Newbie 2073: Parfait (Over)

[Roden]

We might just not see eye to eye on this and whatever, but I really do think that I can (1) maintain that StD is my top quorum pick and (2) hold other players to a high standard of rigor in argumentation, *yes even if they are accusing the person who I too find suspicious* - in fact I would contend that it is *wolfish* to let any argument fly so long as it is directed at the person I would like to see quorumed; we want to be right for the right reasons, as town.

It is wolfish to want to see a particular player quorumed by Any Means Necessary.

It is townish to carefully scrutinize arguments from all players, regarding all players.

This feels LAMIST as fuck but I can't get into why until tomorrow to avoid being anti-town.

[Save The Dragons]

V/LA 7/31-8/1

been busy. kinda still waiting for Val to provide a case on me that isn't "look at how scummy STD is"

you know, like the reason he was scumreading me before I came into the thread today

[shwinnebego]

LAMIST?

[Val89]

been busy. kinda still waiting for Val to provide a case on me that isn't "look at how scummy STD is"

you know, like the reason he was scumreading me before I came into the thread today

You know, you complained about this in your 579.

I am also happy starting with StD

why

Let's expand that 530 just a

tiny

bit more, shall we?

I am also happy starting with StD, for much the same reasons as have come up already.

I do have to ponder why you decided to cut those next 10 words out. Given your following question was "why", I would suggest they were very relevant, and you get scum points from me for omitting them.

To wit; those "reasons that have come up already", if it wasn't clear, was the fact that StD spent D1 basically coasting and seemed content to continue that D2 at that point, and also the TMI with respect to T3s flip, as per my 497.

That was enough for me to decide to start with StD, and when he did enter the thread; he presented a wall of quotes, 4 of which related to me (the slot he decided to vote, after presenting his case). Two of those were complaining, as above, that I said I would start with StD but not given a case (and as I note, one of those was misleadingly shortened). One was my RVS vote, and the other was the quote by Navigator. I found this in particular HIGHLY suspicious, and I explained to the extent I feel I can without straying into anti-town territory with 625.

I thought I might already have givent he game away a bit too much, but I take the continued and repeated attempts by the slots I find most scummy at this point (StD and Shwinn) to continue to attempt to draw my slot in particular into further explanation on my case against StD (and note they are kicking up a fuss specifically against

Val

not having given a fully fleshed out case, despite StD being scumread and voted by multiple slots) as evidence scum might still have some residual doubts they want to try and resolve before today ends.

I'm not playing in to it. This is the last I will say on the matter, full stop. If any of you think that is scummy, so be it. We can deal with it later.

[catboi]

LAMIST?

"look at me I'm so townie". He's accusing you of trying to look town by talking up how you're acting and saying it's townish

In general I prefer if people say what they mean rather than using buzzwords, because such things are an excuse to turn off critical thinking

[catboi]

I see the announced intent to hammer, let me see if I have anything to add

[catboi]

I feel like Meg's vote is scummy, but I also don't really like save the dragons asking for a case and nothing more even if he's V/LA. I feel blah about the whole game right now.

[catboi]

Just went through a thorough readthrough of Wu's posts, and I feel I am going at them a bit too harshly. Looking at a lot of the reactions that they have seem reason able enough to have come from a town Wu (although I definitely don't think scum Wu is off the table). I have TR val, roden, and catboy for a long while because they appear to be approaching the game with a similar thought process of my own, I believe that it would be good to look through their posts to try to make sure that assumption is correct. I also think StD's flip would be important to help that analysis as well, and I think its close to time for that flip.

I don't think its really any more likely them than Wu, but I think the flip is more telling.

VOTE: SavetheDragons

This is E-1.

This is kind of a big shrug - why is he being voted? "to help that analysis". Of whom? How will it help? He says it will be telling but doesn't elaborate. It's a very empty vote, I feel like any scum could write this.

VOTE: megazumarill

[shwinnebego]

Vote count please?

[catboi]

Save The Dragons (3): shwinnbego, Val89, MegAzumarill
MegAzumarill (3): GeneralWu, Save The Dragons, catboi

Not Voting: Roden

[catboi]

Actually I don't like STD's response, either, he's just been asking what the case on him was. There's no actual refocusing, his vote move onto meg is weak.

[Val89]

Did we not have a discusion day 1 about putting someone at an unannounced E-1, catboi?

[Roden]

Oh. I really don't like this double E-1 at all.

[Roden]

LAMIST?

"look at me I'm so townie". He's accusing you of trying to look town by talking up how you're acting and saying it's townish

In general I prefer if people say what they mean rather than using buzzwords, because such things are an excuse to turn off critical thinking

Yeah sorry, stuff came up yesterday and I couldn't really get into the game enough to go deeper into what I was thinking.

[Roden]

We still have two days, I wanna hear from Meg now that they're at E-1. I trust them more than StD but this got way spicier than I expected and I don't want to throw.

[catboi]

Did we not have a discusion day 1 about putting someone at an unannounced E-1, catboi?

I guess, sorry. Out of habit and assumed people would know and it was unlikely anyone would switch.

Oh. I really don't like this double E-1 at all.

Er, why?

[Roden]

Because StD seems like the obvious choice, but if I was right about him being this game's LHF and he's town, then it really looks like I'm paired with Meg and ELo is going to be hell. But if I vote Meg and they flip town, then I'd be voting someone that I town read and StD goes to ELo.

Shwinn specifically can shade me no matter what I do here. I just want to make sure I vote correctly and don't set myself up as mis-elim bait tomorrow, so both StD and Meg need to case themselves to me.

[catboi]

I think you're town regardless, shrug. I won't hold it against you if you vote StD here and he flips town. I think there's an extremely high likelihood of scum between the two of them no matter what.

[shwinnebego]

I support catboi’s vote. I like being at double E-1. Let’s have some actual stakes here. There isn’t anything close to an airtight case on Angie right now.

Hey Roden, if you wanna eliminate Meg but don’t wanna be the hammer I’m happy to move my vote to hammer Meg.

[shwinnebego]

*on anyone

[shwinnebego]

Roden is correct that I generally suspect them. If they hammer scum today, they would drop precipitously in my list of suspects tomorrow. I generally consider a bus relatively unlikely today since the cases were so weak that I think if I was scum I would have just pushed a different target. Especially if I was a more experienced player.

[shwinnebego]

I do agree with catboi that “it’s pretty likely to find scum” between STD and Meg, but with 7 players remaining that’s not a terribly high probability bar to pass

[shwinnebego]

(I would basically say that about any combination of two of you. At this exact moment I tend to read Val as townier. I still strongly feel that my learning hit diminishing returns some time back on this game day)

[Roden]

I think you're town regardless, shrug. I won't hold it against you if you vote StD here and he flips town. I think there's an extremely high likelihood of scum between the two of them no matter what.

Yeah, these don't feel like TvT wagons tbh.

Roden is correct that I generally suspect them. If they hammer scum today, they would drop precipitously in my list of suspects tomorrow. I generally consider a bus relatively unlikely today since the cases were so weak that I think if I was scum I would have just pushed a different target. Especially if I was a more experienced player.

Yeah I figured you did. I gave it more thought last night about your actions and I might've just jumped the gun. Not necessarily saying I'm taking back what I said, but I don't feel as strong about my suspicions on you as I did earlier.

Idk how to feel about the possibility of a bus, but I agree it's at least less likely to happen today, mostly due to what happened with T3 though.

I support catboi’s vote. I like being at double E-1. Let’s have some actual stakes here. There isn’t anything close to an airtight case on Angie right now.

Hey Roden, if you wanna eliminate Meg but don’t wanna be the hammer I’m happy to move my vote to hammer Meg.

Because you think I'm paired with them, right?

If you're trying to gambit on whether or not I'd protect scum!Meg, that kinda puts pressure on me to actually vote them. If you want them gone, then switch your vote. But don't try to influence my vote if you plan to park your vote on the opposing wagon.

[GuyInFreezer]

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