Yggdrasil - Stratum FINAL -

[Guillotina]

I favor faking guilties but not how Artemiana executed it and held it for so long.

[Bingle]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... ts_as_Town

I have a guilty result on Mina.

[Thestatusquo]

I favor faking guilties but not how Artemiana executed it and held it for so long.

It's amazing how you can be wrong about so many different things simultaneously.

[Thestatusquo]

the best part about it is if you're town you're basically locked to get to the end game so I look forward to you being the deciding factor in whether I win or lose in 5 or so game days.

[Something_Smart]

The hope is that the game doesn't get to that point.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm getting toxic. :/

I'll be stepping away from this thread for real for 24 hours. No reading, no posting. Good luck y'all.

[Something_Smart]

The article is pretty bad, by the way. If the climate of the game is such that you won't get steamrolled for admitting a gambit (and given how frequent gambits are nowadays, that's most of the time), then you can gain a lot without losing much.

[Chara]

Rocket Fist Chara removed 1 hp from the game - innate
Data Mined NDMath (2 sp) - Blocked NDMath from regenerating SP.

why didn't you target me with both abilities?

not that i'm complaining i guess.

If Titus is scum this is worth looking into

Chara being attacked, I mean

PAnd I mean with power roles 'cause there is theatre potential here

i actually take it back, it looks more like Dunn trying to see if Titus's attack on me could be mech confirmed.

[Guillotina]

The article is pretty bad, by the way. If the climate of the game is such that you won't get steamrolled for admitting a gambit (and given how frequent gambits are nowadays, that's most of the time), then you can gain a lot without losing much.

Yah the article is pure trash to be honest.

[Farkran]

This fake guilty thing left me a bit lost so i will take a step back and reorganize my thoughts

1) i agree with bingle that LLD is super town post-flip

2) the STD kill probably comes from town? If scum have access to just 1 factional kill it must be toog

3) following up from point 2, it could point to NDMath scum rather than flea or sigmund.

4) maybe guillotina is also scum given that he has only pushed town and defended scum so far, i.e. 2966 seems to be a scummy position to take around flipped scum + he has been pushing me since forever + his logic is very very questionable

5) set aside nka and vca, i still dislike the ongoing defense of titus from chara and morph

before

artemiana admitted it was a fake guilty. This is regardless of titus alignment.

6) shea seems to be genuinely disappointed, although i am a bit concerned about his vote patterns. Is he known to be a passionate scum player? If that's the case, he could be scum here, otherwise he's a strong townread. Wouldn't vote there today anyways.

7) SS is very likely town based on what i know of him

This is pretty much where i am at with my current reasoning, everyone else is just a gutping or faded memory.

[morph the cat]

7) SS is very likely town based on what i know of him

Could you expand on this?

[Guillotina]

4) maybe guillotina is also scum given that he has only pushed town and defended scum so far, i.e. 2966 seems to be a scummy position to take around flipped scum + he has been pushing me since forever + his logic is very very questionable

What's scummy for wanting to yeet in my scum reads? I'm happy we flipped anya and I wished I got credit for it but no biggie, there is more scum to hunt.

I have been pushing you since forever? I actually forgot about you, do you still feel pressure from me from Day 1? Do you you feel that just my sole presence is a threat?

[Guillotina]

1) i agree with bingle that LLD is super town post-flip

Why do you feel my Day 1 FoS on you like a consistent push today, but not LLD's who also scumread you on Day 1?

[Chara]

5) set aside nka and vca, i still dislike the ongoing defense of titus from chara and morph before artemiana admitted it was a fake guilty. This is regardless of titus alignment.

her claim literally changed from "targeted myself" to "targeted NM" partway through and i didn't like her justification for it at all. that and i never bought that one of anya's duplicates could be used for a cop check.
and i was right, so.

morph seems to know Arte better and so recognized the whole gambit thing.

[Chara]

like even if Arte is town, you expect me to believe a claim that half-baked in a meta where town fuck up or just lie all the time?

[morph the cat]

recognized the whole gambit thing.

^

[Chara]

6) shea seems to be genuinely disappointed, although i am a bit concerned about his vote patterns. Is he known to be a passionate scum player? If that's the case, he could be scum here, otherwise he's a strong townread. Wouldn't vote there today anyways.

pretty much where i am with shea.

[Farkran]

7) SS is very likely town based on what i know of him

Could you expand on this?

No

4) maybe guillotina is also scum given that he has only pushed town and defended scum so far, i.e. 2966 seems to be a scummy position to take around flipped scum + he has been pushing me since forever + his logic is very very questionable

What's scummy for wanting to yeet in my scum reads? I'm happy we flipped anya and I wished I got credit for it but no biggie, there is more scum to hunt.

I have been pushing you since forever? I actually forgot about you, do you still feel pressure from me from Day 1? Do you you feel that just my sole presence is a threat?

Idc about pressure, but from my pov you've been pushing town and defending scum based on logic that i don't agree with and that's a red flag to me

1) i agree with bingle that LLD is super town post-flip

Why do you feel my Day 1 FoS on you like a consistent push today, but not LLD's who also scumread you on Day 1?

LLD scumreaded me but she also pushed scum to death in a pivotal situation and that's way more valuable

5) set aside nka and vca, i still dislike the ongoing defense of titus from chara and morph before artemiana admitted it was a fake guilty. This is regardless of titus alignment.

her claim literally changed from "targeted myself" to "targeted NM" partway through and i didn't like her justification for it at all. that and i never bought that one of anya's duplicates could be used for a cop check.
and i was right, so.

morph seems to know Arte better and so recognized the whole gambit thing.

As much as i <3 you, i find your reasons to defend titus a bit weak. I think this would be how scum!you would act when given the opportunity to shade a cop without taking too much of a hit if you had to backpedal off your stance.

like even if Arte is town, you expect me to believe a claim that half-baked in a meta where town fuck up or just lie all the time?

Eh, well, yeah you should have imo. Maybe i'm just out of touch with the town meta but i'm still concerned that only a couple people immediately doubted a guilty report without any significant reason to do so - i am aware i am projecting my expectations onto others but it doesn't mean i am wrong

[Dunnstral]

VOTE: dunnstral

You don't want this

[Guillotina]

Spoiler:

7) SS is very likely town based on what i know of him

Could you expand on this?

No

4) maybe guillotina is also scum given that he has only pushed town and defended scum so far, i.e. 2966 seems to be a scummy position to take around flipped scum + he has been pushing me since forever + his logic is very very questionable

What's scummy for wanting to yeet in my scum reads? I'm happy we flipped anya and I wished I got credit for it but no biggie, there is more scum to hunt.

I have been pushing you since forever? I actually forgot about you, do you still feel pressure from me from Day 1? Do you you feel that just my sole presence is a threat?

Idc about pressure, but from my pov you've been pushing town and defending scum based on logic that i don't agree with and that's a red flag to me

1) i agree with bingle that LLD is super town post-flip

Why do you feel my Day 1 FoS on you like a consistent push today, but not LLD's who also scumread you on Day 1?

LLD scumreaded me but she also pushed scum to death in a pivotal situation and that's way more valuable

5) set aside nka and vca, i still dislike the ongoing defense of titus from chara and morph before artemiana admitted it was a fake guilty. This is regardless of titus alignment.

her claim literally changed from "targeted myself" to "targeted NM" partway through and i didn't like her justification for it at all. that and i never bought that one of anya's duplicates could be used for a cop check.
and i was right, so.

morph seems to know Arte better and so recognized the whole gambit thing.

As much as i <3 you, i find your reasons to defend titus a bit weak. I think this would be how scum!you would act when given the opportunity to shade a cop without taking too much of a hit if you had to backpedal off your stance.

like even if Arte is town, you expect me to believe a claim that half-baked in a meta where town fuck up or just lie all the time?

Eh, well, yeah you should have imo. Maybe i'm just out of touch with the town meta but i'm still concerned that only a couple people immediately doubted a guilty report without any significant reason to do so - i am aware i am projecting my expectations onto others but it doesn't mean i am wrong

So in your opinion town has to be right on the people they yeet otherwise they gotta be scum too?

[Bingle]

then you can gain a lot without losing much.

Risking :lolguiltyhammers: and stifling natural discussion in this case being the much, but yes, that article was written for a different time.

The problem with saying fake guilty gambits are okay is that you get a lot of really shitty gambits that do pretty much exactly this. Introduce a bunch of WIFOM to the thread, confuse a bunch of issues, piss off a bunch of players, and don't actually help with reads progressions all that much.

[Something_Smart]

I mean, sure it was a shitty gambit. But that doesn't mean that all gambits are necessarily shitty. The main reason it was shitty was because of how sloppy she was with the mechanics, which distracted from the actual guilty claim.

[Guillotina]

I'm dipping out for a bit, I got other games to play, have fun have fun.

[Chara]

Eh, well, yeah you should have imo. Maybe i'm just out of touch with the town meta but i'm still concerned that only a couple people immediately doubted a guilty report without any significant reason to do so - i am aware i am projecting my expectations onto others but it doesn't mean i am wrong

i hard disagree that a claim that changed midway through in a pretty important way isn't a significant reason to doubt it. i'm not in the habit of blindly believing claims that don't make sense to me.

this is particularly frustrating because you seem to be suspecting me for being (correctly) dubious about a dubious cop guilty against a player i townread. finding my Titus defense unconvincing or too strong for the reasoning i've given is one thing but Arte's claim absolutely deserved the suspicion i gave it.

[Chara]

i don't know if you've played a lot of games where people just lie for a reaction, Fark, but the fact that this whole fake guilty thing is even a debate should tell you that i've dealt with this crap enough.