Newbie 2071: The Sandwich Debate - End!

[Cabd]

Vote Count 2-4

What could be more convenient than a jaffle-maker? An ELECTRIC jaffle-maker. The Breville "Snack 'n' Sandwich" maker was first released in 1974. It reportedly sold 400,000 in its first year and reached 10% of Australian households. It was the first sandwich maker to cut the sandwich in half, while also sealing the filling inside and making it easier to eat. I have a feeling that the fire-roasted sandwiches taste better even though they're less convenient.

Looker

(2): HockeyFan, T3

Not Voting

(5): Looker, Clasko, Lady Lambdadelta, GrandpaMo, VFP

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to eliminate.

Deadline: July 26, 1 PM US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2021-07-26 10:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

[Lady Lambdadelta]

VFP and Hockey are still town

my top desire to kill is James

cow got better, but I'm still suspicious.

T3 is in the range of "I don't mind killing this slot because it'll tell me a lot and their reads don't align remotely with mine"

Rock should still be town I think as well.

I will kill James, then T3, then Cow in that order today, of preference. I will never vote Hockey or VFP today for sure though.

can I have a current votecount?

What makes T3 on your radar as scum right now?

he has not done anythign towny. Also fwiw, the whole T3/VFP thing is only something i am going to pay attention on d1 most likely. I said in 719 that i think town should shift away from it a bit but since no one budged, i got back on it as we got closer to deadline. Stop assuming that I am going to sus ONLY these 2 the whole gmae

If I give some names, can you tell me what these players have done that is towny? And where the bar is currently at?

Looker
Grampa
LLD
Clasko

Any order is fine.

From

most

town to

least

town

Clakso- Really Really liked thier entrenacne,reads and the reasoning behind it e.t.c
LLD- Dont have a good read on this slot, but I think the confidence she showed right at the beginning is +town
Grampa- weirdly enough, their whole interaction/tunnel with me is town
Looker- cant get a read on this slot - null

And just as a reminder, anyone who is "null" to me is STILL higher than scum on my reads list. For example- Looker/LLD/somewhat Grandpa are probs on my null list but LLD/Grandpa HAVE done towny things which is why they're not on my scum list

Also, i will be gone for about the next hour, so sorry if i dont respond to u quickly

This is such a generic response that you're just missing "gut". Your argument was T3 hasn't done anything that is town. Wouldn't that put T3 as null rather than just a little less scummy than me?
Let's start with each.

Clakso, which reads in particular? Why is this the most basic reasoning but yet the most town read to you?

LLD - Why can't scum be confident? What has LLD done for you that is town, considering that confidence isn't a town tell and you have advised that LLD has done something as town.

Grampa - why is their tunnel on you town? What posts from the interaction are you liking as town? What has Grampa done that is town? Pushed you?

Looker - whats the difference with Looker and T3?

Vote Count 1-15

The history of the Reuben sandwich is somewhat contested. There is some evidence that the first Reuben was served at the Blackstone Hotel in Omaha, Nebraska that hosted a (yes, once again) gambling club. and also that Reuben's Restaurant in New York was the birthplace of the sandwich. By the 1940s, there are menus from both restaurants that feature the Reuben as it is known today: corned beef, Swiss cheese, sauerkraut, and Russian dressing, grilled between slices of rye bread.

T3

(3): VFP, JamesTheNames, cowsloveSushirolls

VFP

(2): Looker, HockeyFan

Looker

(1): GrandpaMo

JamesTheNames

(1): T3

Not Voting

(2): Clasko, Lady Lambdadelta

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate.

Revised Deadline: July 17, Midnight US Eastern Time (one day added)

Countdown: (expired on 2021-07-16 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

fferyllt-Cabd combined ISO for vote counts
-

This VC is still the same.

VOTE: James
If there's interest here I can lim James over T3. I'm changing my mind on T3.

Vote: James

This sequence is also an argument for VFP scum with T3, and why I said VFP is probably only ever scum with T3.

I say I'm preference order James>T3>Cows which really means I'm doing either James or T3 today.

VFP, who has been on T3 has a choice: Commit there, or take the out.

Cross bussing between them could make sense if they commit to the "one of but not both" argument, and suddenly VFP sees a way out and swaps off their top read? What changed their mind?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I feel like... we have 7 left right?

Clasko is town and dying tonight
T3 is scum and dyign today.

So it's gonna be

LLD
GPM
Looker
VFP
Hockey

and we have 2 cracks at it. If we miss the first time, Mafia have to shoot and clear someone else for us, and then go into the last day.

The way I'm looking at this is this: it's two different scenarios right? 4:1 is a "take your best shot" and 2:1 if we get there is a "re-evaluate everything and everyone"

So when I say this, I want people to understand what position it is coming from. This is logic for the 4:1 day only.

Looker was pushed by everyone on the oops all scummy list. T3, Hockey wanted them dead and VFP was absentia. I think it's possible for T3 to push Looker as a bus here but I just thikn there's equal to better odds Looker was the "this player looks bad let's try and get him mis-eliminated."

So we can't do Looker tomorrow.

GPM came into today saying "LLD, Clasko, Looker" that's another Looker pusher.

But his lack of consistency with LLD=Bulge and when I mentioned it his flop on me to town was good.

Clasko being town left him with no on in the pool, and he went to VFP over T3.

VFP Looker is... possibly game losing, but given it's double outside my selected pool, it was always possible if one of us was all right, the other was all wrong.

This also confirms at least one townie wanted Looker, so... it's interesting.

Hockey wanted T3, but preferred Looker. Second day in a row Hockey has listed T3 on their suspects but not gone onto them.

What really interests me is why Hockey stopped going for VFP over T3. VFP was their preference until James yesterday, do why did they open on Looker, claim it was just for pressure, then say Looker's name?

VFP is super AFK, but VFP is the one who kicked the James wagon into motion. If VFP is scum, it's exclusively with T3, because if T3 was town, he would have let me pick and take more fall for it.

So... where do we go from here?

I read GPM's indecisiveness, willingness to change their reads and re-evaluate and their interactions with me as town.

It's... a little weird that T3 called them obvious town, but I feel as if, that can be looking to get them under line, and doesn't feel like the partner move with a cop investigate out.

So let's... I think at least for tomorrow clear GPM.

that leaves Hockey/Looker/VFP

I can't see myself wanting to kill the person that scum wanted to kill today. I think there was enough consensus growing that T3 could have done this to bus incase of a cop guilty... but if it's T3/Looker, supporting Hockeyfan doesn't win him the game and he does need to kill the cop, so he can't just kill Hockey. I think T3/Looker is harder to have as a pairing just because T3's play ONLY works if T3 dies before Looker.

So let's write Looker off for tomorrow too.

Which leaves Hockey or VFP. And that's what I want to discuss, where to go tomorrow with that.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Clasko, as confirmed town, now would be a great time for you to bounce ideas off me since you are gonna be 6 feet under tomorrow.

[HockeyFan]

The bigger concern for me Hockey is you voted VFP and James Day 1 while pushing the "one of T3/VFP is scum" narrative.

It feels a lot like you were on conveniently wrong targets when an obviously right one was sitting there in punching distance of your reads.

yea because imo T3 wasnt doing scummy things(sure he didnt do anything towny), but VFP was doing some scummy things(just putting out reads there without much reasoning(this was start of d1-mid d1). I also entertainted the idea of a VFP/cows pair too so eh. U can say im scummy for not pushing T3 harder, but VFP was scummier

[HockeyFan]

I feel like... we have 7 left right?

What really interests me is why Hockey stopped going for VFP over T3. VFP was their preference until James yesterday, do why did they open on Looker, claim it was just for pressure, then say Looker's name?

Ftr I mentioned why i started Tring VFP start of d2 in 884

[T3]

[T3]

I knew she should have roleblocked Clasko.

[fferyllt]

VFP has requested replacement. Searching...

[fferyllt]

petapan replaces VFP. Please welcome him!

[petapan]

hi lld

i promised to play nice since this is the newbie queue, so let's get along

[Lady Lambdadelta]

hi lld

i promised to play nice since this is the newbie queue, so let's get along

sure? i don't really have a problem with you, if that's what you think >.>

[Lady Lambdadelta]

oh god you're VFP

this... may not be very fun for you

[HockeyFan]

hi petapan, welcome to the game

[petapan]

i had followed this game loosely, i am aware of the current situation (clasko cleared cop with a guilty on T3)

was reasonably confident in my read of VFP being town, took the slot, was happy to see i was correct

luckily, as we already have information at our feet, i don't have to read the whole game linearly, i can just put on a clinic for the newbies on how to partner hunt with confirmed scum, which is good because i work way better with flips



i will say up front that i think hockeyfan is very very likely T3's teammate based on a quick search i did at work, will get into the full analysis later when i have time

[Lady Lambdadelta]

i had followed this game loosely, i am aware of the current situation (clasko cleared cop with a guilty on T3)

was reasonably confident in my read of VFP being town, took the slot, was happy to see i was correct

luckily, as we already have information at our feet, i don't have to read the whole game linearly, i can just put on a clinic for the newbies on how to partner hunt with confirmed scum, which is good because i work way better with flips



i will say up front that i think hockeyfan is very very likely T3's teammate based on a quick search i did at work, will get into the full analysis later when i have time

This was my assessment as well, which you'll find if you read back. Sadly, my other top pick for T3 partner is VFP. Which is your slot.

So some of the work you put in is going to be tainted by that unfortunately. I'm not sure if it'll be enough to sell me that you don't need to die, but you might be able to convince me to let you live tomorrow and go to ELO instead of HockeyFan?

Cause I'm doing T3 today and one of Hockey or VFP(you) tomorrow so.

[petapan]

oh god you're VFP

this... may not be very fun for you

lol i wouldn't have jumped into this game if i didn't think this slot was town

understand why you scumread this slot but think your reasoning is a little bit off, might spend a little time on that, am perfectly willing to make a bet the game wager on my one scumread being correct if there's any fear i might wriggle free

[Lady Lambdadelta]

oh god you're VFP

this... may not be very fun for you

lol i wouldn't have jumped into this game if i didn't think this slot was town

understand why you scumread this slot but think your reasoning is a little bit off, might spend a little time on that, am perfectly willing to make a bet the game wager on my one scumread being correct if there's any fear i might wriggle free

engaging me on why you read VFP as town before coming in sounds like something I'd like to hear.

I'm also in a position where I'm not 100% certain I want to bet the farm on T3+Hockey/VFP and lock it down? I feel good about my GPM read and okay about my Looker read but I wanted to re-engage with Clasko before solidifying.

the one concern I have, Peta, is that once Clasko dies I would not be shocked that if I did hockeyfan and hockey flips town, you'd shoot me that night and then it's you v. GPM and Looker. I have no agency there, so it's a question of tomorrow, what's my best winning odds

so I have all those concerns to parse, and that's where my brain is at right now, the more you engage with me about it, the better I think I'll have a sense of it.

But I did come into today and say T3+Hockey because I felt that was... a big likely pairing.

[petapan]

I'm also in a position where I'm not 100% certain I want to bet the farm on T3+Hockey/VFP and lock it down? I feel good about my GPM read and okay about my Looker read but I wanted to re-engage with Clasko before solidifying.

bluntly, he wasn't trying to look town, the aggression and lack of explaining anything isn't going to play well in a newbie game, from a little vbit of seeing him as scum in newbies he's more cautious and tries to make himself more presentable. here he just barreling ahead without actually trying to look good with his posts.

i also think he doesn't approach the game as scum by hardshoving his partner all of day 1 only to switch off at the last minute - he might distance, but i didn't think in a 9P he'd make his partner the main wagon he as trying to push for a majority of day 1.

of course this was largely gleaned from ISO and i did not have full context, but it was enough for me to get the read right

the one concern I have, Peta, is that once Clasko dies I would not be shocked that if I did hockeyfan and hockey flips town, you'd shoot me that night and then it's you v. GPM and Looker. I have no agency there, so it's a question of tomorrow, what's my best winning odds

so I have all those concerns to parse, and that's where my brain is at right now, the more you engage with me about it, the better I think I'll have a sense of it.

perfectly understandable, which is why i'm saying i'm willing to get the game down to one read and bet on it, because i think i'm way more likely to talk my way out of an elimination in f3 than hockeyfan and from a town pov that should be a concern. same as how if i had doubts on you i'd absolutely have to get that aired out on day 3 because day 4 would be too late whether i'm alive or dead. i don't think it's you, but that is mainly because i think hockeyfan just looks like a hit, rather than having any particularly strong reason to clear you as of right now. i actually thought bulge looked scummy in ISO, but i have a bad track record when it comes to reading him, if you're town i consider myself effectively 0/3 lol

[T3]

VOTE: peta
Back off.

[GrandpaMo]

Okay so I was right -- Scum between T3 / VFP not James / VFP.

T3 flipping scum most likley makes VFP town.

@LLD I see how hockey + T3 could be paired. This is why I questioned Hockey on about their playstyle, they said they either hard allign or hard bus then go on about bussing VFP.

Then I ask you call T3 scum but you were voting Looker with them -- This is why now I think Looker is most likely town as well.

I will need to Reeval VFP through this new replacement -- but T3 switching to vote this slot makes it weary for us.

[GrandpaMo]

oh god you're VFP

this... may not be very fun for you

lol i wouldn't have jumped into this game if i didn't think this slot was town

understand why you scumread this slot but think your reasoning is a little bit off, might spend a little time on that, am perfectly willing to make a bet the game wager on my one scumread being correct if there's any fear i might wriggle free

Wait, can you claim?

Your slot hasn't claimed yet.

[GrandpaMo]

What makes T3 on your radar as scum right now?

he has not done anythign towny. Also fwiw, the whole T3/VFP thing is only something i am going to pay attention on d1 most likely. I said in 719 that i think town should shift away from it a bit but since no one budged, i got back on it as we got closer to deadline. Stop assuming that I am going to sus ONLY these 2 the whole gmae

If I give some names, can you tell me what these players have done that is towny? And where the bar is currently at?

Looker
Grampa
LLD
Clasko

Any order is fine.

Grandpa is towny. What his posts look like and the frequency of them are similar but I find Townpa to be open minded and Scumpa to tunnel limbait town.

Damn, you really tried pocketing me through out this whole game. You got me good ngl, you played well as scum honestly.

[GrandpaMo]

First, you and Grandpa would be the only ones who would notice the crumb because it was the exact same crumb Grandpa used in 2070. If I died then the other person would know. If scum realize this and don't kill me, then I am kept alive as basically cleared and scum potentially waste their roleblock. TSTBS doesn't apply here. I have my seperate reasons for scumreading both of you. No, withholding a read isn't scummy. I am crumbing doctor to both of you and what I did requires both of you to survive.Yes, I was hiding and planning in advance. I was planning to DIE.

Bruh -- I forgot you made this play. This was the main reasons I townread you. You played VERY well this game in relaying back the same meta that used against me to relay that you are town.

[petapan]

oh really? lmao

i am also VT, clasko's claim is confirmed