Newbie 2084: Signs [game over!]

[Datisi]

vote count 1.03

with 9 votes in play, it takes 5 to make a decision. day 1 ends in (expired on 2021-11-28 00:30:00).

elimination

MegAzumarill [2]:

Cape90, Greeting

Meuh [1]:

MegAzumarill

Greeting [1]:

Meuh

marcistar [1]:

StrangeMatter

not voting [4]:

AsuStuckey, ProHawk, Prism, marcistar

mod notes

~ everyone has confirmed!

flavour

[StrangeMatter]

Damn you Daisti.

marcistar can you give an estimate of how accurate you think that is? Or, I'd kind of like to see where that idea comes from, so can you provide an example?

[Datisi]

Daisti

who?

[StrangeMatter]

AAAAAAAAAA I can't spell! (But I'm keeping that your as your nickname btw)

Damn you Daisti.

marcistar can you give an estimate of how accurate you think that is? Or, I'd kind of like to see where that idea comes from, so can you provide an example?

I meant how accurate do you feel the read about nervousness is.

[MegAzumarill]

Dais-T

[Datisi]

VOTE:

Greeting

. Everyone's spoken, so I'll put my vote where my mind is at

please do not colour in your votes like this, because for some reason they break the vote counter.

[Meuh]

VOTE:

Greeting

. Everyone's spoken, so I'll put my vote where my mind is at

please do not colour in your votes like this, because for some reason they break the vote counter.

4 pages in and I've already broken the vote counter probably something to do with there being extra text within the vote
My bad! Won't do it again, will find some other way to use the cute pink

[Cape90]

Funny how you all are suggesting MegAzumarill when I was thinking the same thing. Just feels like they have been putting off doing anything useful this game at all and are using 36 as a sort of cover (even if this isn't the case, I still dislike this post).

The other person is Mueh because fundamentally 43 seems counter intuitive in, well, trying to solve the game, at least early on.
Though I sort of like 34 from Mueh as I find it at the very least a good post so they can stay.

VOTE: MegAzumarill

What makes you think 43 is counterintuitive?

While it doesn’t further too much regarding those who have spoken, getting people who haven’t to talk is productive

I don't think it

makes

them talk despite what you think. Dunno about you, but I play mafia to play mafia, this strategy is likely not even a thing because of like, you know, how prodding works. If a person isn't here then a person isn't here that doesn't make them mafia. I'd rather gather information about the people here that are present now as it certainly is not only a lot more helpful to me, but the threadstate in general.

It's a personal policy to not start scumhunting till we are certain there are actually scum playing

Nothing that has happened so far has really warranted anything yet though

Well that’s the thing, us discussing is how we create things we can then discuss and read each other off of. I don’t think we should start wagons until all have spoken, but there’s no reason not to throw in some smaller scale reads and create the basic playing field we need to obtain to become productive as a town

I agree it's probably objectively bad for town but as a player I typically do 1 of 2 things.

1 Form reads slowly but have confidence in them
2 Jump on someone that I think is scummy early and death tunnel them forever (ask Greeting)

More interestingly I would like to know why Greeting/Cape think my behavior is AI.

55 - At least 1 scum has spoken by this point and that is a fact. And that last line scares me and justifies my vote on you, thanks!
Now addressing 64 over here, well, it's okay I suppose, just feels like you have hopped around trying to figure that out this game. Why wouldn't your behavior be AI? Most of the things you have said just feel very easily fakeable like 73 and 39.

----------------

Now about 43, I just kinda agree with the responses StrangeMatter and Meg made which I suppose also answers why I think it is counter intuitive. Though I am not sure I agree with Meg's point on inactive players needing to be pressured if the active players are acting town, unless we are talking later in the game.

[MegAzumarill]

I agree I can make posts like 73 and 39 as scum
But I have plenty of reason to do it as town
Which would make it not alignment indicative
Also there was not guaranteed 1 scum spoken by 43, which is what I was referring to.
Do you have a reason I don't make those posts as town?

Unless you thin

[MegAzumarill]

*Unless you think that there is something that warranted my reaction in the first three pages that I didn't react to, why does 55 scare you?

[MegAzumarill]

Strangematter care to comment on my wagon?

[MegAzumarill]

Or anything game relevant for that matter

[StrangeMatter]

Well, I don’t like Greeting’s #54, I get townreading someone but sheeping them (that’s what I’m assuming he’s doing) is just not very good if you ask me. I’d get it a little more if say a person has very good read (or something else, mind you it’s still not great) accuracy, but just following your townread’s vote to me doesn’t really make sense.

[MegAzumarill]

Yeah it reads to me like scum trying to look busy while not really doing anything, part of why it's important for them to give a well detailed reason for their vote, if they can

[marcistar]

Then again, there is one RVS at MegAzumarill right now. With me and you counted in, he will be put at E-2 immediately. Are you sure about that?

I actually misread the vote tally. It’s MegAzumarill who is voting Meuh, not the opposite. Which makes this even safer as even with three votes they will still only be at E-2, not E-1.

mm yeah, putting people at e-2 isnt too bad of a thing i think..? as long as we would make it obv. we could always unvote if it looks like some people are setting up for a quick hammer as well.
i agree with (i forgot who said this, but them ), why are u so worried about numbers..? e-1 is where we should be sweating, but if u scumread someone or think somethings helpful, whats bad about putting them to e-2..?

Funny how you all are suggesting MegAzumarill when I was thinking the same thing. Just feels like they have been putting off doing anything useful this game at all and are using 36 as a sort of cover (even if this isn't the case, I still dislike this post).

"you all" it was just me suggesting it LOL
its true they've been putting off doing anything useful, while i do see the points about this just being their general playstyle.. it also isn't really that helpful? it would be tricky to find out if theyre scum or not if they just keep going "yeah thats my playstyle" its a good place to pressure at least, but i wouldn't condemn them so early for it.

The other person is Mueh because fundamentally 43 seems counter intuitive in, well, trying to solve the game, at least early on.
Though I sort of like 34 from Mueh as I find it at the very least a good post so they can stay.

i also didnt like 43, but im not paying too much attention to it cuz its just boils down to i have a different viewpoint than her.

I’ve been townreading you, Cape90.

can u expand on this more?

On that note I’d like to know why Marci threw your name out there in the first place?

(I'm aware Marci voiced why she voted Meg already, but I'd just like elaboration basically)

i haven't actually voted them, i just threw their name there and dipped lol
the reason i threw their name out there, was partly because i felt like if we were to pressure them, we would get a good response, and hopefully make it easier for others as they join the game to get a few reads. i also felt as if they might be a bit harder for me to read as the game progresses, but like this is backed up on nothing except pure vibes.

69 is good soup.

Oh and I forgot to do this again.

VOTE: marcistar

Time to start with people I absolutely don't think I know.

hi, hru, got any thoughts?

marcistar can you give an estimate of how accurate you think that is? Or, I'd kind of like to see where that idea comes from, so can you provide an example?

I meant how accurate do you feel the read about nervousness is.

it depends on experience i think, though its not too damning since theres other reasons why someone could be nervous.
the easiest example i could think of rn is an offsite example so sadly u wouldn't see the actual proof. i dont go scouring thru random games, but im sure it happens here too.

[Meuh]

Then again, there is one RVS at MegAzumarill right now. With me and you counted in, he will be put at E-2 immediately. Are you sure about that?

I actually misread the vote tally. It’s MegAzumarill who is voting Meuh, not the opposite. Which makes this even safer as even with three votes they will still only be at E-2, not E-1.

mm yeah, putting people at e-2 isnt too bad of a thing i think..? as long as we would make it obv. we could always unvote if it looks like some people are setting up for a quick hammer as well.
i agree with (i forgot who said this, but them ), why are u so worried about numbers..? e-1 is where we should be sweating, but if u scumread someone or think somethings helpful, whats bad about putting them to e-2..?

Funny how you all are suggesting MegAzumarill when I was thinking the same thing. Just feels like they have been putting off doing anything useful this game at all and are using 36 as a sort of cover (even if this isn't the case, I still dislike this post).

"you all" it was just me suggesting it LOL

its true they've been putting off doing anything useful, while i do see the points about this just being their general playstyle.. it also isn't really that helpful? it would be tricky to find out if theyre scum or not if they just keep going "yeah thats my playstyle" its a good place to pressure at least, but i wouldn't condemn them so early for it.

The other person is Mueh because fundamentally 43 seems counter intuitive in, well, trying to solve the game, at least early on.
Though I sort of like 34 from Mueh as I find it at the very least a good post so they can stay.

i also didnt like 43, but im not paying too much attention to it cuz its just boils down to i have a different viewpoint than her.

I’ve been townreading you, Cape90.

can u expand on this more?

On that note I’d like to know why Marci threw your name out there in the first place?

(I'm aware Marci voiced why she voted Meg already, but I'd just like elaboration basically)

i haven't actually voted them, i just threw their name there and dipped lol

the reason i threw their name out there, was partly because i felt like if we were to pressure them, we would get a good response, and hopefully make it easier for others as they join the game to get a few reads. i also felt as if they might be a bit harder for me to read as the game progresses, but like this is backed up on nothing except pure vibes.

69 is good soup.

Oh and I forgot to do this again.

VOTE: marcistar

Time to start with people I absolutely don't think I know.

hi, hru, got any thoughts?

marcistar can you give an estimate of how accurate you think that is? Or, I'd kind of like to see where that idea comes from, so can you provide an example?

I meant how accurate do you feel the read about nervousness is.

it depends on experience i think, though its not too damning since theres other reasons why someone could be nervous.
the easiest example i could think of rn is an offsite example so sadly u wouldn't see the actual proof. i dont go scouring thru random games, but im sure it happens here too.

Fair point, it is true that even if it's a playstyle thing, we should be pressuring players who aren't putting constructive content out; I was more so criticizing Cape's point since he seems to view it as suspicious (and it will be if Meg just refuses to put out reads, but from what they've said they're gonna be posting some later on once the game's developed a bit more)

My bad, mispoke

I agree with you on that vibe honestly, the way Meg's approaching the game and the tone they've been adopting makes me feel like they'll be someone hard to read long-term, which is a scary prospect.

[Greeting]

It's a personal policy to not start scumhunting till we are certain there are actually scum playing

Nothing that has happened so far has really warranted anything yet though

Well that’s the thing, us discussing is how we create things we can then discuss and read each other off of. I don’t think we should start wagons until all have spoken, but there’s no reason not to throw in some smaller scale reads and create the basic playing field we need to obtain to become productive as a town

I agree it's probably objectively bad for town but as a player I typically do 1 of 2 things.

1 Form reads slowly but have confidence in them
2 Jump on someone that I think is scummy early and death tunnel them forever (ask Greeting)

More interestingly I would like to know why Greeting/Cape think my behavior is AI.

I would also reiterate I want to hear Greeting's reasons for suspecting me so far. I think it's an important point

I wouldn't say that I find you suspicious so far. As to why my vote is where it is, I'm... testing stuff. This will be pretty vague but let me just say that if I truly wanted this wagon to succeed and had definite thoughts that you were scum, I wouldn't be worrying about you reaching E-2 or E-1.

mm yeah, putting people at e-2 isnt too bad of a thing i think..? as long as we would make it obv. we could always unvote if it looks like some people are setting up for a quick hammer as well.
i agree with (i forgot who said this, but them ), why are u so worried about numbers..? e-1 is where we should be sweating, but if u scumread someone or think somethings helpful, whats bad about putting them to e-2..?

Why am I worried about putting someone at E-2? Because we have two scums who can easily jump on a wagon and seal it. Also, I'm not having someone eliminated without proof or at least a feeling. Wagons can also be used for other purposes than actually voting someone out and that's what I want to do.

[Prism]

As a brief summary, I have only some sparse comments at the moment. I lean that marcistar is town for the comfort and early force of presence, which is an improvement on her performance in Tarot. It is always scary to read players quickly improving, and there is less to worry about in a Newbie game, but I'm fine assuming the best at the moment.

Meg is the only player I have some direct experience with here, but it is very limited in the form of my brief appearance in Mini Normal 2216. They were much more reads-focused early that game, while they were a lot more theory/mech oriented in their run as scum in Trust Fall. This really piques my curiosity, but I'm not really sold on it being AI. I want to judge them more based off of their reads.

I'll hold of voting Meg, or anyone, for the moment.

[Prism]

Scattered commentary/questions I had:

The [marcistar's] invitation just feels like fake confidence and like I said, they never said they scumread you, so it came out of nowhere. I can easily see scum make that post in an attempt to posture as a confident townie willing to die, yknow?

I can see this applying to a generalized userbase, but leveraging your personal knowledge of marcistar-do you think she makes such an attempt as scum?

Let's say I do. Who is your choice and why?

prob meg, since I wanna solve them and I feel like it might be more benefical to do it earlier on.

Can you elaborate on why for both of these statements?

UNVOTE:

Spartan/Prism

since the slot’s said something now

My response was just a player intro, completely lacking in game commentary and a vote. I just replaced in so of course I would post eventually-it's the game content you should be waiting for.

[Prism]

Oh, actually I almost forgot:

VOTE: ProHawk

Seems like we've escaped the random voting scene so I need to take a few moments to digest the scene which I haven't had enough time to do properly yet.

Man I feel old when new terms come into play that are new to me... when did "locktown" become a thing... haha

Anyhow, I'd love to get a feel for the experience of our newer players if you'd like to intro that a bit for those of you who haven't, that would be great.

I was curious if anything came of this.

[StrangeMatter]

I feel like it’s a weird paranoia to be worrying about both scum hammering on day 1 and outing themselves. Kind of want to know where you base this paranoia Greeting.

As for Marci, I feel like it’s a decent answer, not particularly great but not unusual to me since off site stuff is almost never provable, and I’ve had that screw me over.

[MegAzumarill]

It's a personal policy to not start scumhunting till we are certain there are actually scum playing

Nothing that has happened so far has really warranted anything yet though

Well that’s the thing, us discussing is how we create things we can then discuss and read each other off of. I don’t think we should start wagons until all have spoken, but there’s no reason not to throw in some smaller scale reads and create the basic playing field we need to obtain to become productive as a town

I agree it's probably objectively bad for town but as a player I typically do 1 of 2 things.

1 Form reads slowly but have confidence in them
2 Jump on someone that I think is scummy early and death tunnel them forever (ask Greeting)

More interestingly I would like to know why Greeting/Cape think my behavior is AI.

I would also reiterate I want to hear Greeting's reasons for suspecting me so far. I think it's an important point

I wouldn't say that I find you suspicious so far. As to why my vote is where it is, I'm... testing stuff. This will be pretty vague but let me just say that if I truly wanted this wagon to succeed and had definite thoughts that you were scum, I wouldn't be worrying about you reaching E-2 or E-1.

mm yeah, putting people at e-2 isnt too bad of a thing i think..? as long as we would make it obv. we could always unvote if it looks like some people are setting up for a quick hammer as well.
i agree with (i forgot who said this, but them ), why are u so worried about numbers..? e-1 is where we should be sweating, but if u scumread someone or think somethings helpful, whats bad about putting them to e-2..?

Why am I worried about putting someone at E-2? Because we have two scums who can easily jump on a wagon and seal it. Also, I'm not having someone eliminated without proof or at least a feeling. Wagons can also be used for other purposes than actually voting someone out and that's what I want to do.

I'm really more concerned with the why you got here than the actual result itself.

If you say you're testing something you don't need to reveal quite yet but I would like the why revealed by eod

[Prism]

For StrangeMatter, I think the nervousness idea is very intuitive. Most of us remember the nervous trepidation of being scum for the first time. It's the first barrier to overcome, which also makes it quite common.

I don't find it strong, but I see exactly why marcistar keyed in on it. It is also obvious in one of her scumgames, Tarot, which I would link were I not on my phone, that she also struggled with it.

What do you think of marci's entrance on a mission?

[Meuh]

Scattered commentary/questions I had:

The [marcistar's] invitation just feels like fake confidence and like I said, they never said they scumread you, so it came out of nowhere. I can easily see scum make that post in an attempt to posture as a confident townie willing to die, yknow?

I can see this applying to a generalized userbase, but leveraging your personal knowledge of marcistar-do you think she makes such an attempt as scum?

Let's say I do. Who is your choice and why?

prob meg, since I wanna solve them and I feel like it might be more benefical to do it earlier on.

Can you elaborate on why for both of these statements?

UNVOTE:

Spartan/Prism

since the slot’s said something now

My response was just a player intro, completely lacking in game commentary and a vote. I just replaced in so of course I would post eventually-it's the game content you should be waiting for.

Not too sure, haven't played a game with mafia!Marci (or with Marci at all) since last April, I could reread that game to try to see how she plays at scum? But then I'd also need to read a towngame of hers to actually see what she does

out of the norm

as scum. I've proven on multiple occasions that having played with Marci before doesn't actually end up with me making better reads on her sadly not sure if should try meta reading her because honestly I've always been further off doing it than without
my statement was more based on general patterns I notice than anything specific to Marci

I thought she already did here in post 89?

On that note I’d like to know why Marci threw your name out there in the first place?

(I'm aware Marci voiced why she voted Meg already, but I'd just like elaboration basically)

i haven't actually voted them, i just threw their name there and dipped lol
the reason i threw their name out there, was partly because i felt like if we were to pressure them, we would get a good response, and hopefully make it easier for others as they join the game to get a few reads. i also felt as if they might be a bit harder for me to read as the game progresses, but like this is backed up on nothing except pure vibes.

Did you want a more in depth explanation?

Well sure, that's true. You had promised content though, and felt as if since you'd committed to that, I could unvote and see if there was a better place for it, I could always just vote for you again if you didn't deliver content

[StrangeMatter]

For StrangeMatter, I think the nervousness idea is very intuitive. Most of us remember the nervous trepidation of being scum for the first time. It's the first barrier to overcome, which also makes it quite common.

I don't find it strong, but I see exactly why marcistar keyed in on it. It is also obvious in one of her scumgames, Tarot, which I would link were I not on my phone, that she also struggled with it.

What do you think of marci's entrance on a mission?

Also a fair point, my first real scum game on this website has me playing pretty nervously despite not really showing it and not talking much.

I’m not sure what you exactly mean by this last sentence.