Micro 1010: Divide and Conquer: Round 2 - Game Over!

[Hopkirk]

mislims + autocorrect + not reading posts = stuff that sounds terrible...

[GuiltyLion]

yeah I def think Luke is town on a scum!Bingle (or a scum!Hopkirk) flip, I'm just worried about the TvT world in which case all of these posts are awful

p-edit: Bingle how can you not see what Lukewarm is doing here as bad. I really hate the overconfidence in D1 scumreads as if you're wrong on Hopkirk you've made life so easy for scum

[Hopkirk]

Oh, and look who suddenly knows I’m flipping town. Lim hopkirk. This is transparent.

(if you're town):
...who selfvoted then you should think very carefully about your playstyle after this because you'll have basically come in and done literally nothing but fuck over the town with complete inflexibility and frankly shit reads that you weren't willing to think critically about for a minute. like if you're town and we lose you basically threw. this is 100% on you. i tried to reach out to you repeatedly and you shat on me every single time without willing to rethink/consider very basic issues with what you were saying. think about how you play mafia

[Hopkirk]

like that was a self-hammer since you made the vote knowing that NM was going to vote you. if this flips town then i'm pissed and you've lost the respect i had for you as a player before this. the amount of self-hammers i see from town ruining a good half of my games is pissing me off.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I still think Bingle could be flipping scum here and he's just mad and trying to make us think we're bad for eliminating him.

[Lukewarm]

I think Bingle has found the scum team, but too many people are scum reading him for his reads and pushes to go through.

Hard confirming Bingle as town is the second best way to get us to a win here (outside of us just voting for Hopkirk, but no one listened to that idea), because no one can argue "but he is lying because he is scum." Instead if people want to ignore Bingle's reads, they are going to have to argue that Bingle is not good at spotting scum, and I think that is a harder case to make.

[Hopkirk]

Oh, and look who suddenly knows I’m flipping town. Lim hopkirk. This is transparent.

i've been trying to work with you for fucking days to sort you and i'd have voted you a hell of a lot sooner as scum. this is actually insulting no matter what alignment you are

[NorwegianboyEE]

they are going to have to argue that Bingle is not good at spotting scum, and I think that is a harder case to make.

Well i think his reads have been shit as i know i'm town.

[Hopkirk]

I still think Bingle could be flipping scum here and he's just mad and trying to make us think we're bad for eliminating him.

i was starting to lean more towards not_mafia
then bingle decided to self hammer which at this point i've been fucked by so many times that the chance he's probably just shit!town becomes even more likely

[GuiltyLion]

Instead if people want to ignore Bingle's reads, they are going to have to argue that Bingle is not good at spotting scum, and I think that is a harder case to make.

It's really not?? No one is so good at mafia that they reliably nail a scumteam on D1, even in a set-up like this with slightly more information. I can

easily

imagine a town!Bingle being wrong about nEE, and that's starting from coin flip odds for him on that one. You yourself said you've been terrible at reads in your past games, why the hell are you assuming Bingle is infallible?

[Hopkirk]

I think Bingle has found the scum team, but too many people are scum reading him for his reads and pushes to go through.

Hard confirming Bingle as town is the second best way to get us to a win here (outside of us just voting for Hopkirk, but no one listened to that idea), because no one can argue "but he is lying because he is scum." Instead if people want to ignore Bingle's reads, they are going to have to argue that Bingle is not good at spotting scum, and I think that is a harder case to make.

quit hiding behind bingle you actual coward. how about saying one single sentence without an appeal to authority

[Hopkirk]

i'm considering what sarah was talking about before the hammer more now - the world where Bingle/Luke are both town. Luke's play is bad in such an open way that do scum even do it? it could be ridiculously newb scum but is that even likely?

[marcistar]

Bingle suggested trading Vanderscamp for a hopkirk vote. and you and marci both seemed okay with that. That trade seemed like it would have been way less productive. first, I think that there was a lesser chance for it to get a scum flip. Secondly, I feel like we would have entered day 2 with multiple people crying "but Bingle is scum" and we would not have actually gotten any closer to winning.

I don't think i agreed?

[Hopkirk]

how does Vanderscamp/notmafia sound to you Marci?

[Lukewarm]

I scum read Hopkirk and Norwee myself, outside of Bingle's pushes. I even made a multiple post case against Norwee.

This is not about my reads being dependent on Bingle. This is me realizing that this was the only way I can convince the town.

[marcistar]

how does Vanderscamp/notmafia sound to you Marci?

tbh, im not sure. not_mafia is too hard to read but vanderscamp was the vibes i was having before.

have they done anything together at all? my memories bad

[Lukewarm]

Bingle suggested trading Vanderscamp for a hopkirk vote. and you and marci both seemed okay with that. That trade seemed like it would have been way less productive. first, I think that there was a lesser chance for it to get a scum flip. Secondly, I feel like we would have entered day 2 with multiple people crying "but Bingle is scum" and we would not have actually gotten any closer to winning.

I don't think i agreed?

You did not agree to the trade. You agreed on a Vote against Vanderscamp

(472) i have no idea how to read him, he's one of the people i'm unsure on rn so i'm willing to vote along with u VOTE: vanderscamp i like these points you made though, i didn't really think of it like that. that's whats making me comfortable to vote here

I'm pretty sure it's just Hopkirk/Norwee at this point, tbh, and I don't see my vote moving.

i don't really see it, i probably missed it but where is your last read on norwegianboyee? 403 i see you mentioning you see hopkirk with both, but i don't really see you do much to that..? like you responded to norwegianboyee, but it doesn't seem like you had a mind change in those posts..

[SirCakez]

Votecount 1.8

Bingle (5) - Vanderscamp, NorwegianboyEE, marcistar, Bingle, Not_Mafia
Hopkirk (2) - Dunnstral, Lukewarm
Vanderscamp (1) - GuiltyLion
Lukewarm (1) - Hopkirk

Not voting (0)

(expired on 2021-05-24 08:40:00) remain until day end

With 9 players alive, it takes 5 to reach a majority.

[SirCakez]

Bingle,

Mafia Goon,

has been eliminated day 1!

Night 1 begins! It will end in (expired on 2021-05-19 16:15:00)

[SirCakez]

NorwegianboyEE,

Vanilla Townie,

has been killed night 1!

Day 2 begins!

[SirCakez]

Votecount 2.0

Not voting (7) - Vanderscamp, marcistar, Not_Mafia, Dunnstral, Lukewarm, GuiltyLion, Hopkirk

(expired on 2021-06-02 17:00:00) remain until day end

With 7 players alive, it takes 4 to reach a majority.

[Not_Mafia]

Morten Weebket wants me to avenge him by eliminating Lukewarm

[Not_Mafia]

I want Guilty Lion still

VOTE: Lukewarm

[GuiltyLion]

I really don't think Lukewarm is likely, all the twilight posting would be hard to do in real time knowing Bingle scumflip was imminent, including posts in our hood between thread lock and flip.

I posted this in our hood and Vander ignored it in favor of not posting at all over the entirety of the night phase, here it is for your viewing pleasure N_M:

I think Vanders' progression on Bingle is quite awkward

in 230 he votes marcistar, despite the fact that he claimed to believe we should eliminate in the 3p. (I still maintain that despite posting a handful of times about eliminating in the 3p, Vanderscamp did not seem to actually care about eliminating in the 3p, especially when most players had suggested that we shouldn't).

He then quotes Bingle posts from prior to 230, in his 231 and 233 he quotes Bingle's 212 and 219, then concludes in 235 that he thinks Bingle is scummier than N_M and that he thinks nEE is town. If that's the case, given that he thinks 3p was a better odds to hit scum and he's townreading one of the 3p, why was he voting elsewhere? I called this out in my post 236 and got a very short 238 in reply, which I didn't sense Vanders genuinely believed given that he spent more time discussing Bingle than marcistar.

Then the progression from question -> I don't like your answer -> vote (in 255, 262, 263) feels like where the decision to bus comes in. Despite scumreading and voting (!) Bingle, Vanders claims he got "nothing" out of Bingle v Hopkirk in 329 - I feel a townie who was voting Bingle as their primary SR there would have had more to say.

I also still agree with my own 469 and I don't think Vanderscamp understood my point nor addressed it in a satisfying way. My point wasn't that he wasn't aware of the pools once he posted, my point was "I was gonna say it's not S-S until I remembered [emphasis mine] it couldn't be" betrays a lack of critical thought or care about the pools when analyzing interactions. I haven't once forgotten who was in which pool this game, because it's centrally important to determining who scum is. Vanders post implied that he did, which I find hard to believe coming from town.

I also think Bingle's openwolf 477 may have been meant to scare us away from a Vander wagon.

[GuiltyLion]

VOTE: Vanderscamp

pagetop vote for justice
remember to turn back to previous page to read my case