do I really need to? the difference in their depth of thought is somewhat self evident no?In post 672, Lukewarm wrote:Have you talked about reasonings for Baltar and Toog before this?In post 669, Aristeia wrote:I feel like I'm sliding towards a Baltar - Pavo - Toogeloo solve and it feels too easy almost.
The feeling of complacency is hard to shake.
I just made a +town for numberQ post and a +scum for Baltar post and have been pushing Pav, and not gonna lie, seeing you present that solve immediately after caused a pit in the stomach sensation.
Open 840 - Guardians of the Fortress [Game Over]
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I didn't really think it was that bad an idea >_>.In post 626, numberQ wrote:I don't see how fake voting makes for more accountability. We're all supposed to be giving reads about the other games anyway (which I've been bad about for the Gate to be fair). This feels like scum coming up with something that appears +town at first glance but really doesn't mean anything in the end. It'd be so so easy for scum to "vote" each other and look good without any real risk if we do this.- Aristeia
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Your my scum read in the Keep. Does that help?In post 676, Aristeia wrote:I want Pavo/Tooges/Vpb to try harder if they are town.
PEdit: I'm thinking numberQ at the moment with how heavily they keeps shading me.- Aristeia
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In post 679, Toogeloo wrote:I'm thinking numberQ at the moment with how heavily they keeps shading me.- Toogeloo
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So you find my light shading of you more acceptable, Toog?- Toogeloo
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In post 650, VP Baltar wrote:Like that's some legit dumb shit to say
I was efforting pretty good last night, nglIn post 676, Aristeia wrote:I'm not really presenting a solve because I want to lock it in
I want Pavo/Tooges/Vpb to try harder if they are town.
Given my posts on Baltar last night do you think we are scum together??- Pavowski
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Baltar this is why I thought you were upset.In post 650, VP Baltar wrote:Like that's some legit dumb shit to say
I didn't mean my comment as shade, more just ironically noticing that I was posting about you and suddenly you appeared. It was an amusing coincidence as far as I'm concerned. I had forgotten you were vla.
Anyway this is my third apology for it, I don't know you like that and cracked a joke too early, it's entirely my bad, and I'm going to stop cluttering the thread with it.
Sorry.- Pavowski
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Okay, I've reread VP Baltar's iso. Here are the things which stood out to me and which I don't think are just me conf-biasing because I have certainty that he's scum.In post 537, Tanner wrote: i would like to know what "objective" points you believe you have against baltar.
1. Fake confusion about mech
Spoiler:
2. He tried to rush the Gate vote today:
Spoiler:
3. VP has backtracked on his takes under pressure:
Spoiler:
4. VP wanted to get a lurker at the Gate
Spoiler:
5. Poor excuse for lack of D1 scumhunting:
Spoiler:
It might beharderto scumhunt without votes but it's not impossible.
6. VP omitted the IC possibility when suggesting Tanner go to the Gate early on D1:
Spoiler:
Interactions with/reads of others
I'm not sure how useful the 'reads of' part of this section will be, because of something VP said:
The implication is that he likes to hold back at least some of his thoughts on other players.In post 414, VP Baltar wrote:
I am gathering information to make reads off.In post 413, Aristeia wrote:ok but what's the point of applying pressure to me?
I don't really care if the scum think they are going to play off that because I almost never put all my thoughts on the table until I'm ready to push something.
I will go all out tunneling someone to see how they act and then call them town. Ill flip on locktown reads ive had all game if i see something solidly scummy. Good luck to scum trying to plan off my reads, because even I can't do that.
I think in this game, especially given there's no future days, VP should give his full and frank reads on all players now. I think it would be objectively anti-town not to do so in the current game state.
VP's interactions with others, though, may be more useful in and of themselves...
...I've drafted some notes for this section but it's 2am here so I'll provide this section tomorrow.
Summary
If you think the above isn't a slam-dunk case on VP, you'd be right. I was leaning town on him D1, and I think he's being playing it pretty well as scum. I think VP actually hoped he and I would be at Wall together so he could use my town-read on him to his benefit, but wasn't opposed to Gate when it came up since he reckoned Tanner's main D1 doubts about him were based on the theory he and I are partners, and he believed Tanner would see me as scummier individually than him once that was proven impossible.- Pavowski
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Can you explain your thoughts here a little more?In post 668, Lukewarm wrote:this is more the approach that i think that the scum team would be taking towards pav / compared to numberQ (again, even if I am wrong)
Luke I'm not a scumlock on you, I just have my usual skepticism for you. You happen to be triggering it by resisting my every move and read here, but that's okay. Don't worry, Ari has some scum points too.
fmpov one of you or Ari is scum. The obvious solution for me is asking people to vote me, as I know that's a 100% win. That's the outcome I'd prefer.
Are you convinced by this? Of course not, you think me asking for votes is scummy. But what's scummier? Asking for votes directly knowing how it'll be perceived or asking for votes by not asking for them?
This game is neat- imaginality
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why is that a town ping?In post 628, Pavowski wrote:
This hasn't happened, obviously, bit this is a big town pingIn post 312, imaginality wrote:I think for the third person in Keep we should make it someone Ari and Luke agree to vote for in advance. If we can lock them in to that plan it pretty much forces scum to swap the third person if they're town. Hence my questions to them to see who they can both agree on as town.
same question.In post 640, Pavowski wrote:
This also pings me as towny. The fact that the 2nd paragraph is exactly what happened kinda gives wifom-y vibes but I said I'd keep my takes spicy so I'll stick with townvibesIn post 314, imaginality wrote:@Tanner: you not wanting to go with numberQ and DArby makes me slightly suspicious that VP and I are both town and you're scum trying to get in with us so there's one scum among us. You saying DArby should be with VP and me if you're not doesn't do much to dissuade me from that concern.
That said, I kind of like the idea of you going to Gate with us because I think if you are town and get IC'ed you'd be a useful voice. And I think the same of VP and me, whereas DArby if town seems less useful if IC'ed.
For the same reason if VP and I are at the Wall I'd rather DArby is with us than you.your eyes on the city.- VP Baltar
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Also, I had just finished a white knuckled drive for 8 hours on an icy interstate, so I was definitely short tempered about what I thought was opportunistic shading. I apologize too.In post 697, VP Baltar wrote:@pav - I was not mad and you don't need to apologize for hurting my feelings or something. We're cool.YOUR AD HERE- Pavowski
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I would think that the talk about leashing votes would be something scum would want to steer away from in most cases.In post 696, Tanner wrote:
why is that a town ping?In post 628, Pavowski wrote:
This hasn't happened, obviously, bit this is a big town pingIn post 312, imaginality wrote:I think for the third person in Keep we should make it someone Ari and Luke agree to vote for in advance. If we can lock them in to that plan it pretty much forces scum to swap the third person if they're town. Hence my questions to them to see who they can both agree on as town.
same question.In post 640, Pavowski wrote:
This also pings me as towny. The fact that the 2nd paragraph is exactly what happened kinda gives wifom-y vibes but I said I'd keep my takes spicy so I'll stick with townvibesIn post 314, imaginality wrote:@Tanner: you not wanting to go with numberQ and DArby makes me slightly suspicious that VP and I are both town and you're scum trying to get in with us so there's one scum among us. You saying DArby should be with VP and me if you're not doesn't do much to dissuade me from that concern.
That said, I kind of like the idea of you going to Gate with us because I think if you are town and get IC'ed you'd be a useful voice. And I think the same of VP and me, whereas DArby if town seems less useful if IC'ed.
For the same reason if VP and I are at the Wall I'd rather DArby is with us than you.
It's also kinda -scum imo for imaginality to say "here's this thing I'd like to have happen" and then it happens (you becoming confirmed). Granted scum can bold-face their way thru something like that but this is how it struck me. - Pavowski
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