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[nomnomnom]

Gut is saying Seanzie is town right now

Let's do it this way: convince me that Sean is town.
As I said, I think all 3 of Salsabil/Sean/boxxy are good lims today, so if you have an actual strong reason to believe he is town, show it to me.

[Seanzie]

Uhh... what are the rules on this site about mentioning things from ongoing games?

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=30908

Thanks. I will not share then.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I will later

[humaneatingmonkey]

Seanzie, how did I become your top townread over nomnomnom?

[Seanzie]

Seanzie, how did I become your top townread over nomnomnom?

Working with you yesterday, the way you were pushing Boxxy, it had very clear agenda. At first I thought it was scum agenda, but then as I engaged with you, I could tell that your agenda was town trying to get their scumread elim'd agenda. Also, while your original case had holes in it, once I actually talked to you, it was clear your read on Boxxy had substance.

Also, Cyrus spewed both of us town at some point while we were fighting about Boxxy, and then the way you engaged with Cyrus about Boxxy's claim was very clearly not teamed with Cyrus. Then I think you hammered him? Like, if you're scum here, you are a cold hearted monkey.

Nom in general has been good, but her whole "I have a scumtell on Cyrus, and I'm going to talk a lot about it but not share it" left a very bad taste in my mouth, it did nothing but distract the thread, so I'm not as confident about Nom as I am about you. They also have been going a bit further downhill since because their recent push on me does not feel good, but I still think they are >rand!town, just maybe paranoid about a new person.

[humaneatingmonkey]

At first I thought it was scum agenda, but then as I engaged with you, I could tell that your agenda was town trying to get their scumread elim'd agenda. Also, while your original case had holes in it, once I actually talked to you, it was clear your read on Boxxy had substance.

What made you flip your reads from scum agenda to town agenda? What were the holes in my original case? What made it clear that my read had substance?

[humaneatingmonkey]

her whole "I have a scumtell on Cyrus, and I'm going to talk a lot about it but not share it" left a very bad taste in my mouth, it did nothing but distract the thread, so I'm not as confident about Nom as I am about you.

why does it make you lean that behavior as scum if cyrus flipped scum anyway?

[Seanzie]

At first I thought it was scum agenda, but then as I engaged with you, I could tell that your agenda was town trying to get their scumread elim'd agenda. Also, while your original case had holes in it, once I actually talked to you, it was clear your read on Boxxy had substance.

What made you flip your reads from scum agenda to town agenda?

What were the holes in my original case?

What made it clear that my read had substance?

The fact that as I pushed you, it was clear your case had more depth than the one presented in thread.

I went over that in pretty fine detail yesterday. You misrepresented and oversimplified some stuff Boxxy had said and done. I do that too sometimes when I'm hardtunneling a strong scumread.

As I pushed you about your reads, you were able to communicate your thoughts and reasons. For example, at some point, you pointed out that Boxxy flipped from giving you a scumread to a townread, and you knew that you were only shitposting before that. This was a very good point, and while it isn't impossible for scum to fake, usually scum doesn't jump on people for giving them townreads. There were other examples that as I engaged with you, it was clear that your thoughts ran deeper than your original simplified case.

[Seanzie]

her whole "I have a scumtell on Cyrus, and I'm going to talk a lot about it but not share it" left a very bad taste in my mouth, it did nothing but distract the thread, so I'm not as confident about Nom as I am about you.

why does it make you lean that behavior as scum if cyrus flipped scum anyway?

It was performative and distracting the thread from scumhunting. It isn't necessarily scum-indicative, but it was anti-town. Also, it could have had scum-motive. Namely, it distances from Cyrus without actually giving anyone else a reason to scumread Cyrus, and if Scum!Nom eventually had to bus Cyrus, they could use that as justification, rather than actually having to case their teammate. IDK what sort of player Nom is though, so I'm not reading too much into this, but I know I didn't like it when it happened.

This was actually what caused a lot of my original resistance to yours and Nom's case on Boxxy. Nom was pushing Boxxy because Boxxy didn't like Nom's play with the "scumtell", and I personally agreed with Boxxy there. Nom also made up some BS to Dwlee about how Boxxy was scummy for questioning Nom about it, but Dwlee was towny, just because Boxxy had outed a scumread of Cyrus but Dwlee hadn't. Since I was scumreading Cyrus and also finding Nom's scumtell thing bad, that didn't sit well with me.

[nomnomnom]

It was performative

It quite literally caught scum.

[nomnomnom]

What was so good about my play, by the way? I'm curious.

[Seanzie]

What was so good about my play, by the way? I'm curious.

In general I've gotten good vibes from you. Your early suspicion of me seemed very natural and coming from a scumhunting mindset. Once I sorted through the case on Boxxy, I agreed that he was likely scum, so you are mostly pushing in directions that make sense to me. Including your current PoE, which I agree with 2/3 names. While your play towards Cyrus isn't fully clearing you two as teammates, I do think it is more likely not teamed than teamed. Your push on me today has been shit, your scumslip thing wasn't great and the way you and Monkey derailed the thread was not great for threadhealth, but otherwise your play has looked good to me.

[Seanzie]

What was so good about my play, by the way? I'm curious.

Can you tell me about Almost50? I asked you about them earlier, and you didn't really answer. Why do you see them as town? If I am wrong about them, I'd like to know.

[nomnomnom]

What was so good about my play, by the way? I'm curious.

Can you tell me about Almost50? I asked you about them earlier, and you didn't really answer. Why do you see them as town? If I am wrong about them, I'd like to know.

I didn't say they were town. I said where I wanted to vote.
There are worlds where A50 is scum, definitely. But even if that's the case, I largely think it's irrelevant in my solve here. At least one of you/Salsabil/Boxxy is scum. That is all I know and all I care about, really.

[Seanzie]

What was so good about my play, by the way? I'm curious.

Can you tell me about Almost50? I asked you about them earlier, and you didn't really answer. Why do you see them as town? If I am wrong about them, I'd like to know.

I didn't say they were town. I said where I wanted to vote.
There are worlds where A50 is scum, definitely. But even if that's the case, I largely think it's irrelevant in my solve here. At least one of you/Salsabil/Boxxy is scum. That is all I know and all I care about, really.

Oh, I thought you were saying you were 100% sure that all scum were in {me, Salsabil, Boxxy}.

Do people normally not work with each other here? I've been like asking for people to talk to me about reads, and I swear it is like pulling teeth. I don't know how to play this game if I can work with people to get a read on them and for them to help me get a read on others. You're like the 4th person I've tried to engage with and you just don't even seem interested in trying to share thoughts and collectively worldbuild. This is a team game, y'know.

[nomnomnom]

This is a team game, y'know.

Correct, and I believe you're not on my team. Why should I collaborate with you?

[nomnomnom]

Anyways, logging off. Need to rest head :3

[Seanzie]

This is a team game, y'know.

Correct, and I believe you're not on my team. Why should I collaborate with you?

Working with people helps you develop your reads on them and on others. Since you're not right about all three people in your PoE, working with them can help you figure out who is most likely scum and who you might be wrong about. If you don't see the clear town benefit of working with others, idk what to tell you, other than in general it is bad play to just refuse to work with others unless they are outed.

[Seanzie]

I just read through Salsabil's ISO, and came out feeling a lot less confident about my scumread. Early D1, they did a few things that really pinged me, but now looking back, it looks like were thinking critically around the Boxxy wagon, and their pushes on Cyrus look good. Apparently they distance a lot as scum, so I'm going to take their Cyrus interactions with a grain of salt. There was one post that caught my eye that kind of looked like a slip, but given the language barrier, I'm loathe to read into it. If it wasn't a slip, it was actually a pretty reasonable post that seemed to wanted to sort ssbm. Kerset made a good point though that Salsabil seemed to be asking a lot of questions without much followup.

So, I'm moving Salsabil out of my immediate PoE, into my upper PoE.

[Seanzie]

so now that thats done as i said boxy isnt lieing. so check monkey to see why he wanted to lynch a pr.

i wouldn't lynch nom they anit scum regardless

pushing boxxy is a bad idea move on. im sure you guys can do it.

fatia isnt scum trust me.

It's WIFOM-y, but I don't cyrus puts attention on his scumteam on his way out the door here. Knowing what these posts will look like after he flips, I see him doing a basic play of trying to put attention on some random town players. I'm willing to think these players are town for the time being.


Also unrelated but

Box is kind of player with old account, empty hole and claims to be playing offside.

I never claimed to be playing offsite. There's a hole in my account cause I wasn't playing.

I also think that with cyrus drawing the attention he was, scum would bus to build a bit of towncred. That's why I targetted seanzie last night.

Reading Dwlee99 in iso, I don't like it. He seems a little too agreeable in how he joins up with powertown monkey/nom.

Goes from really liking my play

let's do boxxy guys. it's a good wagon

This is a super weird take?

I've liked boxxy's posting a lot.

I'm still trying to figure out nom though. I don't know if nom withholding the tell is inherently scummy but I'd really like to hear it if it's going to be justifying a scum read this early especially when it feels like cyrus town-slipped.

To joining the wagon once it had momentum but the content had not changed.

Okay, I've read over that interaction and I see what you're talking about now. I wish boxxy was here to respond and give some updates but I feel like him not is kind of by his own design.

VOTE: boxxy

Finally he hammers cyrus once it was a foregone conclusion. It just feels a bit too much like trying not to be objectionable and make friends with powertown.

VOTE: Dwlee99

Can you explain this please?

[MaxTheFox]

Finally caught up and wondering what even are these posts.

VOTE: cyrus62 this talk is getting us no where . when i flip town check monkey. ps i just cant keep up right now.

Like... What gambit even is this? Voting yourself as a gambit only works in later days, day 1 a policy elim is still on the table. This sounds more like you'd clear the person your targetting if you flip evil. Speaking of flip...

so now that thats done as i said boxy isnt lieing. so check monkey to see why he wanted to lynch a pr.

why though

im the type of guy who plays fair. good job . town good job.

fatia isnt scum trust me.

This literally just sounds like throwing? Or the worst WIFOM ever. The worst wine nobody would even drink.

So honestly for now I'll assume anything he said is pointless to find his partners.

Or that's what he wants you to think.

[MaxTheFox]

I want to let boxxy live but his recent posts kinda reek of scum.

[MaxTheFox]

So I'll rethink that.

[Seanzie]

I want to let boxxy live but his recent posts kinda reek of scum.

Do you have any other reads?

[boxxy]

Quick post before bed after catching up, just to answer a few questions thrown my way.

As T3 mentioned I am fairly new, I played a few games years ago, and just got back into it with a game a week or so again.

I chose seanzie for my target because I was fairly confident cyrus had be bussed, so I picked a more or less random choice from that wagon. Nom/HEM's push felt organic, the rest of the wagon didn't have much content except seanzie who had parked his vote there early and never returned. I didn't have the

@Seanzie what do you want me to explain, that whole post is explanation. I can outline it again tomorrow in more detail if you don't follow or if you have any specific questions please share.