Open 810 | Aliensitter Needed! | Mafia wins

[Lukewarm]

Also, no redaction from me in the lover thread.

[GrandpaMo]

<3 u pooky

BEST MAFIA PLAYER ON THE SITE FOR SHO

smh poooky smh

[GrandpaMo]

no redact as well

[GrandpaMo]

This game feels sort of like a case lesson in why ability to look town is often much greater utility than having good reads

I disagree very much that I didn’t look town Mena. As evidenced by the literally every other player townreading me.

i dont thinkn no one was strongly townreading u imo everyone was scared to admit it. mafia started the chain of townreading u, then t3 (someone who wasn't vocally strong) said u were town as well but never emphasized why.

then during like that passive break u took, everyone started null reading u

[Bingle]

Pooky, A50, Luke, NM.

Like, literally every NK after Dann was strong tr-ing me.

[GrandpaMo]

Mena never considered you and mo.

I actually did realise this after the fact but didn’t mention for a couple of reasons

(1) the lack of anyone I could trust between the four of you was driving me insane and ydra’s reaction felt authentically happy... which I guess it was but for the wrong reason

(2) I figured that if it was ydra/mo then pretending to believe she was conf would get me brought to F3 instead of killed

@2nd point, i’m always going to kill you there because wifom over “why are we both still here” is very dumb and you would have figured that out, i just take my chances with bingle/nm instead, way better odds.

fr? i think u would have wayyyy better odds with keeping mena alive and thats because nm / bingle were most likely way more set on nm + bingle. then just use the "why are we both still here" as the wifom stance against mayhaps nm and push the nm / mo narrative imo

wifom over a nightkill is always too risky; you kill the person who is the biggest threat to your wincon. mena wasn’t being suspected at all and as, in theory, a hammer on you would have “”confirmed”” (even if incorrectly) the sentiment of you/bingle or nm, it doesn’t make sense for him to stay alive especially when he’s aware that he could have been wrong/pocketed and does re-evaluate at end of game. him dying after your flip would be the kill any scum here would make i think, or me if i was town at that point.

yea i get that u killl ppl for their towniness (killing your townreads, or killing the towniest person in the game) however, in a f3 situation, u can manipulate the results in a way where there will be wifom in both sides of each scenario. then lay out the risk factors. imo, i think it will be more interesting ONLY IF you can execute it out correctly, like wtf why am i alive, did mafia set this shit up so it can be obvious for y to be scum? its kinda hard to measure how risky that play is because everyone has a unique playstyle and that playstyle comes with its own execution. i would just start pushing BS narratives. if u were pushed this day and i was the one to be in f3, i would def kill nm because that would be the biggest threat to my wincon, not mena who i can use to sway the vote on bingle, then we would have a 1v1 prospect in which i purposfully set up because my playstyle deems for an interesting and fun convo where ik bingle can ultimaly fall into my trap of the constant manipulation and go in with making (towny) excuses not to argue or debate with me.

[GrandpaMo]

Pooky, A50, Luke, NM.

Like, literally every NK after Dann was strong tr-ing me.

well that comes with a fallacy i believe, because those people also strongly / or mildly townreading scum as well, and so it wouldnt have been a fair assessment to you. i think the townreads should really after everyone got a fair chance to be reevaluated and that was AFTER that nk

[GrandpaMo]

NM also thought u were scum at one point

[Bingle]

luke, don't post please!! <3 (the game's technically over but it's a courtesy thing :3)

Sorry for this - this was literally my first game where I died before endgame, so I did not know

It’s one of the rewards of modding, the grand reveal at the end. More importantly, you don’t always know that a game is actually over. Y could have been town trolling me. Lend could have given fake spoilers to keep the dead thread entertaining. Etc.

Wasn’t a big deal here, but as a rule never post in a game thread you’ve died in before the mod explicitly declares a winner, because if the game continues due to something you didn’t know you’ve accidentally cheated, one way or another.

[GrandpaMo]

but i think you are right about the other 3, and A50 was confused on who scum was and basically was townreading everyone and had a scumread on T3 I believe but there was still 2 scum in the game alive. and poe only consisted of one person who flipped town eventually

[GrandpaMo]

luke, don't post please!! <3 (the game's technically over but it's a courtesy thing :3)

Sorry for this - this was literally my first game where I died before endgame, so I did not know

It’s one of the rewards of modding, the grand reveal at the end. More importantly, you don’t always know that a game is actually over. Y could have been town trolling me. Lend could have given fake spoilers to keep the dead thread entertaining. Etc.

Wasn’t a big deal here, but as a rule never post in a game thread you’ve died in before the mod explicitly declares a winner, because if the game continues due to something you didn’t know you’ve accidentally cheated, one way or another.

thats why i was scared mod would have been like bingle's vote didn't count because he never unvoted from me

[Bingle]

Also, mo, as an aside, you should probably work on both being more concise and not including a quote in everything you post. Your style helped you as mafia here, but it also made you very unconvincing. No one was engaging your reads because they were literally quotestriping and no one ever wants to deal with that.

[Lukewarm]

@Grandpa, I think that your playstyle was so obviously anti-town, that I assumed it could not actually be coming from the scum team for a long time. And I was like, no he must just be bad!town. I never followed though with the repeated suggestions to meta you, I generally avoid doing that unless an important decision falls to me, like hitting Elo, but I imagine that I would have flipped my read on you earlier if I did that.

[Menalque]

This game feels sort of like a case lesson in why ability to look town is often much greater utility than having good reads

I think this was winnable and you have a bias towards dismissing me or wanting me to be scum.

Nonetheless, congrats and gg scum and thanks mod for hosting

I don't disagree that it was winnable, and I know that I bear the vast brunt of the responsibility for this loss, but it was very hard from my PoV. I don't think I have a bias towards dismissing you, but I do think that you're consistent enough between your scumgame and your towngame that expecting me to know the difference between you bussing someone and you having good reads is somewhat unreasonable.

the setup seemed cool even if i didn’t get to use any of it ;;

when do we get pts?

mod PT will come in a few hours, mafia and dead PT will be released in 24 hours to allow for redactions to be made

wait, even dead pt we have to wait for redactions?

This game feels sort of like a case lesson in why ability to look town is often much greater utility than having good reads

I disagree very much that I didn’t look town Mena. As evidenced by the literally every other player townreading me.

Maybe I'm being unfair then, but there were several specific issues which I think I already laid out, but basically -- your read on me D1, your disappearance after pressing for the scumflip on D1, the fact that you felt to me far too confident on both me and on NM, the fact that you hadn't been killed, the fact you and NM felt very in sync on final day which reminded me very strongly of this game where I ruled out the scumteam precisely because they were weirdly in sync and I thought that they wouldn't be so obvious (+ that if it was them then with their already being in sync they'd just push someone instead of waiting) -- that prevented me from getting to a point where I could trust in that read.

Also mo just felt TSTBS quite a lot which was a mistake, given hindsight. Should've just followed the RC policy lim rule there.

[Menalque]

i’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the setup in general.

more or less balanced but maybe a little too swingy in it's current iteration. maybe just make the lovers masons or neighbours or something, this going to mountainous like that with a de facto useless third PR shot the difficulty up considerably. having had one of them for an extra night would maybe have helped

[VFP]

Well done scum, thanks Lend for modding.
Lukewarm was the best mason buddy I every had!

[Lukewarm]

Well done scum, thanks Lend for modding.
Lukewarm was the best mason buddy I every had!

Wow. "Mason Buddy," here I was thinking we were Lovers

I definitely enjoyed having the Lovers chat with you too. It is so nice to be able to look at someone elses messages and not have to question them.

[Lukewarm]

Thanks for modding Lend

[Menalque]

indeed, thanks for modding, ggwp scum & fellow town

[VFP]

Well done scum, thanks Lend for modding.
Lukewarm was the best mason buddy I every had!

Wow. "Mason Buddy," here I was thinking we were Lovers

I definitely enjoyed having the Lovers chat with you too. It is so nice to be able to look at someone elses messages and not have to question them.

Yeah thats the best part.
Even if you or the other fumble up reads or reasoning you know it's genuine.

I'm just sorry I didn't use it as much as I should have. I prefer during the day as posting real time is a lot easier.

[Bingle]

Maybe I'm being unfair then, but there were several specific issues which I think I already laid out, but basically -- your read on me D1, your disappearance after pressing for the scumflip on D1, the fact that you felt to me far too confident on both me and on NM, the fact that you hadn't been killed, the fact you and NM felt very in sync on final day which reminded me very strongly of this game where I ruled out the scumteam precisely because they were weirdly in sync and I thought that they wouldn't be so obvious (+ that if it was them then with their already being in sync they'd just push someone instead of waiting) -- that prevented me from getting to a point where I could trust in that read.

The final day you thing wasn’t a townread, it was a if Mena is scum I lose to Mena/Y deciding they’re a masonry thing, which I think I was pretty open about. Apparently I read too far into it, but I didn’t see a world where scum in the two of you lost. I townread NM hard off of effort because I’ve never seen scum nm effort anywhere near this hard and the only counter argument that wasn’t “I don’t think you’re right” came after mo was confscum to me and I didn’t have to reevaluate. I still haven’t read that game you linked, btw.

And of course me and nm were in sync on the final day, we were both pushing a player whose alignment was confirmed to us.

I’m not saying I was blameless in the loss, lack of communication goes both ways, but I do think that your paranoia about my scum game made it so you didn’t really try to dig deep into what mo was telling you I was doing when most of it was blatantly false. You heard Bingle is masterminding and thought yeah that makes sense instead of actually looking to see if I was masterminding anything.

I don’t have hard feelings over the loss, btw, and it was on me as well (I was the game losing hammer, after all) I’m just hoping that in the future you put a little more thought into whether I actually make sense as scum or if it’s just that I have a decent scum game and so my being alive is scummy.

Also, pooky, this game aside I’m 100% not the player to just blatantly sheep. I don’t operate well in those circumstances and my read accuracy as town is very hit and miss, jsyk.

[Bingle]

i’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the setup in general.

more or less balanced but maybe a little too swingy in it's current iteration. maybe just make the lovers masons or neighbours or something, this going to mountainous like that with a de facto useless third PR shot the difficulty up considerably. having had one of them for an extra night would maybe have helped

Agree that it’s balanced, but I don’t think either swing mitigation technique would work. Making the lovers masons makes this town side hard, and neighbors in an open ARE masons.

Scum deserved this win and it was 100% a fair game.

I’m not going to put it forward for approved or featured status because the game is swingy and a bit niche, but it’s a fine setup as is.

[lendunistus]

if you're craving for more lend games

Newbie Game But Not Really is currently in signups in the micro queue

it's a bastardized version of a standard newbie game and I implore you to check it out if you can even slightly tolerate extreme bastardness

[lendunistus]

i’d be interested to hear your thoughts on the setup in general.

more or less balanced but maybe a little too swingy in it's current iteration. maybe just make the lovers masons or neighbours or something, this going to mountainous like that with a de facto useless third PR shot the difficulty up considerably. having had one of them for an extra night would maybe have helped

Agree that it’s balanced, but I don’t think either swing mitigation technique would work. Making the lovers masons makes this town side hard, and neighbors in an open ARE masons.

Scum deserved this win and it was 100% a fair game.

I’m not going to put it forward for approved or featured status because the game is swingy and a bit niche, but it’s a fine setup as is.

setup is fine as is imo. I definitely agree that it's a bit swingy and the game turning into mountainous after night 2 was a bit of a disappointment, but scum happened to get an MD positive on the babysitter night 1 which definitely contributed to the general lack of usefulness the PRs had this game

one small change i'd maybe make is making it so that the psychologist can still get a positive on a cowardly mafioso, even if they haven't gained the ability to kill yet. but that would probably make the setup townsided and even more swingy

I might attempt a rerun of this in the future, probably with minimal to no changes. to be honest, the playerlist here kind of stole the show from the setup (in a good way)

thanks for the feedback!

[JohnnyFarrar]

No redacts from me, thanks 4 modding