Newbie 2079 | Open House | Game Over!!!

[camelCasedSnivy]

If you think there was scum on the RegRider wagon, why is your focus on RH9?

Tbh RH9 is acting a bit too much on his posts imo as well as stating the obvious (like being sad about losing 2 VTs)

[camelCasedSnivy]

If you think there was scum on the RegRider wagon, why is your focus on RH9?

Tbh RH9 is acting a bit too much on his posts imo as well as stating the obvious (like being sad about losing 2 VTs)

Why did I say action lol meant thinking

[camelCasedSnivy]

If you think there was scum on the RegRider wagon, why is your focus on RH9?

Tbh RH9 is acting a bit too much on his posts imo as well as stating the obvious (like being sad about losing 2 VTs)

Why did I say action lol meant thinking

ACTING NOT ACTION GOD I SUCK AT THIS

[catboi]

If you think there was scum on the RegRider wagon, why is your focus on RH9?

Tbh RH9 is acting a bit too much on his posts imo as well as stating the obvious (like being sad about losing 2 VTs)

If that's your opinion, you're entitled to it. I'm not arguing about RH9 right now.

My qusetion was addressed specifically to margotrosa, because she opened her catch-up claiming she felt there was scum on the RegRider wagon, but rather than investigating the votes there to decide who she felt was most likely to be scum, she chose to go after RH9 instead, with minimal commentary on the RegRider voters. It lacked follow-through on her initial statement. My interest right now is in getting her to explain her thought process, not argue about RH9. For that I need her to answer, not you.


You said you trust Prism more now in 531. Can you explain why?

[camelCasedSnivy]

If you think there was scum on the RegRider wagon, why is your focus on RH9?

Tbh RH9 is acting a bit too much on his posts imo as well as stating the obvious (like being sad about losing 2 VTs)

If that's your opinion, you're entitled to it. I'm not arguing about RH9 right now.

My qusetion was addressed specifically to margotrosa, because she opened her catch-up claiming she felt there was scum on the RegRider wagon, but rather than investigating the votes there to decide who she felt was most likely to be scum, she chose to go after RH9 instead, with minimal commentary on the RegRider voters. It lacked follow-through on her initial statement. My interest right now is in getting her to explain her thought process, not argue about RH9. For that I need her to answer, not you.


You said you trust Prism more now in 531. Can you explain why?

Because until when the RegRider wagon was completely unavoidable, they wanted to switch wagons instead of just jumping on.

Now, that doesn't make them complete Town as they could've just tried to look innocent. But it does seem like they wanted to pivot wagons.

[catboi]

All right. I get where you're coming from.

[Prism]

Cat, I think it's almost time for you to be more forthright with your reads and opinions. Would you prefer to give it before I read or wait until afterwards?

Depending on how I tired I am after dinner I am hoping to get through this

[catboi]

Cat, I think it's almost time for you to be more forthright with your reads and opinions. Would you prefer to give it before I read or wait until afterwards?

Depending on how I tired I am after dinner I am hoping to get through this

I'll do it before. I might not have time to do an in-depth wallpost akin to newbie 2064 but I'll try to get something together so that my reasoning is clear.

[MargotRosa]

Don't like Prism, but I don't like the push on RegRider more

VOTE: Flow

I want it on record that I hate this Reg wagon

I don't know why I thought it was 4 to elim d1. Apologies. I retract my hate

I'd also like some clarification: You never actually expressed any sort of read on RegRider, but expressed a strong dislike for the wagon on him. Why is that? Further, why did you hate it when you thought it was hammered early, only to retract that feeling when it turned out it wasn't?

I made clear that I didn't understand the Reg wagon in 401 and wanted clarification of where it had come from, because something seemed off. Given that noone could give me an adequate explanation of why it had happened, I decided to distrust it.

I didn't hate someone for hammering early. I hated that I thought someone was being coy about it being e-1 so that someone could hammer absent-mindedly, or alternatively hammer intentionally but claim after the fact that they didn't do it on purpose. It was either scummy, or gave a lot of room for scum to do something scummy. I retracted it, because it wasn't e-1, and obviously these points didn't apply.

I do think that there is scum on the wagon, and I think they sit somewhere in my null reads. I went through everything since sunrise, however, and RH9 seemed to me like a more convincing Scum read.

As for Prism, it's a few different things. I think their posts leading up to nightfall all have a more distinctive Town vibe than had been given off otherwise. Also, statistically, Scum is significantly more likely to hammer Scum than Town.

[catboi]

I made clear that I didn't understand the Reg wagon in 401 and wanted clarification of where it had come from, because something seemed off. Given that noone could give me an adequate explanation of why it had happened, I decided to distrust it.

Then I'm not sure why you "retracted" your hate for the wagon, then, without being given so much as an explanation.

[catboi]

I am fully cat-napped, so I will try to explain my reads in full now:

camelcasedsnivy

is very likely town in my eyes. I'm a sucker for the type of suicidal, self-sacrificing townies you see in newbie games and he slotted into that role early in day 1. While the early claiming and offering to be eliminated can be faked, it rarely is. It generally takes a clever, bold player to do it, and my profile of camel, based on their signature saying, ah, "I suck", is that they're not the most confident player and would be unlikely to fake such an attitude. I think in terms of scumhunting they've been

all right

, there's some attempts at forming reads but I somewhat dislike the over-reliance on following others. Still, things like 332's "im trying to make good reads as much as possible" feels self-conscious in a legitimate way.

RH9

is a bit similar in that he seems a player who is inexperienced and low confidence in his own reads, but despite the constant wishy-washiness in his reads, I do get the sense he's legitimately trying to scumhunt. I believe the struggle from him to find reasons to suspect people is real, in part because he's not hiding behind that as an excuse to do nothing - he's still continually trying to make sense of what's going on and form reads. Stuff like the wall at the end of day 1 tends to be very often town from a newer player simply because it's legitimately attempting to solve the game.

I do think

Prism

is probably town at this point. My suspicion of her on entering the game was mostly a bluff to see how she'd react to it. Her response felt towny enough to me although I'm not sure how best to explain it here. It stuck me as genuine skepticism and annoyance at my push rather than the response of "drat, someone who knows me well replaced in and is scumreading me". I think the reflexive distrust of flow trap's townread of her is, in fact, a town-motivated thinking but a flawed one and was trying to get her to see the flaws in her thinking there. I buy her insistence she wouldn't have forced town to eliminate day 1 rather than letting it go to deadline.

CheekyTeeky

ticked a fair number of scum indicators for me as I was reading - her townreads came too early and off too little, the initial energy faded into inactivity, her posting at the day 1 deadline felt performative. And yet her responses to my questioning made me feel uncertain, even though I wouldn't say they were

good

answers, the refusal to explain her thinking at all is frustrating

MargotRosa

mostly just seemed like obvious scum to me, and the reception of her in-thread showed how people have a vulnerability to well-formatted wall posts. I found the analysis in them mostly undercooked, and since that point, she largely fell off. The awkwardness in her shifting reasoning for suspecting Prism felt to me like scum who was making up justification after the fact and forgot what their original reasoning was supposed to be.

Her posts today feel like going through the motions, she claims there's scum on the wagon but doesn't really do much analysis of people's votes there, instead picots to RH9 who feels like someone who gets himself into trouble by being awkward. It feels like a push scum would make rather than a genuine line of inquiry.

I've written some about

XonnorDragon07

already, in general there's not a ton of content from him but I had somewhat bought him as the type of player who was hesitant to act unless there was mechanical info. I do think the "did we just mis[lim]" post is bad and there aren't any posts that ispire strong feeling in me, the analysis from him I've liked the most mainly pertains to margotRosa.

My general theorizing, while I was catching up, was pointing me toward a MargotRosa/CheekyTeeky team - Margot gave essentially a non-read on Cheeky in her reads list, Cheeky's townread of Margot came far too easily and for far too simple a thing. However CheekyTeeky's response to my questioning threw me for a bit of a loop as it wasn't the response I expected from scum there - something abouyt the frustration and demand I give her space didn't feel like the mentality of scum in that situation who might feel threatened by my questioning. It's odd because that alone threw off my feelings and made me consider that I might be thinking on too basic a level. It's possible that I was premature in my asessment of connordragon, and that the team is MargotRosa/ConnorDragon - they've been continually suspecting each other all game but have avoided making any sort of direct pressure on one another. That made me re-think connor after my earlier defense of him to Prism.

In general, I advise newbies against trying to think in terms of exact teams, because it's far too easy to get caught up in false associations between players. However, my thinking on who is scum is hard to separate from this thinking, so I thought I'd just lay it out in the open to be understandable. I think the players in my scumreads are all suspect on individual terms,


These are the quick versions of my thoughts, without anything like citing exact posts, but it still took me a significant amount of time to write, I can try to go into detail if this is unclear.

[catboi]

VOTE: MargotRosa

discuss.

[camelCasedSnivy]

I am fully cat-napped, so I will try to explain my reads in full now:

camelcasedsnivy

is very likely town in my eyes. I'm a sucker for the type of suicidal, self-sacrificing townies you see in newbie games and he slotted into that role early in day 1. While the early claiming and offering to be eliminated can be faked, it rarely is. It generally takes a clever, bold player to do it, and my profile of camel, based on their signature saying, ah, "I suck", is that they're not the most confident player and would be unlikely to fake such an attitude. I think in terms of scumhunting they've been

all right

, there's some attempts at forming reads but I somewhat dislike the over-reliance on following others. Still, things like 332's "im trying to make good reads as much as possible" feels self-conscious in a legitimate way.

1) The "i suck" signature is for fun.
2) I tend to act like this as Town and Mafia anyway, but obviously you dont know how I play so :P
3) Yes, I'm tryna make good reads but from experience 50% of the time my reads just screw me over
4) Kinda mentioned this in 2 but I am the kinda player to "fake such an attitude"
5) Yeah its my nature to rely on others

[camelCasedSnivy]

VOTE: MargotRosa

discuss.

I mean... ok.

Margot isn't the worst vote. But I probably wouldn't.

[camelCasedSnivy]

I am fully cat-napped, so I will try to explain my reads in full now:

camelcasedsnivy

is very likely town in my eyes. I'm a sucker for the type of suicidal, self-sacrificing townies you see in newbie games and he slotted into that role early in day 1. While the early claiming and offering to be eliminated can be faked, it rarely is. It generally takes a clever, bold player to do it, and my profile of camel, based on their signature saying, ah, "I suck", is that they're not the most confident player and would be unlikely to fake such an attitude. I think in terms of scumhunting they've been

all right

, there's some attempts at forming reads but I somewhat dislike the over-reliance on following others. Still, things like 332's "im trying to make good reads as much as possible" feels self-conscious in a legitimate way.

1) The "i suck" signature is for fun.
2) I tend to act like this as Town and Mafia anyway, but obviously you dont know how I play so
3) Yes, I'm tryna make good reads but from experience 50% of the time my reads just screw me over
4) Kinda mentioned this in 2 but I am the kinda player to "fake such an attitude"
5) Yeah its my nature to rely on others

Oh, and adding onto this, I'm used to getting condemned early

[catboi]

VOTE: MargotRosa

discuss.

I mean... ok.

Margot isn't the worst vote. But I probably wouldn't.

Who are your current suspects, then?

Oh, and adding onto this, I'm used to getting condemned early

That is mostly why I believe your response to pressure early on day 1 was authentic

[camelCasedSnivy]

VOTE: MargotRosa

discuss.

I mean... ok.

Margot isn't the worst vote. But I probably wouldn't.

Who are your current suspects, then?

Oh, and adding onto this, I'm used to getting condemned early

That is mostly why I believe your response to pressure early on day 1 was authentic

Well my biggest suspects are probably RH9 and Connor.

Also condemn is the term for elim via vote in mgg if you were confused.

[RH9]

By the way, I'm probably going to wait a while. Because, if Mafia end up bandwagonning me (which I think they would because they can later justify it as PR hunting Day 1), then they're pretty much going to get caught. To be fair, the only people who I still townread from Day 1 would be camelCasedSnivy, CheekyTeeky, and I townread Prism as well, though I didn't completely do that in Day 1 (I voted for them based off MargotRosa's reads). I would say that I also townread catboi (more than I townread flow trap, who they replaced). I townread Connordragon07 more than I townread MargotRosa. I'll probably post my reasoning sometime later.

[camelCasedSnivy]

Summary: RH9 townreads everyone

[CheekyTeeky]

I think Connor is better then.
VOTE: Connor

[Prism]

Alright, I'm finished watching football, time to read the mafia game

[Prism]

I am 12 pages in and my head hurts. No wonder I have put this off.

[Prism]

Basically while driving around the last few days my thoughts have been like:

-RH9's way of not really giving reads, calling everyone town, and emphasizing that they don't know what to do repeatedly while simultaneously demonstrating some awareness of mafia from other formats has me wondering if it is performative. Comments like "I think Mafia will win" and "I think the mafia team is very smart" do not inspire confidence. Constantly piggybacks off of other's reasoning but can never explain what is persuasive about it.

-Cheeky's reaction to my RegRider read continues to bother me. It is not difficult to understand it is was a townlean for a single line of questioning. Despite this she continually claims my read was overly strong (For the 10th time, townlean) or strength of the read (townlean) or that it lacked in reasoning (Given repeatedly and she has never addressed it as implausible). What was wrong with it goes in circles.

-Connor's hesitance to really give reads until I asked really bothered me, as did the bit assuming RegRider would flip town preemptively. There was a part of me that thought their end of day asking about optimal play w/r/t no vote was +town but not enough to pull me off.

-flow trap's townread on me and catboi's prodding at my alignment both came off intuitively wrong to me in different ways

-Snivy I've just kind of shuttled as town by default which is really halfassed and not rigorous, but the chat background does make more sense and the general activity+level of comfort as time has gone on has made it difficult to resist.

[Prism]

-RH9's way of not really giving reads, calling everyone town,

These can seem a bit contradictory but this was meant to emphasize the paralysis and personal safety by hanging back, playing the noob card constantly, and not really going after anyone. Even the townreads are all surface and bland.

[Prism]

Panicked for a second cuz I thought y'all just mislynched while I was gone lol.

Slip

(Just kidding)

I think it's a legit slip.

Can you remind me why you were flipping back and forth between RegRider and Connor? Here you seem to believe this is a real slip.

The only criticism of the RegRider slot I see from you is lack of content. You also theorized that I was protecting a scumbuddy...but also that I should be instavoted if RegRider is town. This seems to suggest Reg was your second strongest scumread with nothing other than lack of content, while with Connor you thought they actively slipped.

I see that today you apparently worked back over Connor's ISO and feel better about their slot. I'd appreciate hearing what about his posting outweighs the slip in your mind.