Micro 1022 | Purgatory | 80s music | Game Over

[northsidegal]

skimming through your ISO, apart from instances where you basically just say you scumread me (and you asking me why i sound "nervous"), this seems to really be the only elaboration on that. it's a little nonspecific and hard to understand, really, so i don't think there's a ton to really engage with here.

I am no good at vocalizing it but iirc it was a sort of vibe of agreeableness in the sense that it felt correct but in the way that it was stating feel good stuff/stuff that was not bad but also not good, just in that deadzone of "huh, this isn't right". Perhaps I mixed your posts together and sort of combined my read in a way.

[Ich Troje]

despite me throwing a pretty large amount of shade your way, you have not commented on it at all to the best of my memory, why is that?

i don't really recall seeing anything from you that seemed to really warrant a response. was there some question i missed? apart from that, all i remember is just a general suspicion you had of me, and the thought that i discredit people as scum, or something. (that's not an attempt to downplay what you said, i'm really just speaking off memory here)

^ does town NSG actually not notice when someone strongly thinks there is a possibility they are scum

only played with a townstump NSG who might as well have flaked out of boredom so yeah.

[northsidegal]

troje, i'm also curious to hear your thoughts as to seemingly thinking that both me and esooa are scum. thoughts there?

thoughts are this question made me laugh because of how vague it is like are you afraid of details

i try to avoid "leading the witness", as it were. in my experience, leaving people mostly to display their own thought processes is a more effective way of sorting them.

[northsidegal]

^ does town NSG actually not notice when someone strongly thinks there is a possibility they are scum

sorry, let me be clear - i noticed that you scumread me, but nothing i saw from you really seemed to warrant engagement, your just stating you scumread me included.

[Dannflor]

by the way dann, i'm curious. i'm decently confident that you're relatively similar to me when it comes to following a flow of making a prediction, asking a question, and updating based on the response. so what was your prediction for this question, and how would you have updated either way i would have answered it?

Honestly? I expected you to say you were trying to model some facet of RC's play this game, or that you were trying to push or question more aggressively, or something along those lines.

I feel like there's a noticeable shift in the way you're approaching slots that I'm not used to seeing from you, (using Mini Normal 2187: PIFiMDM as my point of reference) and I asked because I think you are a player who would reasonably try to evolve or change or adapt their gameplay for a variety of reasons.

My model of you as a player is similar to what you've described as first making a prediction, then asking a question, and then updating whether privately or publicly. I also think you are like me in that you tend to spend a good amount of time observing before completely outing everything in your head, before later in the game becoming more completely transparent as you try to put all the information you've collected together. But specifically I also don't think of you as someone who likes to "lead the witness" or ask questions you know you're not going to get a revealing answer from. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you're someone who like builds a case against someone by like putting pressure on someone until they crack - you ask questions yes but you usually also try to give enough space to let that person comfortably show that they are town

This is why I asked you that question because I don't feel you've been playing the way I expect you to, most egregiously in your back and forth with esooa

specifically posts #386 and #388 felt very... out of character for my conception of how you would react in this situation. both questions appear to me to not really be questions? Like I don't believe you actually thought you were going to get a informative answer out of esooa either way here. You're framing an observation or essentially a "case" as a question for the person you're accusing, and not really in a way that allows for esooa to respond in any other way than basically "uh no" which is indeed how she reacted. you say you don't normally like to "lead the witness" and it feels like that is exactly what you're doing.

like did you actually get anything out of asking those questions? you disappeared from the conversation after you asked them. it feels more like a "gotcha" than you were genuinely interested in figuring out if there was a townie motivation for esooa's read there.

would you agree, that if town, esooa probably isn't going to respond to #388 with anything other than a variation of "uh no?" would you expect scum!esooa to have a different answer?

I got the point you were making on that page but honestly? it feels more like you found something scummy you could push rather than you finding an inconsistency and wanting to genuinely question it.

[northsidegal]

specifically posts #386 and #388 felt very... out of character for my conception of how you would react in this situation. both questions appear to me to not really be questions? Like I don't believe you actually thought you were going to get a informative answer out of esooa either way here. You're framing an observation or essentially a "case" as a question for the person you're accusing, and not really in a way that allows for esooa to respond in any other way than basically "uh no" which is indeed how she reacted. you say you don't normally like to "lead the witness" and it feels like that is exactly what you're doing.

responding to this part first - those were rhetorical, more a way of demonstrating my point than actually asking a question.

[northsidegal]

that is to say, the question is meant to demonstrate what i'm thinking, but also meant to be posed sort of to the playerlist at large rather than just to esooa.

[Dannflor]

to be honest, i'm not sure why i would be a "paranoia" read at all. really, i think that i've been townread far too easily and quickly this game – if anything, i would expect to either be basically null. of course, i don't think that my being townread quickly is necessarily the product of scum, but for you specifically i feel like i have memory of you by default being more hesitant to townread me in the most recent games we've played together. i feel like i'm not really seeing any of that attitude here, or i suppose i'm seeing less of it.

to go back to this, I did state I thought you've been at the very least surface-level towny but I haven't actually been town reading you yet this game

my usage of paranoia more referred to the fact that I was tin foiling scum!nsg theories off your entrance, for a brief time I had this convoluted thought that you saw my somewhat subtle reaction to flow trap's posts and then your entrance gunning for it was some sideways attempt to pocket me, but eh, it didn't really have any legs beyond the fact I didn't feel I had a good reason to really town read you yet

I do agree that any town reads on you at this point have been too easy and too quick. I think people that know you have an idea of your meta as an extremely strong town player and less memorable scum player and think they can hand out an easy read to you

but I will never not treat traditionally polarized players with extreme care because I think history has shown (like say with creature) that good town players are generally smart and good enough at the game to turn on their scum game when they need to

[Dannflor]

that is to say, the question is meant to demonstrate what i'm thinking, but also meant to be posed sort of to the playerlist at large rather than just to esooa.

I just don't remember you as being a very rhetorical player

as far as the addressing the actual point on Esooa, I am really not what you are seeing either - which may have contributed to how much I balked at your posting there

like I feel #385 is evidence of a deeper thought process running underneath esooa's earlier actions, not evidence that she is making up reads on the spot. it's consistent with her earlier actions and I think the fact that it is more developed is just a consequence of being prompted to share some of that underlying thought process.

could you elaborate on what you found scummy in their initial posting spree?

[Dannflor]

I'm also a little bit curious about your read on ich troje but that's of less importance right now

[northsidegal]

I just don't remember you as being a very rhetorical player

-shrug-

i don't think it's really about "being rhetorical" or anything, to me it's just a pretty minor alternate way of phrasing my opinion while also inviting comment.

also, i get that there's a lot i'm not responding to here, been phoneposting most all day. i'll try to respond fully when i get back to a computer.

also also, random thought - if you're town, i wonder how much of your model of my play is informed by games where i replace in as opposed to ones played from the start. has consequences wrt expectations of behavior, given starting with a lot to analyze when replacing vs not having a ton when starting.

[Dannflor]

also also, random thought - if you're town, i wonder how much of your model of my play is informed by games where i replace in as opposed to ones played from the start. has consequences wrt expectations of behavior, given starting with a lot to analyze when replacing vs not having a ton when starting.

I'll think about this

the answer is probably quite a bit off the top of my head

[ManateeDude]

Hell VC1.08

Released in 1980, I'm Coming Out is a song by American singer Diana Ross. It peaked for two weeks at #5 on the Billboard Hot 100

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to send someone to Hell

Esooa (3):

T3, northsidegal, Farren

northsidegal (2):

Ich Troje, Dannflor

redtea (1):

Esooa

Farren (1):

redtea

T3 (1):

Enchant

Ich Troje (1):

flow trap

Not Voting:

Deadline:

(expired on 2021-07-29 13:00:00)

Mod Notes:

[Esooa]

I feel almost uncomfortably white knighted here lol

and I'm someone who loves when people simp for me

anyways to talk more about the nsg stuff, maybe I'm just speaking from an outside perspective, not knowing nsg, but I didn't have a problem with her posts

I guess that's mostly cause, while her points were kinda weak in terms of actually being a scum read, I thought they were fine enough and they showed a pretty reasonable depth of thought

my biggest problem is that I got no response to this

i would say there are other concerns.

would it bother you if i refrained from elaborating on those for a while?

do you have nothing to say about my responses to you?

and I still have no clue what nsg thinks of my alignment at this point

I guess this kinda does get to what dann is saying though, her 'questions' irt to me don't actually seem to have been relevant, considering there's been no development after

even if they're not actually questions it feels bad to answer her problems and get.. nothing really

meh, there's valid concerns here and I do like that they're something Dann noticed, but overall I still find nsgs posts to be towny

would you say you're scum reading her rn, Dann? or is this more just something you wanted to bring up

[Esooa]

I guess the vote on her kinda answers my last question lol

I'll ask instead what you think of slots like t3 or red

[Farren]

UNVOTE: Esooa
VOTE: redtea

And yes, I am aware that I am jumping from the person I was voting for to the person that she's currently voting for.

[Esooa]

lmao

[T3]

T3 can you give an actual read on me

I don't have a read on you but I think Ich is town -> that implies you are scum.

I started to write this post with placing a vote on you and explaining something. But you know what? Let's see what you have to say - Why do you think this?

Meta + post density + different vibe. You have a meta read on Esooa.

[Dannflor]

meta meta meta meta meta

[northsidegal]

never met-a player i couldn't read!

[T3]

My play this game is way different to the last few games I've played with Enchant so I think his case on me is NAI.

[Enchant]

never met-a player i couldn't read!

Read me.


Also, i vote not for you to say "uh looks townie", i really expect you to consider T3 as possible mafia.

Honestly, i starting to have doubts, like if T3 IS town, then mafia either having fun with existing candidates and don't need it (which means we dig in wrong way right now and need to redirect attention anyway), or simple fear to join me, because my case is dumb, which i fully acknowledge, don't remind me.

Though, i more expected from T3-Mafia to being accused for a bit even by his teammates, to gain distance points for bussing. And T3 loves bussing, that's how he suicided in our first mafia game... Possible again because we dig in wrong place and they don't want redirect attention on his teammate by worthless bus.

TLDR: Vote T3, i think it will flip maf most likely. Or say why you disagree, don't ignore.

[Ich Troje]

Had a stressful game just end time to give this one more focus:D

[T3]

never met-a player i couldn't read!

Read me.


Also, i vote not for you to say "uh looks townie", i really expect you to consider T3 as possible mafia.

Honestly, i starting to have doubts, like if T3 IS town, then mafia either having fun with existing candidates and don't need it (which means we dig in wrong way right now and need to redirect attention anyway), or simple fear to join me, because my case is dumb, which i fully acknowledge, don't remind me.

Though, i more expected from T3-Mafia to being accused for a bit even by his teammates, to gain distance points for bussing. And T3 loves bussing, that's how he suicided in our first mafia game... Possible again because we dig in wrong place and they don't want redirect attention on his teammate by worthless bus.

TLDR: Vote T3, i think it will flip maf most likely. Or say why you disagree, don't ignore.

I think I've been much less limbait-y when we played together last.

[T3]

And I've bussed less recently.