Mini 2231: Radio Buzz | Game Over!

[Infinity 324]

- ig reading it looking for a traitor could make sense but i'm still rather suspicious that you keyed in on the word 'malefactor', as i think it would stand out to scum more.

this part feels like "you're towny but i want to push you anyway" in scumspeak

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

our mod is awesome

i cant wait to meet the newbs

[Infinity 324]

infinity i'm not getting good vibes from thus far

oh this is gonna be fun :)

elaborate?

[DrippingGoofball]

Town

DGB
Kyouko
Pooky
Ydrasse
Infinity 324

Null

Galron
Roden

Scum

rousseau
skitter30
Cephrir
Tetrina
House

[DrippingGoofball]

This is my page 10 solve. Reads might have evolved since.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

If Tetrina was invited to this game by MT from an irl playgroup, the radio callers may also be members of that group, btw.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Pooky, why is Gamma scum?

[rousseau]

If Tetrina was invited to this game by MT from an irl playgroup, the radio callers may also be members of that group, btw.

or the callers not being mafiascummers could have inspired such a claim from tetrina

[rousseau]

Scum

rousseau

yea?

[skitter30]

- Scum dont have to push me "because she knows the scum are malefactors", that would give away that they know the flavor when I have only speculated at it. All they have to do is push me for talking about it, or faking a townslip
- I thought, when I saw your push, that scum would sheep it. That's why I asked all 3 of you about why scum would post that, because town will sheep too. I wanted to coax a little bit out of you 3, especially Pooky, because he was just like "good point"
- If you start it but dont end it, and arent too involved, it could easily be forgotten that you started it later on. That could explain why you didnt vote with your push, or why you didnt answer my question in your next post, if that was intentional.
- if you're scum, I do think you skipped answering on purpose, but there's no way to prove it so I'm not really bringing it up anymore
- I think the discussion around the callers has been worthwhile. Whether the current caller messages themselves are significant, I dont know. But I do think the thread's kicked off regardless of how important the messages are at this point.
- I spotted it the second time through when I was actively looking for something. Up to you whether you believe that.

- sorry i'm not really getting the first point you're making, that's basically what i'm pushing you for
- ok fair enough
- oh i am absolutely owning this push, i am in no way abdicating responsibility for it
- i did not skip on answering on purpose, i missed it, but yeah we can drop this
- i think the discussion about the callers is useful (i.e. it kicked off this whole convo with you) but inherently i don't think that much of what they said is important thus far
- right, my point is that *the first time* you read through the messages i believe you were approaching it with a scum mindset, that's sort of my whole point. i don't think that's something town would comment on, but i think it's something that would stick out to scum

[skitter30]

Because I didnt read the setup correctly and thought the 1 caller that knows the identity of scum was not known by scum, like a traitor. I feel like in that situation the caller would want to signal scum so I wanted to look for that signal.

eh ok, i guess that could make some amount of sense and is semi-plausible. and that's what you were thinking the first time you read the messages?

[skitter30]

i'm not really sure why you think i ought to be viewing ssbm as flipbait? that's not how i view her and i'm not sure why that's relevant to the situation

to me, it doesn't seem like you considered whether ssbm could be limbait, or really anything about her mindset. if you did, i think you were uncharacteristically quick to jump to a conclusion based on shallow reasoning. i sort of understand where you're getting the idea that it's likely that ssbm approaches the "malefactors" thing this way as scum, but i have no idea where you get the idea that it's unlikely for her to approach it this way as scum. i felt her explanation was pretty robust and would've at least taken some doing to replicate and scum, and i actually feel like you recognized that too, but you brushed it aside because it didn't fit with your narrative.

ok, i still don't get why you think i should be viewing her as limbait? can you spell out how/why you think i should have been having that thought in this context?

i do think i was considering her mindset - i feel like the way she approached it comes from scum much more often than it does come from town. i'm not really getting what conclusiosn you think i ought to have been drawing here instead?
like my whole point is that i don't think town has the thoughts she had about the caller messages. i don't think town particularly notices the word malefactor (and i'm basing this off the fact that i know i didn't until she pointed it out). but scum, who are flavored this way, would.

i don't really get why you think her approach was townie tbh

and wrt the traitor thing - i'm double-checking the timeline because i'm not sure if that's what she thought the first time she read the messages or the second (i.e. after i called her out on it), because that's relevant to how i view understand the situation

[skitter30]

i also think you should know that omgus/reactionary behavior isn't actually scummy, and i see nothing in your reasoning that makes you think this is a special case.

i don't think she truly scumreads my push on her (as i still dont' think i got a satisfactory explanation for why she's voting me rn) so her vote on me seems somewhat fake to me

[skitter30]

- ig reading it looking for a traitor could make sense but i'm still rather suspicious that you keyed in on the word 'malefactor', as i think it would stand out to scum more.

this part feels like "you're towny but i want to push you anyway" in scumspeak

no

[skitter30]

infinity i'm not getting good vibes from thus far

oh this is gonna be fun :)

elaborate?

a large part of your current content is defending someone i'm scumreading + i'm not getting townie vibes off of you yet (and i feel like in other games that usually happens p early)

[Infinity 324]

I just think it's weird to read that one of the callers is scum and then not go back and analyze the callers' posts. I came into the game expecting from the description there would be anonymous messages that were sometimes pro-scum, sometimes pro-town. This is different so after I caught up I went back and read the caller messages again, to see if there was any hidden message for scum because immediately the scum caller reminds me of a traitor. I was expecting them to try to signal scum in some way, so I was specifically rereading for crumbs when I noticed it.

@skitt again i felt that this mindset was pretty robust and i think you at least should be weighing it a bit more, or at least trying to poke a hole in it if you think there's a hole. i don't really think the explanation that the word malefactor didn't stick out to you therefore it wouldn't stick out to anyone else is how you think as town, you're normally very good at recognizing that people think differently from each other instead of going "i don't understand this and there could be a scum mindset therefore scum". your scum mindset here assumes that the flavor name for scum is actually malefactor (correct me if i'm wrong), which is a dubious assumption at best. you also mentioned the omgus and reactionary thing, which i think you know isn't actually scummy. i don't think any of your reasons to call ssbm scum are strong enough to jump to pushing her rather than questioning her town mindset and seeing if it holds up.

[Gamma Emerald]

Ah
Well generally I don’t feel like the numbers town has offer that big an advantage when scum have the information advantage

Idk it feels like 10 town and 4 scums would be more fair, but I'l trust that the game was reviewed or something

this if anything seems like a townslip tbh

Ew, no.

It seems like somebody isn't happy with their numbers, to me.

While Tetrina does seem like salty scum I don’t think that’s good evidence for it

[skitter30]

@infinity

you're kind of collapsing what i'm saying into 'i don't understand it could come from scum so therefore scum' which i feel is inaccurate at best.

ssbm is assuming that the flavor name is malefactor, and calling out lock's post as therefore coming from scum because it has that word.
i'm saying that *i don't think town would be attuned to that word* in the first place.

i don't know if malefactor is the flavor name, but i'm saying that in the universe it is, i don't think town comes into this game with the associative that 'malefactor' -> scum. i.e. i don't think they would get to the conclusion that using the word 'malefactor' would be a slip because they have no reason to think that that word has anything to do with scum at all. if that is, indeed, scum's flavor name, scum would have that subconscious associative by virtue of reading their role pm.

i don't think it's a natural thought to think that someone slipped there just by virtue of the fact that they used that word. ssbm thinks it was a slip - that means she thinks that a scum-aligned caller used that phrase

i'm also dubious that traitor was her first, real thought upon reading that message, for a few reasons:
- why is looking for a traitor in the npc messages the first thing that town does upon entering the game? there was some amount of content at that point iirc, no? and i'm not sure why it's more likely for town to be looking for traitors than scum, if anything that seems like a scum activity to me? like if she thought that it was a traitor, which alignment is more likely to start her game off trying to identify the traitor? i would imagine that's a lot mroe likely to come from scum than town.
- she initially called out locke's post as a *slip*. later, she's explaining this thought as looking for traitor crumbs - a crumb is a purposeful message a traitor would make to try to signal to the scumteam, right? that's not a slip, that's like the opposite of a slip? i'm not sure the traitor story really makes sense, so i'm somewhat dubious that it's something she thought up after the fact to explain her actions

i also think that early game this is *exactly* something that i can use to push to get the game moving
for like p2 i think this is more than enough content to start a push tbh
don't really get why you think i'd be gently questioning over pushing there, or why you think town-me picks the former over the latter

[Infinity 324]

i'm saying that in the universe it is, i don't think town comes into this game with the associative that 'malefactor' -> scum

sure, but if that isn't scum's flavor name, your reasoning kinda falls apart, no?

i'll wait for ssbm to answer about the traitor thing, but your first point is answered pretty well imo by 107, specifically the part where she says she reread the npc conversation after she realized one of them was scum. this also means she'd specifically be attuned to potential slips or traitor crumbs, so it makes sense that she'd try to read into those messages even though they may have been NAI. idk, i don't really see why you're that confident that town wouldn't be attuned to the word malefactor.

i also am suspicious of the "trying to get the game going explanation", given your tone and point-by-point responses i think you were at least trying to get a wagon on ssbm and potentially an elim.

i'm also suspicious of your scumvibes on me, normally you're very good at correctly townreading me and though i'm not 100% sure you should be townreading me here, i think it's likely that you would be as town

[Galron]

i also think you should know that omgus/reactionary behavior isn't actually scummy, and i see nothing in your reasoning that makes you think this is a special case.

I love this post as a quick follow-up to 247 and right before 250. In a vacuum it's NAI, but the three together come across townie. I don't see this, and the subsequent 1v1, coming from scum sticking their neck out.

[PookyTheMagicalBear]

sure, but if that isn't scum's flavor name, your reasoning kinda falls apart, no?

um do you know that's not the scum's flavor name? and how do you know?

[Infinity 324]

i don't know? but my point is that skitt's reasoning relies on the assumption that it is scum's flavor name, which is not a strong enough basis for a hard push.

[Galron]

assumes that the flavor name for scum is actually malefactor (correct me if i'm wrong), which is a dubious assumption at best

This I don't get though. My first read through that's exactly what I thought -- scum were malefactors. It's just not a word you hear every day. "There are three malefactors among you and if you don't find them, you're in trouble." Going back through it, I felt a little doubt because the word wasn't capitalized, but even so, Resistance are green and it follows that red would be Malefactors. I don't see how it's a dubious assumption.

[Galron]

If Tetrina was invited to this game by MT from an irl playgroup, the radio callers may also be members of that group, btw.

Does it matter?

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