Mini Normal 2223 | Town Wins!

[Titus]

This town has already proven accurate though.

[Dwlee99]

There's exceptions to every rule

[ssbm_Kyouko]

On VC1-3 I like Dwelee as scum. Mari and Ssbm as town.

Based on VC 1-3, I find no scum on the Dwlee wagon on count 4.

1-5 Maricstar omo dynamic is interesting. Marci might be a wagon to save owo.

Math or Omo likely scum. Leaning owo.

Oh yeah VC 4 further reinforces that salsa and dwlee are not aligned, possible TvS, and with the pairing of Salsa/Max vs Dwlee/omo, it could be town!salsa vs scum!dwlee.

I also dont see dwlee bussing today after D1, but Max has no momentum as only omo is really pushing her. It would be a safe time to vote Max to reinforce associatives with omo and Distance from scum!Max

[MathBlade]

I am not suspicious of Titus which makes me suspicious of Titus. I struggle to read Titus properly most games and usually hunting her directly gets me just angry her angry and leads to a big blow up and just bad. Pretty much based on her play I wanted to lock her yet you didn’t want to lock her which means I should hear you out. I think your argument is weak (being generous). My questions are leading but they are more towards sorting you sorting her to get a read on Titus and you.

I completely disagree with what is going on here wagon wise.

Assume your premise that the current wagons are TvS. Why do you not want to elim in them? Instead you’re picking a third wagon Dwlee. This means your entire solve would be Dwlee+Max/Owo. This doesn’t seem to jive with what you’re posting.

I kinda feel like this is a TvTvT shitfest and deep wolf(ves) don’t want to hop on for cred.

Titus is also posting very incongruent shit.

She cannot say that Max v Omo is TvS vote Dwlee then say a scum is in Me + Omo.

If we assume Max scum then Dwelee scum then no room for me scum
If we assume Owo scum then Dwlee scum then no room for me scum.

I think it’s more likely as day progresses we are looking for a deep wolf. This doesn’t add up,

[MathBlade]

I think you're trying to manipulate me into voting Titus with the leading questions tbh. I dont know if it's scum or controlling town though.
Titus, or anyone else with mathblade experience: is this something he tries as town? To "lead a horse to water", as it were, and dichotomize the horse based on whether they drink?

To be clear I have about a billion (hyperbole) scum games.
I am sure if someone wanted to paint me as scum that does a certain thing they could.
When I am scum (again not here), I manipulate the gamestate not people. Townies become scum more than I ever would. In the linked game I had Xlos and DGB were my puppets doing the scummy things I couldn’t. I don’t outright manipulate here. It’s why as scum I am almost never wagoned because I am honest and truthful to a fault and nothing is off limits and I consistently try to bring scum and town meta in alignment to avoid trust tells.

[MathBlade]

Votecount:

• DrippingGoofball (7): marcistar, ssbm_Kyouko, ManateeDude, Roden, Titus, MathBlade, omo
  Roden (2): DrippingGoofball, Dwlee99
  Salsabil Faria (2): geraintm, Salsabil Faria
  omo (1): MaxTheFox
  Not_Mafia (1): Not_Mafia

Day 1 will end in (expired on 2021-07-25 10:22:01).
With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate.

Spoiler: Votes Since Last Votecount

VOTE: DGB

TRing everyone on this wagon.

VOTE: Roden

VOTE: DGB

TRing everyone on this wagon.

VOTE: DGB

Ditto.

Oh and not sure if anyone saw a recent WWF ad? It’s so cute I just have to share it.



Show love to people <3

VOTE: Roden after some thought I think Roden TMId in their response to me regarding my assertion that it is unrealistic from their POV that I helped shut down a wagon on them that I initiated and am scum to them. The motivations for me as scum to do that are dubious at best considering the gamestate at the time.


I thought they were town but perhaps I am threatening their other 2 partners ergo that's dangerous to them - or they need to dismantle a townblock that's formed in a way. I'm still trying to wrap my head around this, as I've been rereading my own ISO and noticed some things I had forgotten about.


The fact this isn't the first time this day phase Roden has made very questionable play in terms of not bad play but like .. dunno how to explain it its just weird/not town motivated.

I'm hungover as shit so not in the mood to really ellaborate but I'll quote Kyouko's case in my next post.

VOTE: DGB

whatever

there's absolutely no agreement here and I don't think DGB is that valuable to the gamestate anyways so yeah

I'm hammering this so no shit counterwagon happens because no one wants to go for any of my scumreads and this is at least low in my reads

Looking at this VC here, assuming Titus town, I know I am town, then if there is scum in the wagon it is in Marci/Kyo/owo if the wagons are TvT as I suspect then a Marci Kyo wagon pops up again. I coulda sworn Kyo was the first voter on DGB though I am going to have to reread that.

[MathBlade]

Just to expand on things further, people believed their head canon so much that game I literally told Titus every reason my team did kills and she just disagreed with me so much I just shut up.

I knew the setup was townsided as fuck due to my informed ability so I kept it up consistently. While I didn’t expect to have a DGB/Titus/me elo the well was continually poisoned and preyed upon “This is too much power narrative”. While accurate it got rid of the PRs I literally couldn’t kill because we had higher priority kills to make (except Jake that was me being a dumb dumb and forgetting DGB was odd night). Each and every post as scum (again incorrect) is planned and calculated.

My point is if you want to sort me imho asking if I have history of X is the wrong way to go about it.

I have lost count of the number of games I have played as either alignment and I am sure that unless you look at global context something fits.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I am not suspicious of Titus which makes me suspicious of Titus. I struggle to read Titus properly most games and usually hunting her directly gets me just angry her angry and leads to a big blow up and just bad. Pretty much based on her play I wanted to lock her yet you didn’t want to lock her which means I should hear you out. I think your argument is weak (being generous). My questions are leading but they are more towards sorting you sorting her to get a read on Titus and you.

I completely disagree with what is going on here wagon wise.

Assume your premise that the current wagons are TvS. Why do you not want to elim in them? Instead you’re picking a third wagon Dwlee. This means your entire solve would be Dwlee+Max/Owo. This doesn’t seem to jive with what you’re posting.

I kinda feel like this is a TvTvT shitfest and deep wolf(ves) don’t want to hop on for cred.

Titus is also posting very incongruent shit.

She cannot say that Max v Omo is TvS vote Dwlee then say a scum is in Me + Omo.

If we assume Max scum then Dwelee scum then no room for me scum
If we assume Owo scum then Dwlee scum then no room for me scum.

I think it’s more likely as day progresses we are looking for a deep wolf. This doesn’t add up,

I'm thinking the wagons right now might actually both be on town because dwlee is the scum that is trying to make omo look guilty by association, and conversely, trying to make himself look inno if omo ever flips green. Dwlee is one scum, muddying the waters with omo, and the last scum (assuming we have 3 in 13p) is distanced.

If this is not the case then I expect town!dwlee to come up with something more convincing on their own. As for the last scum, I'm not sure. Since dwlee is in the "ignored" camp, and I think omo is bait, and salsa-dwlee are not aligned, I think that leaves [geraint, N_M], maybe Max if Dwlee is looking for cred, you (Mathblade), and maybe Titus/Marci if my VCA of D1 is wrong.

You, I think, are looking for deep wolves in Titus, me, and Marcistar, but I think we have clear scum in Dwlee here and I am concerned that you, as a potential partner, seem ignorant of that.

If you expect to die toNight then deepwolf hunting may be worthwhile for you, but I think Dwlee is priority #1 today.

[T3]

Votecount:

• MaxTheFox (4): omo, Dwlee99, ManateeDude, Salsabil Faria
  omo (2): MaxTheFox
  Dwlee99 (2): ssbm_Kyouko, Titus

Day 2 will end in (expired on 2021-08-02 11:22:01).
With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate.

Spoiler: Votes Since Last Votecount

targeting babysitter is dangerous no matter what and im of the belief mafia missed my soft

It seems that way but it could easily be scum that

ignored

your crumb to make it appear that they missed it.

Missed the crumb:
{Max (newb), Salsa (English as a second language), Not_Mafia (not_reading)}

Ignored the crumb:
{Dwlee, omo, Titus, MathBlade}

Marci/Geraint, I don't feel confident putting them in either category. Either way, I think if one scum missed the crumb they both did.

pedit: these wagons are giving me the spooks. omo and dwlee voting together, and Max and Salsa voting together, cross-voting
TvS wagons I think.
UNVOTE:

VOTE: Dwlee

VOTE: dwlee yay it's not dead - do think it's possible dwlee is intentionally associating himself with omo as the sheeping is always unidirectional.

[Dwlee99]

I actually cased Max. "Come up with something more convincing on their own," I did. Still waiting for Max to answer something so I'm waiting for that though.

[MathBlade]

I don’t think Dwlee is “clear scum”. They angered me and would be a policy hammer but I don’t think they’re scum. They’re not top tier townread and I would hammer to prevent a no elim but pissing me off does not merit a vote.

Furthermore I don’t think I ever die here. I have the charisma of wet tissue paper, I am working on it but if I die I consider it protown if I do die then scum kill me for a reason.

If Dwlee turns out to be scum and I was wrong then I accept my miselim fate tomorrow I just don’t see them as scum atm.

[MathBlade]

I actually cased Max. "Come up with something more convincing on their own," I did. Still waiting for Max to answer something so I'm waiting for that though.

And you didn’t.

You just said “they lurk”. That’s all your posting boils down to.
I retorted so are other players.

Then you just said you cased Max.

Which is well you didn’t and it becomes pointless to argue in circles. It just pisses everyone off.

[Dwlee99]

Titus is probably final scum with the terrible night visit, scummy play yesterday, and that she is using arbitrary VCA with unflipped slots to push me.

Pedit: Math wtf

[Dwlee99]

How about this: max's day one ISO has content on a variety of slots, but almost all of it is extremely surface level except for her read on omo. 439 and 466 have depth, but posts like 457 are more like active lurking than really solving.

Did you miss this post?

[MathBlade]

How about this: max's day one ISO has content on a variety of slots, but almost all of it is extremely surface level except for her read on omo. 439 and 466 have depth, but posts like 457 are more like active lurking than really solving.

Did you miss this post?

Yes I did. I was gaming last night.

I will take a look after I clock out (around 5 PM PST maybe 6-7) at those posts.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I don’t think Dwlee is “clear scum”. They angered me and would be a policy hammer but I don’t think they’re scum. They’re not top tier townread and I would hammer to prevent a no elim but pissing me off does not merit a vote.

Furthermore I don’t think I ever die here. I have the charisma of wet tissue paper, I am working on it but if I die I consider it protown if I do die then scum kill me for a reason.

If Dwlee turns out to be scum and I was wrong then I accept my miselim fate tomorrow I just don’t see them as scum atm.

I'm not even saying that you die if dwlee flips red, it's just a point against you if you ignore it and then he flips red. I think actually that I was close with {DGB, Dwlee, omo}, and now that it has become more clear that dwlee is associating himself with omo, it looks like {DGB, Dwlee, geraintm/N_M}.

[Dwlee99]

You're going to waste the whole day phase if you're planning for a red flip

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Also something that pinged me about dwlee was the tinfoil hat image he responded to me with, back when I was talking about how I'll never assume he's a mason again.

Felt more like a mock than a meme, but this probably means nothing to anyone else

[MathBlade]

You're going to waste the whole day phase if you're planning for a red flip

Seconded. A flip should never ever be planned for unless you have a red check.

You can be “so certain” in a read that you don’t want anyone else but if you’re really that sure it should be convincing to everyone else too. The fact we still don’t have a cohesive town block despite getting scum d1 is troubling.

It’s more like I feel like I am being played and that’s my big feeling I just don’t know by who.

[MathBlade]

And don’t get me wrong I HATE town blocks with a passion.

But one should exist by now as part of a healthy gamestate

[oʍo]

Titus is probably final scum with the terrible night visit, scummy play yesterday, and that she is using arbitrary VCA with unflipped slots to push me.

Pedit: Math wtf

"terrible night visit"

see: my post about how titus' role doesn't exist as scum ergo their choices can be whatever they want so analyzing their choice can always be knocked off as a reason.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I think Titus, Marci, Manatee, Me is the block, and omo/mathblade are like auxiliary to the block.

Does anyone in the block listed (not the auxiliary) disagree with the block?

[oʍo]

I'd swap titus and math

[oʍo]

also don't care that you didn't ask me

[MathBlade]

Titus is probably final scum with the terrible night visit, scummy play yesterday, and that she is using arbitrary VCA with unflipped slots to push me.

Pedit: Math wtf

"terrible night visit"

see: my post about how titus' role doesn't exist as scum ergo their choices can be whatever they want so analyzing their choice can always be knocked off as a reason.

Okay see this here.

Currently I don’t suspect Titus yet multiple people do.

This means either A> I am wrong and Titus is scum and we should elim her
Or B> I am right and Titus is town and scum are pushing Titus but to shade her not miselim her right now

Why do you say Titus’s role doesn’t exist as scum? A scum babysitter would be pretty novel and I could see her doing a Shadowrun esque type thing here, crumb the truth and people discount it. But that’s more I could make an argument she is scum but I don’t believe it type deal.