Newbie 2073: Parfait (Over)

[catboi]

Val, can you give me a sense of where your reads are at right now? I thought the way you went after T3 on day 1 was towny even if it ended up being wrong, but your focus to this point has been very narrow-band and I want to see you broaden your view and talk about other players, since the two main ones you had reads on day 1 are now dead.

[shwinnebego]

I would in fact like to UNVOTE until we hear from StD at least

I would like to hear StD's analysis of the gamestate

I have to point here that given the way StD is playing this game, the first sentence of that post makes the second much more unlikley.

You seemed to have an understanding to this when discussing why you were "joking" about hammering GeneralWu D1, so you might want to have a rethink on this one.

I didn't say I'd wait around forever He says he's catching up on the thread. Let's hear what he has to say. Anyway, I'll vote StD when I am personally good and ready; I won't be taking into account pressure from others to do so.

[shwinnebego]

Val, can you give me a sense of where your reads are at right now? I thought the way you went after T3 on day 1 was towny even if it ended up being wrong, but your focus to this point has been very narrow-band and I want to see you broaden your view and talk about other players, since the two main ones you had reads on day 1 are now dead.

Seconded.

[Val89]

Moving back to the game, and I feel like we really are entering the twilight zone here given that I am about to suggest that people with a correct read are sus - but given that T3 was fakeclaiming mason, as town, in an actual mason game; and doing some of the scummiest stuff you could think possible, I am actually thinking that those who were expressing town reads on T3 in spite of it - and I'm looking at Shwinn, asking about why a town!t3 claims mason, GeneralWu with a townread justified by absolute bullshit (T3 was doing a lot of things, but actively solving the game wasn't one of them), and StD here - feel a little like TMI.

Given the curveball we've been thrown, I don't think we need to rush this one, but in principle, I am also happy starting with StD, for much the same reasons as have come up already. As of this moment, GeneralWu would be my second choice for today.

I don't think I've made much of a secret about where I am at today. My PoE is StD, GeneralWu, Shwinn. I think we will find one, if not both, scum in that trio. In the event the second scum falls outside that trio, I would be looking at Meg and Catboi. Both of those are currently leaning town in my eyes, and I think there is a good chance the game will be if we had time to lim all 3 of my PoE. I'm not seeing a scum Roden, and they are a straight up town read for me right now.

Roden,
Meg, Catboi
Schwin
StD, GeneralWu.

How does your list look today compared to yesterday, Catboi?

[Save The Dragons]

Q: Does being an SE mean you're good at mafia?
A: No! It does not.

You have to ask yourself - which faction is T3 talking to when he say 'enjoy losing the game!' - obviously, the opposite faction to that whihc he himself rolled. It might be true that being an SE doesn't nessacairy mean you are good at mafia, but it does mean you have been around long enough to know about playing to win.

i don't love this push on T3. it could be from mafia knowing T3 is town. it seems like T3 made a joke here but val takes it pretty seriously.

The only other person I've really taken notice of is Val but since he's VLA I'll have to wait til he comes back to look more into.

interesting

Right now my only input is that catboi seems to be trying pretty hard, so he's a bit towny.
So is meg.

how much effort is considered trying?

I think they're trying hard because they're doing their best to make reads even though there aren't many posts. When there aren't many posts, making reads like that is considered trying in my opinion.

i think generalwu is a little quick to push people into the town column.

roden's policy elim talk is pretty meh to me. seems more like a joke than an actual suggestion.

As an aside, I know we're still early in the game but I want to hear more from Catboi and StG.

Catboi and StD really need to post more to give some input

Interesting how MegAzumarill just parrots Roden here

I’ll post more complete reads eventually. I didn’t realize that each game day was a week tbh


Home forum is breadnroses, game days are usually a day

Range of high chaos to vanilla but we skew high chaos

You're used to 24 hour games but then you disappeared for over 36 hours? Doesn't really add up to me.

VOTE: Shwinnebego

god i still hate this post

just because it's one vote doesn't mean it's not opportunistic, your reason was really flimsy

VOTE: SavetheDragons

I dislike eliminating shwinniebego here for a few reasons.
1. The first is that I find it likely that if they are a town, they are probably a PR ( or doing some WIFOM thing). I would not want to out them if they are so.
2. I think that their flip doesn't give us much information. Either they are a town that has very much struggled adapting to the meta on this site, or they flip scum, which would be a very attractive bus on a new player. Either way we don't learn much about other players.
3. I honestly don't scumread them that much, they seem too apart from the norm of mafia games like this, so I think their behavior is NAI.
4. I feel that their input will generate discussion that could end up being useful to town.

Instead I feel like StD is a better vote, they overall don't provide much to town.

Shwinniebego, you should post your input if you feel like you need to say something, it will both help you get better and may help town.

I would like StD to post their reads and contribute a bit more substance. It doesn't really matter if you can't post often, but at least try to post something that is useful when you do.

And T3 appears to be avoiding confronting the accusation made at him by Val89, although the accusation doesn't hold a whole lot of weight imo.

i don't love this attack. why am i less likely to be a PR than shwinnebago?

I'm still thinking StD may be scum, you guys keep saying that him posting one liners and such is normal, that doesn't really make him seem townie in my eyes. At best it is NAI.

if it's NAI why am i scum for it

If you think there's a possibility you'll be NKed, you should probably be making your case on who's scum right now, sine you're not going to be able to post it when you're dead!

yeah i'm not sure i understand the argument for not making the case now

I think my general d1 suspicions toward them haven't diminished, and shwinniebego brought up a good point about how the vote on them dissolved yesterday despite them saying nothing at E-1.
Let's get this show on the road.

what happened to your suspicion of me

I am also happy starting with StD

why

I'm ready to vote StD here. That would put him at E-1; and there is a chance he might self-hammer if he is scum, so is there anything burning that really, really needs to be said before I do?

yeah what's your case on me?

VOTE: Val

town: shwin, catboi, generalwu
null: roden
scum: val, meg

[Save The Dragons]

tldr; Val comes out of the gate running against T3 based on a flimsy case and basically rides it, tunneling him until T3 gets mislimed. he's trying to hop on my wagon now without actually providing any reasoning. i think he's just scum here.

[Val89]

So, what you are saying is that you saw me, who you think is scum, basically come out of gate on a flimsy case and basically ride it to a mislim D1, and you sat back and watched it happen; and decided only to come out now?

[Save The Dragons]

no because i didn't know what alignment T3 was

knowing that he's town makes me go hmm

[shwinnebego]

no because i didn't know what alignment T3 was

knowing that he's town makes me go hmm

Your logic here makes such obvious sense that I struggle to believe that Val, who is possessed of perfectly adequate cognitive faculties as far as I can tell, is genuinely failing to follow it.

[shwinnebego]

So, what you are saying is that you saw me, who you think is scum, basically come out of gate on a flimsy case and basically ride it to a mislim D1, and you sat back and watched it happen; and decided only to come out now?

....We didn't know it was a mislim until T3 flipped. And you know that. Why are you acting like you don't know that?

[Save The Dragons]

instead of doing whatever that question was, why don't you outline your case on me, val

[Val89]

So, for the benefit of the rest of the thread, lets lock it right down - because I know precisely why you have turned your attention to my slot in particular.

Do you, StD, agree 100% there is scum between me and you?

[Save The Dragons]

no lol

i believe it's likely you are scum but i could be wrong.

[Val89]

The only other person I've really taken notice of is Val but since he's VLA I'll have to wait til he comes back to look more into.

interesting

What exactly is interesting about it?

[shwinnebego]

Do you, StD, agree 100% there is scum between me and you?

This question makes no sense. What did StD say that would conceivably suggest that he thinks this?

[shwinnebego]

Val, you're making less and less sense to me. I hope you can help me understand your process here, because right now it's confusing (are you deliberately behaving irrationally?) and I don't like it.

[Val89]

I'll spell it out for you, once StD answers my question.

[Save The Dragons]

hmmm. hmm. hhmmmmmmhhhmmm.

i thought it was interesting because i wonder what he was thinking.

VOTE: Meg

[shwinnebego]

hmmm. hmm. hhmmmmmmhhhmmm.

i thought it was interesting because i wonder what he was thinking.

VOTE: Meg

If possible, can you explain why you just moved your vote?

Please spell it out plainly if possible, unless you really really think that continuing to post cryptically will benefit town. If you do not do that, then barring someone else explaining to me why your cryptic approach to posting helps town in a sufficiently compelling fashion, I will interpret your actions and cryptic justifications for them as wolfish behavior.

[shwinnebego]

Alright Val, talk to me.

[shwinnebego]

Also Roden - what's up? How're you feeling about StD? Last I checked you were vibing with the TMI suspicion that some of us were feeling. Do you still feel that way? Would appreciate your full game analysis.

[shwinnebego]

hmmm. hmm. hhmmmmmmhhhmmm.

i thought it was interesting because i wonder what he was thinking.

VOTE: Meg

Specifically, does your vote indicate that Meg is now your top choice for quorum today? If so, would you please tell us why?

[shwinnebego]

Once Val and StD respond to my most recent questions, and once Roden chimes in with an analysis of the gamestate, I intend to reciprocate with an updated analysis of the gamestate (brief or long, not sure yet), and to place my vote.

[Val89]

i thought it was interesting because i wonder what he was thinking.

No, come on, StD, do share, what do you wonder about what he was thinking?

Your wall of quotes, which lended itself eventually to denouce my slot as 'likley scum' and result in you voting your slot had 4 qoutes that related to me. 2 of them were from today, asking me to make a case on you, one was my very first RVS post, and the other was that one, a reference navigator made to my slot very very early on. You must have felt it important to make it in to that short list of things you wanted to draw attention to, so come - what specifically about THAT tweaked your interest?

[MegAzumarill]

After a good and thorough read of GeneralWu's analysis of my posts, I feel there are some points I need to address.

The first point is my preliminary vote on STD, and the reasons I didn't want shwinnie hung d1. I think points 2 and 3 still stand for themselves, but I want to give some context for the first and last.
1. I find it more likely shwinnie is a PR if they are town. ||| Obviously this isn't true (swhinnie clearly claimed not mason), but I never really thought it was more likely than anyone else. I was however trying to get scum to nk shwinnie, as although I lean town on them, I recognize they are probably getting hung at some point do to the general suspiscion surrounding them, it seems. I figured if scum tries to kill them it will save us a mislim possibly.
4. Shwinn has discussion to contribute. It was very clear d1 that shwin was not used to the same kind of mafia that it seems the majority of us are used to. I thought this disparity could lead to some good discussion, if they ended up seeing things differently. This was also mentioned because I was trying to move the vote onto someone that had seemed more like a SR to me, (StD)

The second point against me that I found was that of what I said about being Nked not really mattering. This I said because I was responding to a question about how I had TR T3 when we thought he was going to flip red. If I had been killed, it would only have been relevant in people's thoughts about me and T3, who would both have been dead.

Finally, Wu brought up that they thought I was being unfairly harsh toward them for not contributing compared to other people. I think this isn't true, my emnity toward StD has been long established at this point. I feel shwinnie has contributed signifigantly too.

Reads:
Town (Roden, Val, Catboi)
???? swhinnie
Scum Wu, StD

There were some other points Wu brought up, but they don't seem particularly meaningful imo.