be a minimum of one (and I believe two) mafia between [unwnd / fferyllt]

[unwnd]

You display a certain degree of understanding that makes me believe in some crazy scenario that admitinggly I have entertained

That you would be ringleader if Ivyeo is your partner. I assume the door is shut in terms of Me/Ffery ever both being town regardless?

[fferyllt]

how would that even work?

[unwnd]

I find it very odd that I'm somewhat fighting against both of you right now on my position. I feel like you as scum would be more than content if I were being a dipshit and floating a townread on you, but maybe my thought is just too out there for you to potentially entertain as scum

[unwnd]

Occam's razor implies I am a dipshit here. Is that what you want though? The problem from my perspective when I was looking at this game from the outside is that you were going rounds with Bell with none of the input elsewhere. Lukewarm's disposition about this being SvS is the most insane thing possible, I still maintain that. You+Bell being scum is not what is happening here. That was one of my first goals to achieve

[fferyllt]

if luke is town you and I can't both be town. it's simple math at this point.

if you're town you can be trying to figure out if one of luke/me is town

that's not what you're doing.

[unwnd]

Do you think it's personally in my best interest as scum to come in here and spit rhetoric at you

[Ivyeo]

If you're trying to distance, Yes actually