Large Normal 232—Sibyl's Elegy [GAME OVER]

[Vasex]

Agree That Enchant/Kitty appear scum/scum.

VOTE: samantha97

samantha was against kitty (hard enough). but u consider she can be a scum... with kitty? i don't like it

[Marky Mark]

I'm all for giving an investigative claim the benefit of the doubt to see what they come up with overnight, but not when that claim is a 180 on a previous claim to try and squeeze the maker out of an elim

--pedit, agreed on NDMath's vote on Samantha being off

[Vasex]

too much talking from me
i will stay on artemiana. maybe on enchant.
i have other duties for next days, so since now i'll be here rarely, but i will read it everything
i need info from the corpse to move further

[Marky Mark]

Vasex what are your thoughts on T3 following their change of claim?

[DrippingGoofball]

not when that claim is a 180 on a previous claim

What did I miss?

[DrippingGoofball]

I forgot my account password guys

Recoverable in 2 minutes.

[Vasex]

I bet, that T3 is town. It is rather difficult to figure out and this is a risky bet. I read his ISO and the important moments with him. Many times, again and again, there is not so much text.
Or he is too good mafia. Too good for the first elim, i definitely against that. At least I want to play with him more time, to see what he will say after the night, if he will be alive.

That claim... This is another question. There is a possibility that it is true: unchanged willing to elim Kitty... even talking about bp - is to avoid nk maybe, if he is a cop... But like in situation with Etine - I'm not sure about this. I can think, that it can be fake, but not necessary scummy fake... This can be complicated, especially after few other claims.
All claims in this game were weird, but Kitty has the scummiest in my opinion.

So it is better to attack the team of Kitty instead of anything else (if not Kitty).

[T3]

I am doubling down on T3 here - the 180 on the claim when pressured to reveal his thought process seems fishy to me, and I've literally seen scum pull this one before (Flavour Leaf in Bending).

Also, if legit, why would he reveal his gate and give scum free info rather than just saying that he is some sort of cop?

Because I can only use night 1 and night 2.

[NDMath]

Also self meta wifom but there's no way scum-me wasn't lurking like fuck and woulda lolhammered the wagon when it was at L-1 to trade one for one. Unless of course you were to think I'm scum WITH kitty?

I really don't believe a player would trade one for with someone about to be elim'd?

As mafia, i have zero motivation to remove bp, because he could be traitor.

Mafia would know whether or not there is a traitor.

could enchant just be scum here? like this whole "he's a claimed bp, git him!" like there's a lot of scum motivation in wanting to get a bp out of the way. And the "he's unlikely to be town bp!" is just kinda slimy. Also I don't have to be on a wagon with DGB and Andre!

VOTE: enchant

but it is not enchant, who started this. It was Windows & myself.

Windows and you proposed the possibility but Windows is being very confident that one implies the other.

VOTE: t3

not comfortable leaving a d1 bulletproof claim alive, and not because of traitor

?? I am very confused by this, can you elaborate?

ugh (2)
i knocked against this sentance again
wtf man?
how can you be sure about that?
why are you defending her this strange way?
just look at her ISO

Reason Relating to Ongoing games.

I'm not really comprehending why my sam vote is so bad.


I don't think T3's claims are out of line with his play, and I agree with him specifically about enchant. And his current play doesn't at all match what a traitor would be going for.
VOTE: enchant

[Vasex]

Yeah, I understand t3 much, our thoughts were the same in a couple of times. I can understand his logics in moments. Im ready to protect him at least on the firtst day. He should be a town. What kind of town - this is still the question.
And if he is a scum he doesnt try to pocket me much, because after tr in the beginning i became somewhere about null for him for some time...
Enchant is much worse in his scumreading anybody, no useful info from there. Kitty too.
And we have Artemiana like almost neutral option for the first the most difficult day

[Vasex]

bp-"traitor" changes his claim to a cop
is this not too dangerous for the traitor? to bite the bullet at himself, not in some townie...

[Marky Mark]

Because I can only use night 1 and night 2.

That is your gate. Why give that info away?

[Marky Mark]

not when that claim is a 180 on a previous claim

What did I miss?

T3 claimed BP under mild pressure then when asked for their reason for claiming subsequently claimed N1/N2 Cop

[Marky Mark]

bp-"traitor" changes his claim to a cop
is this not too dangerous for the traitor? to bite the bullet at himself, not in some townie...

I don't quite follow sorry.

[Vasex]

maybe i dont fully understand your local mechanics of traitor, remembering this from other forums

[Marky Mark]

It was the BP claim that made me initially think traitor/3rd party might be in the mix, but now that this turned out to be a fakeclaim, there are a bunch more potential motives open

consider this:
Etine claims under low pressure and gets towncred
T3 claims under low pressure and just happens to claim a role that's hard for town to verify without attempting to vig them
When pushed on their claim logic T3 then claims a completely different role, including the specific modifier
At a similar time a counterwagon springs up out of nowhere on Arte when T3 was in real danger of getting limmed

T3's logic is that their BP claim was gambit to ensure Kitty gets elimed without revealing their actual role, but general consensus was to lim Kitty D2 barring a major change of gamestate anyway regardless

I was thinking T3/Kitty S/S but just maaaybe T3/Vasex are actually S/S given the speed the Arte counterwagon gained pace

[Marky Mark]

The TLDR is why would a townie pull a fakeclaim gambit to lim a slot that was very likely going to be limmed D2 anyway

[Marky Mark]

I'm going to bed, night all. It's been a pleasure

[Kerset]

bp-"traitor" changes his claim to a cop
is this not too dangerous for the traitor? to bite the bullet at himself, not in some townie...

huh, i know that thing, that it is convinient for mafia to claim like pr in dangerous situations, especially when they almost have no choice.
i know that easy to believe that fake, because pr often acts like a mafia for townies, having a big important role and afraid to lose it.
but i dont believe kitty now.
i dont believe any of his words.

[Vasex]

I dont think that t3 didnt understand before claiming that there is almost no hope to elim kitty at that moment, othervise this is some too unexperienced thinking, t3 doesnt look so unexperienced

Cant understand why are you repeatin about wagon going nowhere in Arte. Almost nobody votes there. A wagon. Nowhere. Sounds beauty, but nonsense. Arte has some serious problems throughout the game

Im going sleep too

[Kerset]

T3 knew that he is going to be hanged, so he claimed this to get Cop eliminated instead. It is totally worth it.

Just look T3 progression. He first accused Kitty&Enchant and THEN he heard about kitty claim. Exacly after Kitty claim he didn't intensify his push, he disappeared for some time and claimed later.

I recommend reading https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go

[Vasex]

Different situations, Kerset
And the level of danger
And about different roles - a cop and a traitor, but maybe there is some sense if t3 is just a mafia tho

[Vasex]

Kerset, so Kitty is true cop for you?

[Vasex]

If you was a cop would you instantly contrclaimed against mafia Kitty? Think about it. Before the first night!

[Kerset]

If you was a cop would you instantly contrclaimed against mafia Kitty? Think about it. Before the first night!

I would never CC cop in large game. Especially shot based, as there can be more then one per game.