In post 253, GrandpaMo wrote:@NEE, do you think that inconsistent where they implicitly townread Val through them scumreading me, comes from town?
I'm not going to go way hard on this particular point as i'm not James's lawyer, but it is my experience that town sometimes change their reads drastically without sharing the exact thought process. And James here went from saying they scumread Val, to saying they scumread you and that they implicitly townread Val. Why would scum!James neglect mentioning their progression? Now town!James might very well have neglected to mention this point as they simply considered that a world in which Grandpa!scum implicitly meant town!Val.
They could also hid it with INTENT as scum because they knew they couldn't get town to vote Val and saw Zyla voting me and Cook scum reading me so they took the opportunity to scumread me -- hence the farfetched BS reasons (from my perspective)
They could also have hid it WITHOUT INTENT as scum finding a place to scumread me and didn't know they had scumread Val in the beginning.
I only bring this point up because James has explicitly said that, I, GRANDPA IS POCKETING VAL (I didn't even know who at the point -- meaning who getting Val to sheep with but I think he was talking about himself) and so it just brings up that question that you brought with the inconsistencies stuff; would town really neglect that?. Ironically, it should be more of Val pocketing me if that were the case since Val was the one who started the scumread on James lol.
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
Online and in the middle of catching up; so far liking Norwegian a lot more than I liked Mini, and since part of the original read was the inactivity, the current active behavior definitely outweighs the old thoughts
True, but it's one of two options I know of to get the ball rolling. If you don't like RVS, how would you prefer town getting conversation going?
This is very very ironic because a No Lim has caused this conversation to get started and maybe get a read on you and maybe see interactions with other people. This is why I pointed you out earlier.
I lied.
Yes, I lied to you, it wasn't just because I pointed it out to say "it was funny", I pointed it out because I knew this was going to happen, and you weren't going to realize it after questioning hence why I had to lie so I can drop it off. But since, it has escalated ever since, the only reason this conversation happened was because VFP did a no lim. It's really NAI, and it seems like you are trying to set him up as scum for it. Yes, maybe he could be scum however, this is something more of NAI in my opinion, and shouldn't be taken as a regard. Many people no lim on day 1 and many people vote on day 1.
We will all be voting regardless by day 1, so there is no point to continue this conversation. I thought you would stop because you would find it unnecessary and NAI to keep going about a specific vote, specifically a no lim.
But you didn't.
So I will give you scumpings for this. I don't fully scumread you because you initiating this conversation could be towny of you but the way you are handling it could be scummy of you if you understand.
"NAI, could be scum, don't read over this, stop the conversation"
To me this just seems absurd, he seems to go back and forth and back in a single post, and tries to suggest the conversation should just end, when so far it's been pretty productive and getting people to talk.
In post 49, GrandpaMo wrote:and realized it was just a BS post to make it seem long, with no content providing and voting someone other than your scumread xD
Absolutely correct. It was a straight-forward RVS vote dressed up in the style of a serious wall post. You correctly identify the most obvious punchline there, but I dropped a few other things that should have made it clear it was entirely non-serious. I don't really claim to have invented the acronym 'WIFOM', to take another example. Of course, if it transpires that
MiniMegaByte
is scum, I reserve the right to imply I was in fact being serious and I knew from day one.
My post #27 was equally non-serious. Technically, reading you as null was serious, but the reasons equally BS. The clue there was the fact the that you HAD put your vote on one of the 3 - and Cook, MiniMegaByte and me are definitely 3, by the way - with the kicker being the reference to
alstroemeria
, whom was yet to be mentioned. I read you as null because I was reading everyone as null. There is nothing upto #27 I consider indicative either way.
Okay I guess we both misunderstood? LOL. I just thought my RVS didn't really count as a "joke" scumread or whatever you want to read it as and so I just assumed you would imply that the people I scumread (and not the person I voted!) was scum.
In post 60, MiniMegabyte wrote:Who would've thought that at the beginning of the game people joke around
Indeed.
In post 49, GrandpaMo wrote:you can see how it's bad and you should admit that.
To be clear - I do nothing of the sort.
Okay this was also sort of a wifom post to see your reaction to how well you took pressure early game. You took it well, unless this how you play good as scum. But I will give you towncreds for now as this post was not expected (yes, I expected a manipulative scummy post for some reason lol) but you did well responding to my points.
How well he took pressure? He just said his stuff wasn't serious? That get's town cred?
Look at the full context please. Smh. The answer you are looking for should be within the conversation. I will give you a hint; the reason relates to a misunderstanding we BOTH had. (I am assuming)
I don't like that this is his best answer. Where in the conversation is the answer? How is it supposed to be found? If the person asking the question was able to find it, don't you think they would've just... not asked the question?
In post 105, alstroemerial wrote:Thanks for condensing everything a bit more, Zyla. I interpreted post 78 as a joke, kind of like someone who's never played chess saying they're undefeated in chess. To be honest, so far, the only post in VFP's ISO that I interpret as serious is 57, and I would be curious for more of their thoughts.
Also, I'm not going to quote it again, but here's my interpretation of GrandpaMo's post 87... I didn't totally follow the first sentence so it kind of starts from after that.
1) VFP's no-lim is NAI, so he thinks it is suspicious that you are scumreading them for it.
2) Everyone will eventually vote by the end of D1, including VFP, so stressing about the no-lim is pointless. So, he expected you to stop pushing the issue, but you didn't.
3) Pushing something that Mo thinks is NAI makes you suspicious a bit.
Now that I write it out like that it seems a little less compelling than it was in my head, to be honest, but that combined with the OMGUS still has you slightly on the red side for me. But I do agree that it's been confusing.
Yea, that's why I said bad reaction because it was a weird omgus.
I don't fully scumread you but you are like the only one who I see that could be possible scum.
Also I agree with T3 and I do think your introduction is actually towny.
You did hit all the parts right. That was the main reason but it's also the way she ended up going with the convo -- just seemed like a way for scum to, I don't know, maybe drive a possible condemn? See this is why I give them scumpings not a full scumread because they could defeinitly be town for initiating the scumread or this convo -- which is has to be found, a very towny thing to do. So if that is the case (which will need to be decided later) then yea there is a chance for her to flip town.
(I'm not entirely sure who the pronouns are referring to, but it doesn't really matter)
If Grandpa doesn't scumread someone, how are they possible scum? That just doesn't make sense, could be just bad logic though.
In post 158, GrandpaMo wrote:Also, I very much dislike how James just left this conversation. This looks bad for you, James.
Scumreading someone for going to sleep is just.. bad.
In post 256, GrandpaMo wrote:I think also I will townlean you for not straight up finding scum between me and James. I feel like scum would just try to get an easy vote off me or James.
And then there's this. Why is he commenting saying that he's an easy vote?
In post 277, Zyla wrote:Why is he commenting saying that he's an easy vote?
My guess is that it's because a lot of the current discourse has been centered around Grandpa and James, and they've gotten more of the votes, so it would be an easy move to slip onto one of those wagons rather than starting something relatively new.
In post 206, Val89 wrote:
So, in conclusion, whilst I agreed with Alstroemerial (and James himself) that all this was initially NAI, at this point it does seem to be a pattern emerging which I do think adds to the very strong scum case against James.
Yes, let it be clear that my vote is still very much on James for the same reasons as prior. I'm going to try to go through and make my own concise case. I think this particular occurrence was NAI but there are other alignment indicative things -- in other words, we don't need to worry about it for a case
In post 57, VFP wrote:
Thats 3 pages, 3 reads! A read per page!
Obliged to scumread you for this LAMIST.
An example of why I'm TR-ing NEE -- pointing out something new that could have flown under the radar (in addition to the ongoing case NEE is making against Zyla). I'm getting the sense that NEE is engaging with the game with a broad lens, and I do agree that the case against Zyla instead of one of the ongoing wagons makes it more likely that NEE is town, especially if one of Grandpa/James is scum -- if NEE was one of their scumbuddies, it would make sense to try to help out by going for the other one in the pair.
On the subject of the Grandpa/James wagons, I think Grandpa should give serious consideration to moving his vote to James. I get the impression the vote on Cook was done to try draw a reaction from them, and it hasn't had that effect, and I doubt anyone else is going Cook right now.
Me, Grandpa and Alstroemerial have all read James as scum. Alstro has also expressed disquiet at the fact some slots are coasting, and I agree. James isn't going into hammer range without a vote from one of the 'passive' slots, that, being an E-1 vote, would presumably induce some sort of explanation. It's unlikely further votes on James will come from NorwegianboyEE nor Zyla, so it means some of the inactive slots will have to come to table.
If we are wrong about James being scum, and those other slots agree with NorwegianboyEE that James is Town, and we are all silly newbies voting a townie, then perhaps one of them might have something more convincing than NorwegianboyEE's had for us so far, and the game moves on that way.
Fair enough, but I don't see the point in emphasizing that when it's day 1. If you're 100% set in stone on your votes this early on someone's doing something wrong
That last post would read exactly the same if it just said "Fair enough".
Everything after the 'but' smells like "I better add some verbiage that looks good, but says nothing".
It's almost as if you tried to hang a case on someone who is expressing themselves clumsily, and when point out what the clumsy construction probably means, you have a "shit, of course" moment, but can't bring yourself just to say that. +10 scum points.
I'm sorry if you don't like the fact that I like to post complete thoughts. I personally think it does change the way the post reads to add "i still don't agree with it for this reason" rather than leaving it as two words
You may well feel like you can't leave it as two words which amount to "my point was shit" if you are scum, and your point was against someone you need to push as scum. Like, if anything in my case against you or James is just straight up crap based on a simple misunderstanding and another player comes along and points it out, I don't see an issue just saying "yeah, you are right, that's crap".
What's the reason you still don't like someone saying you are a scumlean, and the only scumlean they have so far? That it was Day 1? That they could change their mind later?
Incidentally, we have been interacting a fair bit of late. Have you enough information to make a read on me now?
In post 57, VFP wrote:
Thats 3 pages, 3 reads! A read per page!
Obliged to scumread you for this LAMIST.
An example of why I'm TR-ing NEE -- pointing out something new that could have flown under the radar (in addition to the ongoing case NEE is making against Zyla). I'm getting the sense that NEE is engaging with the game with a broad lens, and I do agree that the case against Zyla instead of one of the ongoing wagons makes it more likely that NEE is town, especially if one of Grandpa/James is scum -- if NEE was one of their scumbuddies, it would make sense to try to help out by going for the other one in the pair.
Alstro do you townread me? Because me and the scumcase on Zyla from NEE allign so I am assuming they townread me. And my townread on NEE alligns with the same proposed logic on how NEE is town because they were on Zyla instead of the ongoing wagon.
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
In post 288, T3 wrote:
I remember I sred grandpa in another game as town for exactly this.
What's this?
LOL
I had the same question. Like you push me for something that could have been easily debunked and in which I did then you claim it didn't happen, and now you claim it did?
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
In post 283, Val89 wrote:On the subject of the Grandpa/James wagons, I think Grandpa should give serious consideration to moving his vote to James. I get the impression the vote on Cook was done to try draw a reaction from them, and it hasn't had that effect, and I doubt anyone else is going Cook right now.
Me, Grandpa and Alstroemerial have all read James as scum. Alstro has also expressed disquiet at the fact some slots are coasting, and I agree. James isn't going into hammer range without a vote from one of the 'passive' slots, that, being an E-1 vote, would presumably induce some sort of explanation. It's unlikely further votes on James will come from NorwegianboyEE nor Zyla, so it means some of the inactive slots will have to come to table.
If we are wrong about James being scum, and those other slots agree with NorwegianboyEE that James is Town, and we are all silly newbies voting a townie, then perhaps one of them might have something more convincing than NorwegianboyEE's had for us so far, and the game moves on that way.
Nah. I will wait more.
I don't think scumteam would make it obvious as Zyla + James; I just believe one scum is between in them. Zyla is probably misguided town and James is the scum person.
I am just trying to figure out who James could be possible scum with.
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
I think if James is scum, and they are bussing -- Val/Alstro are highly probably candidates (leaning heavily on Val tho). I will redact this info until tmr, if I am alive by then.
If James is scum, and they are not bussing, I believe there scum partner could be T3.
T3 also looks bad.
And cook is just NAI, scumreading me right now which is kinda eh wack. But again, this is why I am not voting James.
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
In post 288, T3 wrote:
I remember I sred grandpa in another game as town for exactly this.
What's this?
LOL
I had the same question. Like you push me for something that could have been easily debunked and in which I did then you claim it didn't happen, and now you claim it did?
True, but it's one of two options I know of to get the ball rolling. If you don't like RVS, how would you prefer town getting conversation going?
This is very very ironic because a No Lim has caused this conversation to get started and maybe get a read on you and maybe see interactions with other people. This is why I pointed you out earlier.
I lied.
Yes, I lied to you, it wasn't just because I pointed it out to say "it was funny", I pointed it out because I knew this was going to happen, and you weren't going to realize it after questioning hence why I had to lie so I can drop it off. But since, it has escalated ever since, the only reason this conversation happened was because VFP did a no lim. It's really NAI, and it seems like you are trying to set him up as scum for it. Yes, maybe he could be scum however, this is something more of NAI in my opinion, and shouldn't be taken as a regard. Many people no lim on day 1 and many people vote on day 1.
We will all be voting regardless by day 1, so there is no point to continue this conversation. I thought you would stop because you would find it unnecessary and NAI to keep going about a specific vote, specifically a no lim.
But you didn't.
So I will give you scumpings for this. I don't fully scumread you because you initiating this conversation could be towny of you but the way you are handling it could be scummy of you if you understand.
"NAI, could be scum, don't read over this, stop the conversation"
To me this just seems absurd, he seems to go back and forth and back in a single post, and tries to suggest the conversation should just end, when so far it's been pretty productive and getting people to talk.
werent you the one who literally got on me for getting on a no lim vote being counterproductive??? and you even agreeed to that and that instantly contradicted your claim where you said "a no lim doesn't create any discussion x and x". very very hypocritcal. i don't go back and forth. alstro + me have gave you what that quote meant like 5 times already and you even came at an understanding later after i told you that i proposed a summary at the end in whcih you were like it wasn't a summary but alstro already had gave you the meaning and i agreeed. alstro hit almost spot on and i added to it. |: i rlly dont know why u are still bringing this up now.
In post 49, GrandpaMo wrote:and realized it was just a BS post to make it seem long, with no content providing and voting someone other than your scumread xD
Absolutely correct. It was a straight-forward RVS vote dressed up in the style of a serious wall post. You correctly identify the most obvious punchline there, but I dropped a few other things that should have made it clear it was entirely non-serious. I don't really claim to have invented the acronym 'WIFOM', to take another example. Of course, if it transpires that
MiniMegaByte
is scum, I reserve the right to imply I was in fact being serious and I knew from day one.
My post #27 was equally non-serious. Technically, reading you as null was serious, but the reasons equally BS. The clue there was the fact the that you HAD put your vote on one of the 3 - and Cook, MiniMegaByte and me are definitely 3, by the way - with the kicker being the reference to
alstroemeria
, whom was yet to be mentioned. I read you as null because I was reading everyone as null. There is nothing upto #27 I consider indicative either way.
Okay I guess we both misunderstood? LOL. I just thought my RVS didn't really count as a "joke" scumread or whatever you want to read it as and so I just assumed you would imply that the people I scumread (and not the person I voted!) was scum.
In post 60, MiniMegabyte wrote:Who would've thought that at the beginning of the game people joke around
Indeed.
In post 49, GrandpaMo wrote:you can see how it's bad and you should admit that.
To be clear - I do nothing of the sort.
Okay this was also sort of a wifom post to see your reaction to how well you took pressure early game. You took it well, unless this how you play good as scum. But I will give you towncreds for now as this post was not expected (yes, I expected a manipulative scummy post for some reason lol) but you did well responding to my points.
How well he took pressure? He just said his stuff wasn't serious? That get's town cred?
Look at the full context please. Smh. The answer you are looking for should be within the conversation. I will give you a hint; the reason relates to a misunderstanding we BOTH had. (I am assuming)
I don't like that this is his best answer. Where in the conversation is the answer? How is it supposed to be found? If the person asking the question was able to find it, don't you think they would've just... not asked the question?
i have no idea what you are referring to here. this is what happened in the interaction between me and james -- it seems like you are getting very over defensive as ur possible scum partner james. i already explained this multiple times. look at post 146 and the whole quote wall wit james initial reply and my justification as it wasn't that obvious. that context was obvious and town should have easily got it.
In post 105, alstroemerial wrote:Thanks for condensing everything a bit more, Zyla. I interpreted post 78 as a joke, kind of like someone who's never played chess saying they're undefeated in chess. To be honest, so far, the only post in VFP's ISO that I interpret as serious is 57, and I would be curious for more of their thoughts.
Also, I'm not going to quote it again, but here's my interpretation of GrandpaMo's post 87... I didn't totally follow the first sentence so it kind of starts from after that.
1) VFP's no-lim is NAI, so he thinks it is suspicious that you are scumreading them for it.
2) Everyone will eventually vote by the end of D1, including VFP, so stressing about the no-lim is pointless. So, he expected you to stop pushing the issue, but you didn't.
3) Pushing something that Mo thinks is NAI makes you suspicious a bit.
Now that I write it out like that it seems a little less compelling than it was in my head, to be honest, but that combined with the OMGUS still has you slightly on the red side for me. But I do agree that it's been confusing.
Yea, that's why I said bad reaction because it was a weird omgus.
I don't fully scumread you but you are like the only one who I see that could be possible scum.
Also I agree with T3 and I do think your introduction is actually towny.
You did hit all the parts right. That was the main reason but it's also the way she ended up going with the convo -- just seemed like a way for scum to, I don't know, maybe drive a possible condemn? See this is why I give them scumpings not a full scumread because they could defeinitly be town for initiating the scumread or this convo -- which is has to be found, a very towny thing to do. So if that is the case (which will need to be decided later) then yea there is a chance for her to flip town.
(I'm not entirely sure who the pronouns are referring to, but it doesn't really matter)
If Grandpa doesn't scumread someone, how are they possible scum? That just doesn't make sense, could be just bad logic though.
idk if you noticed, but i said "possible scum" this was still when i was debating if u were scum or possible misguided town then james came into play and just used my bias. james could just be using u as a utility to vote me. thats where my paranoia creeked in. i didnt have any scumreads at the moment, but you were the only one who has potential to be scum. keywords: fully (which implies scumlean) and possible (paranoia of null read) and i furhter exemplified this in a later read where i said you were null scum leaning.
In post 158, GrandpaMo wrote:Also, I very much dislike how James just left this conversation. This looks bad for you, James.
Scumreading someone for going to sleep is just.. bad.
Okay this post pissed me off. What?????!?!?
I am not even-
Like where were you in the last 10 pages???
Did you not see the full post for this?
Did you not see anything for this?
Why are just bringing this stuff up now??
You just look like a bit of flailing scum trying your best to drive any momentum on a vote on me?
In post 256, GrandpaMo wrote:I think also I will townlean you for not straight up finding scum between me and James. I feel like scum would just try to get an easy vote off me or James.
And then there's this. Why is he commenting saying that he's an easy vote?
because majority is on us or james?? This should have been obvious. You could have been confused, but you shouldn't be know. the two major bws was me and james, heck i even think i was at e-2. and i had the most votes on me. scum usually comes in after a replacement and decides to scumread the person wit the most votes well that is biased because it happened to me before lol in a pervious game.
but idk -- this should have been obvious to you. also it sounds like you could be manipulating this to make me look bad for only me? like you know i said easy vote off me OR james? not just me. why didn't you mention james??
POSSIBLE SCUMPARTNER???!?!?!?!?
we may never know:(
"With grandpa in the game the postcount goes up and up and up and up...." - T3
I'll return later tonight.
