Newbie 2070 - Airplanes | GAME OVER

[Nancy Drew 39]

And if you ever actually get around to doing that metacheck, you will find that none of that is remotely scum indicative for me.

[ClarkBar]

I am also a little unhappy with this reference:

We still have a confirmed slot that hasn’t yet posted.

(SNIP)

I think until we hear from WS, I don’t want to assume more than one yet.

I am aware the WS slot is the slot I've replaced into, and her RVS vote is on my slot, but there is most certainly TWO slots to which the above applies, but only one gets a mention. What about the brookewyrm slot? Is there a reason Nancy fails to draw attention to that one, despite it being natural to refer to having 2 AFK slots at the time?

I am pretty unconvinced that only referring to one of the two slots that hadn't posted is all that AI. I also don't think that what was snipped from 146 at all twists or misrepresents what Val is trying to get at. I appreciate when people only quote what is relevant to their argument/point. If people went around quoting the entirety of other player's posts the thread would be dreadful to read.

Doing this running commentary on the spat between Nancy and Val and watching the temperature rise between them is interesting. Clash of personalities? Something doesn't seem organic here.

[T3]

Clark and Lunar are town mainly because it's hard to see their thought process coming from newbscum.

[Roden]

Hello everyone. I see quite a bit has happened already, I'll try to catch up as quickly as I can and get some posts in.

[Roden]

Really not liking this flash wagon attempt on Grandpa at the beginning. Also really hope that Lunar eventually starts actually playing the game at some point.

[Roden]

VOTE: GrandpaMo

i agree wagons are better

LOL thats actually funny -- i might just townread u off this

First Psyche votes Mo and then Mo says that he might townread Psyche off this. And then Psyche says that he's nervous and asks if he should just unvote after it looked like the wagon was going strong on Mo.

It's as if Psyche voted him so that Grandpa can confirm him or suggest that he is town because Psyche wanted to get a wagon going (if I haven't misunderstood). It looks like they were trying to distance each other, as if they aren't mafia together early but now that the wagon is going decently strong (3 votes). And the whole post saying that he's nervous and asking if he should unvote feels weird too. Why is Psyche pretending or atleast appears to pretend like he doesn't know what to do? If he thinks the wagon is rash why not just unvote? Why ask others?

Oh yep, they definitely start playing lol. Interested to see if this line of reasoning ends up going somewhere because I kinda agree with this.

[T3]

Val has reads but the rest of his posts are kind of devoid of actual content and just arguing.

[Val89]

Val has reads but the rest of his posts are kind of devoid of actual content and just arguing.

Fair. I can see how my posts from 195 onwards with Nancy could be fairly described as "just arging". It is difficult to engage with actual issues if you aren't getting any substantive response to engage with.

I can't look at what Nancy as chosen as her signature quotes, and also read her thinly veild threats in response to me ("I probably have a pretty good idea where my vote will go.", " If you weren’t a newbie, I promise I’d already be voting you", "I’m really getting irritated with your attitude. Do better." etc) and think her 'oh, you are such a bully' comeback is in any way serious. It's patently obviously an act, and having drawn that act out and having it recorded here in thread day one is about as far as I can go with this for now.

If it's here for someone to look over in a few game-days time when there well may be some further information to work with, then I think it was constructive to let that argument run its course, even if you disagree that it has told us anything of value at present.

[Roden]

Blurry popping in mid thread just to post a not-actually-reads reads list and then disappearing again feels bad. I understand they're busy but this added nothing to the game.

[T3]

I'm going to do a really good Roden read at some point.

[Roden]

I'm going to do a really good Roden read at some point.

Everyone should trust whatever read T3 has on me, the past four out of five games I've been in have now had T3 in it, and he's personally seen my scum playstyle in detail.

Unless he's scum of course. T3's way more of a wild card than me lol, so idk if I'll have a strong read on him until probably Day 2. His posts feel town so far though. I didn't like the Grandpa wagon but it didn't feel like he was grasping at straws to justify it.

[Roden]

Yeah, that’s right, please do a metadive on me and if you still double down after that, I probably have a pretty good idea where my vote will go.

If you weren’t a newbie, I promise I’d already be voting you for the two obviously untrue misreps.

RED FLAGS

I hope Nancy's responses to Val get better because this just feels like a SE throwing their weight around.

[Val89]

ClarkBar

This one is interesting. I'll start out by noting that, as I read through the thread in chronological order, it was often ClarkBar who popped up to ask the questions I was thinking. There isn't anything specific I can really point to and say "yep, that seems town to me", like I can with T3, but I do get a general, gut-level sense that this is a slot making posts aimed at driving discussion and shining a light on some of the iffy, or kooky, stuff that's happening in this game, and the posting of thoughts and the questioning does seem to having a pro-town effect.

That said, when I looked at the ISO and tried to make a list of his reads so far, I struggled. I mean, you can certainly have a good go at

inferring

what his reads might be, but I don't see any explicit mention of "X slot is town, I find Y slot scummy". It may well be that he is reluctant to share those reads without having a firm basis for them, and I can see that being a newbtown sort of behavior, but it could also be a good way for a scum slot to hedge their bets. I think the former is more likely, but I would feel a bit more comfortable with this slot if we started to see some more of the conclusions ClarkBar's questioning leads him to in terms of alignment.

The only other thing I consider of note was this, directed at LunarRest:

And what’s so unique about my posting o.O

Whether it's intentional or not your posts never seem serious. Like you're not playing to win, but instead being a personality. That's not necessarily a critique.

I'm struggling to see the basis for this conclusion. ClarkBar says in 42 that they took a look at Lunar's brief post history, but when I went and did it myself, brief is a little of an understatement. There is one other game, and the ISO is literally 7 posts. Touch of RVS, bit of a discussion about whether LunarRest's use of the word 'mafisio' was a scumtell or not (spoiler alert: It wasn't), and then they replaced out. That's it. As far as I am concerned, that game is a write off as far as telling us anything about LunarRest, so I find it interesting Clark finds something that leads them to think LunarRest isn't playing to win. What that means for Clarks alignment, if anything, I don't know, since I can't see why a scum!Clark would bring such a thing up, but it pinged me, so I thought I would document it.

I'm happy to call this one another

townlean

for now.

[T3]

Val and Clark are both town for the above.

[Roden]

Nancy, do you think you could explain the "alt thing" for us? Because even after reading through the thread I'm not sure what in particular it's referring to at this point beyond the fact an alt exists. I feel like the argument has morphed this bit into something unrecognizable, to the point where you and Val might not be arguing about the same thing anymore.

I also don't like that you're refusing to engage with someone just because they're pressuring you. I don't think Val is being toxic here, they're just pushing on you hard and you haven't really addressed much of their read on you. If you're town, you should want to defend yourself and prove them wrong, not ignore them.

[GrandpaMo]

Regarding the alt thing. I was annoyed that Nancy used a past experience with Grandpa to defend/justify the gameplay style they were using that got them to E-1 fairly quickly but then decided to not disclose the game in question. I wanted to skim that game for similarities to this one to get a better read on if what Nancy was saying was true and informed this game and Grandpa's play-style better. Why bring it up if we can only take her word for it? It felt to me that Nancy was advocating for Grandpa during his push and that pinged me so I wanted to explore their past relationship/interactions. Ultimately I was too lazy to sleuth the game out, and I wasn't motivated to bother Nancy about it. Seemed like a dead end. I will check out the link provided by Val later.

I can understand that but I was telling the truth, I did in fact miselim him and it was under a different account. If it had happened under this account, that would obviously be preferable but it wasn’t and that is my only experience playing with him.

i second this

[GrandpaMo]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

[GrandpaMo]

Val and Clark are both town for the above.

i dont know who scum is anymore.

t3, i willl ask u

who is scum

[Roden]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

Nancy should explain it enough to clarify the situation so everyone can be 100% on the same page. She doesn't need to go into full detail or out the alt.

[GrandpaMo]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

Nancy should explain it enough to clarify the situation so everyone can be 100% on the same page. She doesn't need to go into full detail or out the alt.

didnt she do that already like 4 times

[T3]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

no lol

[Roden]

she doesn't need to explain the alt thing.

it should be self explainable -- its not that hard to understand.

she townreads me because i am playing the same way i played in a game where she was scum and mislimmed me in.

that game she was on an alt.

and i probably know who she is talking bout -- nd can confirm this did happen.
val and nancy were just going bout either side triumph regarding all that i just epxlained above and it go no where.

yall r both town anwyays

Nancy should explain it enough to clarify the situation so everyone can be 100% on the same page. She doesn't need to go into full detail or out the alt.

didnt she do that already like 4 times

I thought she did, but again, not everyone seems to be on the same page atm and Val could be talking about something else involving the alt. I think it's more likely there's a miscommunication than scum intent in regards to this.

[GrandpaMo]

I believe Nancy was on the alt Emily but I might be wrong. Gramma, posting style, and time zones match.

emily is already outted

[GrandpaMo]

.