Silent Star 4: Yin and Yang

[Amy Dunne]

UNVOTE:

Yeah, I think Ircher definitely needs to be today’s elim.

VOTE: Ircher

E-1

again

I would like to see what Yin says at midnight

If you believe Ircher is anti town I don't think you should put him at X-1 yet

I would like to see what Yin says at midnight

If you believe Ircher is anti town I don't think you should put him at X-1 yet

Why not?

If he has the ability to self hammer then he will do it to rob us of that information

It's true, Ircher has had plenty of time to say anything. But he left at "I'll self hammer" and kept it at that.

this is what i'm referring to.
and at the time i thought yeah, that makes sense, we may as well wait for Yin, and i also didn't hammer. not that i likely would have if Tweet hadn't said to, either.

I was seriously paranoid he was a supersaint or something, which is why I didn’t want to be the hammer.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

this is what i'm referring to.
and at the time i thought yeah, that makes sense, we may as well wait for Yin, and i also didn't hammer. not that i likely would have if Tweet hadn't said to, either.

ok but if you look at the sequence I posted earlier,

it was

(4) Nakata
(3) Ircher

Tweet moves her vote from Nakata to Ircher, flipping the lead wagon to Ircher.

Then 2 more votes (Me/Robert) hit Ircher putting him at E-1.

That's the first real danger the scum faced all game. I don't think Tweet makes that type of move to flip lead wagon to an LHF as scum?

Also just the earnest nature of her solving has felt so town!energy to me.

Like originally I hardtownread her for the way she got really into using Yin's answers to solve the game, but then I was like "wait this is actually not helping us"

Now I'm kind of like in the area where I'm not sure Scum!Tweet is able to fake that much enthusiasm for something she knows is complete bullshit?

[Chara]

Amy, if that were true, then wouldn't clidd be an obvious sentencing choice right now?

[Chara]

this is what i'm referring to.
and at the time i thought yeah, that makes sense, we may as well wait for Yin, and i also didn't hammer. not that i likely would have if Tweet hadn't said to, either.

ok but if you look at the sequence I posted earlier,

it was

(4) Nakata
(3) Ircher

Tweet moves her vote from Nakata to Ircher, flipping the lead wagon to Ircher.

Then 2 more votes (Me/Robert) hit Ircher putting him at E-1.

That's the first real danger the scum faced all game. I don't think Tweet makes that type of move to flip lead wagon to an LHF as scum?

Also just the earnest nature of her solving has felt so town!energy to me.

Like originally I hardtownread her for the way she got really into using Yin's answers to solve the game, but then I was like "wait this is actually not helping us"

Now I'm kind of like in the area where I'm not sure Scum!Tweet is able to fake that much enthusiasm for something she knows is complete bullshit?

i think it's possible Tweetie didn't anticipate Nakata's wagon dissipating the way it did, and that's why she tried to stall Ircher without being obvious about it.

wrt her enthusiasm, are you talking about solving Yin, her Ircher push, or something else? because if it's Yin i disagree.

[Flea The Magician]

This entire game is WIFOM if you want to look at it like that.

Fastest way to solve it, is to just ignore it or drink it.

Yin and Yang are mechanics in this game.

They are the centre point of this game.

My theory is right so far.

[Chara]

i'm not going to argue about that anymore. i think you know your theory isn't right, but you're happy keeping it up because you know it's actually working to get you townread. i've already said why Yin was not at all forced to answer the poe questions, and whu that makes no sense in a game that's supposed to be mafia, and you've ignored it. Hectic and Isis would not design a game like that.

[Amy Dunne]

this is what i'm referring to.
and at the time i thought yeah, that makes sense, we may as well wait for Yin, and i also didn't hammer. not that i likely would have if Tweet hadn't said to, either.

ok but if you look at the sequence I posted earlier,

it was

(4) Nakata
(3) Ircher

Tweet moves her vote from Nakata to Ircher, flipping the lead wagon to Ircher.

Then 2 more votes (Me/Robert) hit Ircher putting him at E-1.

That's the first real danger the scum faced all game. I don't think Tweet makes that type of move to flip lead wagon to an LHF as scum?

Also just the earnest nature of her solving has felt so town!energy to me.

Like originally I hardtownread her for the way she got really into using Yin's answers to solve the game, but then I was like "wait this is actually not helping us"

Now I'm kind of like in the area where I'm not sure Scum!Tweet is able to fake that much enthusiasm for something she knows is complete bullshit?

What I’d still really like to know is did Ircher play that way because he knew he’d be detonated? He literally acted super scummy until Infinity was almost certainly flipping.

I will re-ISO Tanner. What I can tell you is thay I don’t think I’ve ever been suspicious of Datisi in any game I’ve ever played with him before, so why is that? And I was suss on him even before the reveal but I didn’t say anything because I thought the VCA spewed him town but that was mainly the reason I tr him and now, that is no longer viable obviously.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

i think it's possible Tweetie didn't anticipate Nakata's wagon dissipating the way it did, and that's why she tried to stall Ircher without being obvious about it.

wrt her enthusiasm, are you talking about solving Yin, her Ircher push, or something else? because if it's Yin i disagree.

I'm talking about her solving Yin.

I think she really likes working on puzzles and I don't think she would be so enthusiastic about solving a puzzle that she knew was total bullshit?


I don't agree about her not knowing the vote flip from Nakata to Ircher would put momentum on Ircher and make the ball on him start moving.

Sure she might not know how fast it would make the Ircher wagon go from 4->6 but it's still a move with intent that's protown win condition.

Clidd was the one who really stopped the Ircher wagon the first time it got up to speed with his wall posting defense of Ircher, I posted screenshots of it earlier, you can go look and explain whether that read he has on Ircher actually makes sense to you?

[Amy Dunne]

There is absolutely no reason for a town tanner to be nervous right now.
If tanners town and knows my read is bad, he dismisses it.
Tanners scum and you know it.

he's not, and i'm not, and Yin was scum, and the fact that Amy is coming around to your thinking is proof enough that Yin's wifom is working.

town get nervous about being misread all the time. it depends on their personality, some don't care at all, others do, but there is reason for it. do you remember Yggdrasil, i started getting really defeatist because i'd accrued a few scumreads and assumed i'd be killed at night. and it was irrational.

Please give me a little credit here. If Yin had called Pooky a criminal, I would have totally dismissed it as bs.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

What I’d still really like to know is did Ircher play that way because he knew he’d be detonated? He literally acted super scummy until Infinity was almost certainly flipping.

well I think Ircher was just a VT same as the rest of us and the bomb is a scum mechanism ? I don't think Ircher knew where the bomb came from cuz he would have told us if he did?

[Flea The Magician]

i'm not going to argue about that anymore. i think you know your theory isn't right, but you're happy keeping it up because you know it's actually working to get you townread. i've already said why Yin was not at all forced to answer the poe questions, and whu that makes no sense in a game that's supposed to be mafia, and you've ignored it. Hectic and Isis would not design a game like that.

I don't care how I'm read, I'm not getting removed from this game either way.

There is enough to show my theory is right so far.

There is none to prove it wrong.

Occams Razor is an amazing design concept, for the record.

[Amy Dunne]

Amy, if that were true, then wouldn't clidd be an obvious sentencing choice right now?

Based on?

[Chara]

also the reason i disagree if you were talking about the Yin thing, Pooky, is that Tweetie's enthusiasm seemed to have more to do with it being fun than solving the game with it, she said herself she wasn't using it for reads, so it's NAI to me. i can see town and scum Tweetie having fun with it like that.

pedit: responding to the previous, not to the new post from Pooky about this.

[Chara]

Amy, if that were true, then wouldn't clidd be an obvious sentencing choice right now?

Based on?

he and Pooky agreeing to and then hammering Robert.

[Chara]

Please give me a little credit here. If Yin had called Pooky a criminal, I would have totally dismissed it as bs.

Yin said i'm a criminal and so i have dismissed it as bs. i know you don't have any way to know that but i can only argue for my own reads here.

[Amy Dunne]

What I’d still really like to know is did Ircher play that way because he knew he’d be detonated? He literally acted super scummy until Infinity was almost certainly flipping.

well I think Ircher was just a VT same as the rest of us and the bomb is a scum mechanism ? I don't think Ircher knew where the bomb came from cuz he would have told us if he did?

But he did act really scummy until it was obvious Infinty was going to be the flip. All I know is, I can’t wait toread the mod pt post-game to find that out.

We know scum bombed Ircher and we also know that they could only make one nk.

[Chara]

I'm talking about her solving Yin.

I think she really likes working on puzzles and I don't think she would be so enthusiastic about solving a puzzle that she knew was total bullshit?


I don't agree about her not knowing the vote flip from Nakata to Ircher would put momentum on Ircher and make the ball on him start moving.

Sure she might not know how fast it would make the Ircher wagon go from 4->6 but it's still a move with intent that's protown win condition.

Clidd was the one who really stopped the Ircher wagon the first time it got up to speed with his wall posting defense of Ircher, I posted screenshots of it earlier, you can go look and explain whether that read he has on Ircher actually makes sense to you?

i feel like Tweetie could still have wanted to figure out Yin as scum is what i mean, he's scum-aligned but i don't think that means scum would know how he'd answer questions necessarily, it seems more like Yin was just playing to a mafia agenda, the same way Yang is apparently town but still heavily cryptic. but i don't know, i'm starting to think i'm on the wrong track but i'll still finish my reread of her when i have time.

i will also check out clidd's Ircher defense.

[Amy Dunne]

Amy, if that were true, then wouldn't clidd be an obvious sentencing choice right now?

Based on?

he and Pooky agreeing to and then hammering Robert.

But both were initially tr him, where as Tanner hardpushed Robert right out of the gate, so I really don’t understand your point?

I could obviously be wrong but at a gut level I’m having doubts and it’s not just Yin wifom.

[Chara]

my point is that i don't think pushing through a town miselim is a win card for scum at all. like you are suspecting Tanner for exactly that.

[Amy Dunne]

also the reason i disagree if you were talking about the Yin thing, Pooky, is that Tweetie's enthusiasm seemed to have more to do with it being fun than solving the game with it, she said herself she wasn't using it for reads, so it's NAI to me. i can see town and scum Tweetie having fun with it like that.

pedit: responding to the previous, not to the new post from Pooky about this.

What about the fact that both scum pushed her especially Nakata and no one seriously thought she had even a snowball’s chance in hell of being limmed.

It looks as if scum wanted us to paranoia on Tweetie. That’s how I won MD game btw. I made pturist IC, who was hard sr my dance partner Dann and everyone thought that he was locktown because scum was trying to make everyone paranoia on him.

except in this case, in reverse?

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

Datisi's push of Robert is imo more genuine than Clidd's push of Robert if Clidd even pushed Robert at all on Day 2. (I don't know if he did, I'll re-read D2 today)

I haven't re-read Day 2 robert elimination yet but consider this.

On Day 1, scum didn't know Robert would be a flipped player at endgame, so there's really no incentive to get "towncred" for pushing Robert since if Robert is alive at Endgame, he's an LHF suspect so pushing him d1 wouldn't be

seen

as protown. Datisi was pushing him anyway.

On Day 2, we were actually going to kill Robert, so scum would know to jump on to look better for Endgame.

[Amy Dunne]

my point is that i don't think pushing through a town miselim is a win card for scum at all. like you are suspecting Tanner for exactly that.

I’m telling you that’s what I’d do here as scum here because it’s brilliant and I’d be guaranteed to be sentenced. Because scum has to kill two of their buddies and if no one wants to lim them, they’re stuck but if you get a miselim, you’re golden.

[Amy Dunne]

There are 4 mafia and 9 town in this game. Mafia win by sentencing all 4 of their members. Town win by sentencing 5 townies. Town are under the impression they should be sentencing mafia, but once two mafia have been sentenced, the true wincons will be revealed publicly. Mafia were aware of all this.

.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

my point is that i don't think pushing through a town miselim is a win card for scum at all. like you are suspecting Tanner for exactly that.

I’m telling you that’s what I’d do here as scum here because it’s brilliant and I’d be guaranteed to be sentenced. Because scum has to kill two of their buddies and if no one wants to lim them, they’re stuck but if you get a miselim, you’re golden.

You don't play scum the same way as Datisi plays scum tho. Your scum game is definitely on a different level than him, I just don't think he operates at that level.

[Amy Dunne]

Datisi's push of Robert is imo more genuine than Clidd's push of Robert if Clidd even pushed Robert at all on Day 2. (I don't know if he did, I'll re-read D2 today)

I haven't re-read Day 2 robert elimination yet but consider this.

On Day 1, scum didn't know Robert would be a flipped player at endgame, so there's really no incentive to get "towncred" for pushing Robert since if Robert is alive at Endgame, he's an LHF suspect so pushing him d1 wouldn't be

seen

as protown. Datisi was pushing him anyway.

On Day 2, we were actually going to kill Robert, so scum would know to jump on to look better for Endgame.

Hectic straight up says, “mafia was aware of this”. So how couldn’t they have not known?