Newbie 2064 - (GG)

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Salty because I am calling you out? ;P

[humaneatingmonkey]

Also I have small suspicion on HEM from the NK, and then instantly posting to back their own ass up since the top town didn't die.

what is this?

[JacksonVirgo]

Also I have small suspicion on HEM from the NK, and then instantly posting to back their own ass up since the top town didn't die.

what is this?

Exactly what I said. I have small suspicion on you for that.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I don't understand it so maybe you could rephrase for me

[JacksonVirgo]

I slightly misread the context but I am still slightly at you. My original read was that I was expecting you to die, I did not think anyone else were to die but then you didn't which was weird to me, you then post about the NK probably being scum-hunting which pinged me as trying to make a reason why you didn't die. Which is still possible even with me re-reading the context mind you.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Why me over navigatorv?

The newbies are asking me how to analyze NK and I told them how I analyze NK. What do you think about this with that context?

Right now I'm trying to suss out if you really believe what you're saying here.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Looking at Micc/JohnnyFarrar, there really isn't anything that might indicate that they're PR.

I read this as them trying to eliminate a vote or someone who would push their wagon. So I dug up their PoE list:

Unwilling:

Navy - mad town no question
Monkey - I agree w/ them so much either they're town or I'm wrong about a lot of stuff
Dum - I got a soft spot for gambit and that fake vote was mwah
Ninja - like I said, I see an effort to read people, but among the high effort people this one seems easiest to fake

Willing:

JV - getting suckered into piss fights and making votes I don't agree with. Nothing particularly scummy other than *vibes*
Rizz - I don't think I'll learn a damn thing even if Rizz is scum and we kill them. They just seem concerned with who looks the smartest and not who got that juicy red PM and I genuinely don't know if that's alignment indicative
James - I see less effort and more word vomit as the thread goes on and their perspective seems forced or obtuse in quite a few spots
Orc - that almost hammer got me on tilt man

I think JV would benefit by this NK but I would imagine JV might be more skilled at hunting PR than this (because I think based on this thread, I can already spot better choices than JohnnyFarrar here) so he might never make this kill.

James on the other hand would also benefit from this NK. I already saw James trying to bait PR yesterday, so maybe they misinterpreted JohnnyFarrar's post as PR-indicative.

Orc would benefit the least because he's on JohnnyFarrar's direct line of sight and a Micc/JohnnyFarrar flip would immediately incriminate him for his "almost hammer".

[humaneatingmonkey]

navigatov and NinjaStore are both in my townblock — we eliminate between Dum, JV, James, and orctin today. I re-read orctin during the night and I didn't like how conservative he was with his votes, but it could be explained by this:

You can see that i tend to put pressure on someone first - gauge their reaction, then look to vote. This whole setup here of people voting to gauge reaction is just backwards to my normal way of thinking and playing where i'm from.

Dum's absence and inactivity and nonchalance near deadline with Faaz' E-1 wagon was sketchy and does not resemble the Dum we knew from early D1 who would make gambits.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Still, I think Dum and James both feel like they're doing more for the town and I can see an actual scumhunting process in broad daylight. I don't think we should elim here today just yet.

[humaneatingmonkey]

JV is loud, but looks like he's mostly interested in protecting himself and making sure he's seen as townie than sorting between slots.
orctin is a big mystery and it's great if we can see more of him today.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I slightly misread the context but I am still slightly at you. My original read was that I was expecting you to die, I did not think anyone else were to die but then you didn't which was weird to me, you then post about the NK probably being scum-hunting which pinged me as trying to make a reason why you didn't die. Which is still possible even with me re-reading the context mind you.

This is a very sketchy post to me because navigator has been more vocally professed as town and has been in everybody's town block more than I have. So, to see him say this, I don't think I believe him.

[JacksonVirgo]

Why me over navigatorv?

The newbies are asking me how to analyze NK and I told them how I analyze NK. What do you think about this with that context?

Right now I'm trying to suss out if you really believe what you're saying here.

I did say that I re-read the context and it doesn't fit that anymore, but I am still

[JacksonVirgo]

I think JV would benefit by this NK but I would imagine JV might be more skilled at hunting PR than this (because I think based on this thread, I can already spot better choices than JohnnyFarrar here) so he might never make this kill.

James on the other hand would also benefit from this NK. I already saw James trying to bait PR yesterday, so maybe they misinterpreted JohnnyFarrar's post as PR-indicative.

Orc would benefit the least because he's on JohnnyFarrar's direct line of sight and a Micc/JohnnyFarrar flip would immediately incriminate him for his "almost hammer".

If you think this, why are you voting me again?

[humaneatingmonkey]

As I said, NK is information but it's unreliable because it's more WIFOM and it's more reliable to sort players by their play.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Which is still possible even with me re-reading the context mind you.

[humaneatingmonkey]

does it fit or doesn't it

[JamesTheNames]

Also I have small suspicion on HEM from the NK, and then instantly posting to back their own ass up since the top town didn't die.

Are you referring to him saying we should assume Mafia is hunting PRs? If that's the case, I can see the potential, but it definitely needs a bit more than that to get me on the wagon since that just seems to be a decent assumption to make since they're the biggest threat to scum and

they don't have to worry about sussing out who's town like we do them.

Not to say the possibility isn't there, but it definitely doesn't say anything definitive imo

JV has already been discussed a lot, but here are some early posts that stand out.

227 228

JV's tone is interesting. They emphasize that they are making reads rather than talking about the people they are reading.

Then there's this post:

one last thing JV, your sig says you're a tactical lurker. what does it mean?

Sometimes I don't post and just read the thread for a small while in a tactical way. For example, if I feel like I am tunneling someone too hard I step back and just watch for a while to see what happens without my intervention etc. More reasons too but that's the way I feel is the best explanation.

I also do it as scum

so it's not anything to read me on

JV drops this subtle "I'm town" instead of just saying "I play this way as both town and scum."

I'm curious how Ninja feels about what is highlighted in blue.

What about it? Are you asking me to compare the two?

Why doesn't your post regarding JacksonVirgo not apply to navigatorv? I don't think you're actually suspicious of JacksonVirgo for those reasons. You'd have commented how it applies to navigatorv if you did.
VOTE: NinjaStore

[JamesTheNames]

In addition to the previous posts (I don't like quote walls), is it not worse what navigatorv did? His wasn't even subtle.

Important to add, I don't think saying your town sided is scum indicative? Do you want town to pretend to be scum?

[NinjaStore]

That nav quote doesn't give me the same "trying to look like town" vibes as what JV said. The more concerning nav quote is the one I linked last page: 539

[JamesTheNames]

That nav quote doesn't give me the same "trying to look like town" vibes as what JV said. The more concerning nav quote is the one I linked last page: 539

Why not?
In your eyes both of them should be seen as doing the same thing, "I'm town" vs "we're town", the latter of course including navigatorv.
They have the same implications behind them, similar reasons for the comments behind them also.
Also you have an issue

now

with 65 11 days after it was made? Excluding the 2 days for the night phase you had 9 days to comment on that.
I don't think either of your reads here are genuine NinjaStore.

[JamesTheNames]

I have a test in the morning (GMT) so I don't think I'll post until afterwards, just know I'm suspicious of a NinjaStore/Nav team and will look into it more when I am back.

[humaneatingmonkey]

James what do you think of JV?

[NinjaStore]

Why not?

Vibes.

Also you have an issue

now

with 65 11 days after it was made? Excluding the 2 days for the night phase you had 9 days to comment on that.
I don't think either of your reads here are genuine NinjaStore.

I noticed things I hadn't earlier. The context of one day kill and one night kill put a re-read in a new light. Better to point them out now than ignore them.

[navigatorv]

Those are definitely some great starting points for analysis orctin.
Going by general vibe, Micc definitely seems the most outwardly antagonistic. Not sure if that's a sign of him being Mafia or just an aggressive playstyle; both seem equally likely at this point. I'm very curious to see his reaction to being at E-1.
That said, while we do need to figure out who to eliminate today, this is a 2 Mafia game, so we do need to consider who might be a secondary guess after our primary choice. Not to say that we should focus all our efforts on that (chasing two hares and all that), but it's definitely something to keep in mind.
Another thing as well might be to change our thinking style. While we can definitely say that we're suspicious of several people, one thing we could consider is trying to figure out who's pro-Town. I will admit there is a potential flaw there in that it might help Mafia decide on a target so it might be best to keep quiet to ourselves about our thoughts on that front for the time being, I just thought it might help make analyzing easier.

I get a weird vibe from how nav overexplains town strat in this post.

I don't really have a defense here. It was early in the game and I wanted to be useful, so I thought of ways to strategize and shared them. Sorry if they were overexplained