Townstumps Mafia (Endgame)

[House]

okay, what do we have?

We have an excellent dark horse in nomnomnom.

I like dark horses.

What's your read on that slot?

has kinda felt town through interactions with moon but aside from that hasn't felt like a priority sort so I don't have much

Which interactions with moon gave you that vibe?

[Moongrass]

Norwegian I think you have rare gut read skill particularly in early game. If it's possible could you forget everything and reread people's first few posts and nut out some reads based on that, I'd be really interested to know what you think if you're willing.

Based on what by the way? Where did you get that impression from?

Well you caught scum in your first few posts in the game you replaced out of but then you changed your mind after some content.

[Gamma Emerald]

moon could you please respond to my question? If needed I can reframe it, since it's kinda diffused across like 3 posts

[House]

moon could you please respond to my question? If needed I can reframe it, since it's kinda diffused across like 3 posts

Could you respond to mine?

I'm not immune to changing my reads, if new information warrants it.

[Moongrass]

moon could you please respond to my question? If needed I can reframe it, since it's kinda diffused across like 3 posts

Oh yeah please recap the question in a tldr.

[Gamma Emerald]

moon could you please respond to my question? If needed I can reframe it, since it's kinda diffused across like 3 posts

Could you respond to mine?

I'm not immune to changing my reads, if new information warrants it.

I'm working on it in another tab, I'm basically gonna go over their whole series of interaction during this game, describe what I see, and maybe reconsider things because the nom read is kinda based n an assumption that moon is scum, so I'm trying to figure out if the townread holds if I assume the opposite. So yeah, it'll take some time to put that out.

[Moongrass]

Nsg that's where you ignore the other person. We all know you're great, can you please redirect onto if my wagon was a counter and what nom scum means for NK?

idk if I like how this reads. It kinda feels like moon wants to lead the discussion into topics that suit them, which raises the question, why is the current discussion harmful?
In my opinion I think the end goal of this may be to keep nsg and norwee from actually reconciling their reads, which I view as rather pro-scum, as if the town stumps are not unified it breaks up potential pressure on scum.

Is this the question because that was not part of the game, I was telling nsg to ignore the digs not the reads, and in case you didn't pick up on it nsg was not in a place to talk reads right in the middle of that.

This is an unfair argument because I was attempting to get the discussion back to the game, asking nsg to hash out the implications of a scum nom read.

[Gamma Emerald]

I think there's clearly a split in the game with jjh mastina on one side and Fey nm on the other. If both groups are town then the game gets tricky.

this is very interesting, talk about this more

like, if you're right about that, it may change both how I view you and whatever slots are attached to that gamestate read

I think there's clearly a split in the game with jjh mastina on one side and Fey nm on the other. If both groups are town then the game gets tricky.

okay, so I've seen a post like this in a kinda-recent game, and before I can make a fair comparison I need your judgement on where you think scum is in this dichotomy. I don't need exact names, just how much in each side.

Essentially, out of jjh+mastina and Feys+NM, I want to know how many scum you think are in each atm.

[Moongrass]

Oh ok one moment please.

[House]

moon could you please respond to my question? If needed I can reframe it, since it's kinda diffused across like 3 posts

Could you respond to mine?

I'm not immune to changing my reads, if new information warrants it.

I'm working on it in another tab, I'm basically gonna go over their whole series of interaction during this game, describe what I see, and maybe reconsider things because the nom read is kinda based n an assumption that moon is scum, so I'm trying to figure out if the townread holds if I assume the opposite. So yeah, it'll take some time to put that out.

That's great, thanks!

[Moongrass]

I think both those groups are aligned, with nm/fey being less strongly aligned. So either TvT or SvS like:

Jjh
Mastina
House
Gamma
Cyrus
FMFT
Titus
NK15
Nom
Not mafia
Feys

Or the inverse:

Not mafia
Feys
NK15
House
Gamma
Cyrus
FMFT
Titus
Nom
Jjh
Mastina

[House]

By the way Gamma, 1790 was a message to nomnomnom. That message being, if I wanted to make a case on them, I could easily do so regardless of pesky little inconveniences such as whether "facts" or "reality" support my push. That's why I specifically worded it the way I did.

Your response to that post reinforced that message.

It was never my intention to actually threaten you, and I figured you'd see that also via the way the post was worded.

[House]

By the way Gamma, 1786 was a message to nomnomnom. That message being, if I wanted to make a case on them, I could easily do so regardless of pesky little inconveniences such as whether "facts" or "reality" support my push. That's why I specifically worded it the way I did.

Your response to that post reinforced that message.

It was never my intention to actually threaten you, and I figured you'd see that also via the way the post was worded.

Edit, wrong post#

[Gamma Emerald]

I think both those groups are aligned, with nm/fey being less strongly aligned. So either TvT or SvS like:

Jjh
Mastina
House
Gamma
Cyrus
FMFT
Titus
NK15
Nom
Not mafia
Feys

Or the inverse:

Not mafia
Feys
NK15
House
Gamma
Cyrus
FMFT
Titus
Nom
Jjh
Mastina

okay. First thought is what's going on with the NK15 read, seeing as it's in two different spots despite not being included in the initial dichotomy? The second thing is this doesn't really feel the same as the previous thing I mentioned from the prior game, so I don't think I'm exactly ready to put any stock into this. To be clear, in the other game the person who posted a thing like this ended up half-right, they had a guess of about 2 scum in one group of three and 1 scum in another group of 3, it was that group with one in it they were right about. The critical difference I see is there's a lack of nuance in moon's theory, it assumes one group has to be S/S, despite previously postulating serious ramifications for both being T/T. If that wasn't a perceived possibility, why bring it up, and if it was, why not think about and construct a readlist based on that presumed gamestate?

[Gamma Emerald]

By the way Gamma, 1786 was a message to nomnomnom. That message being, if I wanted to make a case on them, I could easily do so regardless of pesky little inconveniences such as whether "facts" or "reality" support my push. That's why I specifically worded it the way I did.

Your response to that post reinforced that message.

It was never my intention to actually threaten you, and I figured you'd see that also via the way the post was worded.

Edit, wrong post#

yeah that makes sense
it's essentially one of those times when someone has a q+ stored and it screws with the context, but you designed it that way this time

[House]

[Titus]

If I had rolled scum here I'd be playing to make sure nsg and mastina townread me.

Very good point actually.

There's no point in playing to mastina. It's an empty slot, even more so than me.

[Titus]

to be clear, i've never said that it's impossible for jjh to be scum. my argument—as it always is—is that i see the evidence for him being town as being relatively strong, and the evidence for him being scum to be fairly weak or nonexistent.

I don't see the evidence for him being town. I see his reads coming from nowhere, particularly his mastina read.

[Gamma Emerald]

If I had rolled scum here I'd be playing to make sure nsg and mastina townread me.

Very good point actually.

There's no point in playing to mastina. It's an empty slot, even more so than me.

wdym "empty slot"? masinta has been active at times

[Moongrass]

First thought is what's going on with the NK15 read, seeing as it's in two different spots despite not being included in the initial dichotomy?

That's due to my assumption that the current NK wagon was built up in such a way that NK/mastina/jjh are not aligned. In a vacuum NK is scummy but if the mastina/jjh pairing are scum then NK moves up.

My thinking is not nuanced, its complicated but until I feel fairly certain on the pairings I'm unlikely to explore this much further until we get a flip.

[Moongrass]

If I had rolled scum here I'd be playing to make sure nsg and mastina townread me.

Very good point actually.

There's no point in playing to mastina. It's an empty slot, even more so than me.

Well in hindsight yeah, but if you rolled scum you're going to play your towny butt off out of the gate if you know mastina/nsg are town in the game. Which jjh did. How would a scum jjh know that mastina was going to be largely absent?

[Gamma Emerald]

My thinking is not nuanced, its complicated but until I feel fairly certain on the pairings I'm unlikely to explore this much further until we get a flip.

Nuanced and complicated are kinda similar IMO?

[Gamma Emerald]

Btw I’m hoping to not have this be the case but I might not be able to post my thoughts on nom vs. moon for a few hours since I’m going to see the movie In The Heights soon

[Titus]

My thinking is not nuanced, its complicated but until I feel fairly certain on the pairings I'm unlikely to explore this much further until we get a flip.

Nuanced and complicated are kinda similar IMO?

Nuanced has fine details.
Complicated is hard to understand.

[Titus]

I think there's clearly a split in the game with jjh mastina on one side and Fey nm on the other. If both groups are town then the game gets tricky.

I'm unsure I follow that logic.

Moonlogic isn't for everyone.

Elaborate more on this split. I can handle moonlogic.