Datisi's Mini Normal Review, January 2022

[Datisi]

because i am assuming that, even if there's a lot of false positives, an innocent will still be treated as most-likely innocent. i *know* i have a history of screwing around with the gunsmith results, but i don't think the game would immediately jump to "a year ago datisi modded a game where all mafia were doctors so this must be a similar game so we should ignore any and all gunsmith results!!!"

1x town combined rolestopper vigilante
1x town gunsmith
1x town 1-shot backup gunsmith
1x town n2 rolecop
1x town vengeful miller
5x vt

1x mafia 2-shot multitasking jailkeeper
1x mafia informed (there is a town combined rolestopper vigilante in the game)
1x mafia rolestopper enabler

i kind of think that the fact there is a backup gunsmith on top of a regular gunsmith would be a clue that hey, the gunsmith is kind of important, but informed mod perspective etc.

i'm thinking if maybe the rolestopper should be changed into an alien to stop any kind of follow the cop shenanigans, and maybe inform scum there's a vengeful in the game too, because i'm looking at a possibility of a venge+vig in yelo and it's making me have some... uncomfortable flashbacks.

originally i made the rolecop a n1 so that the miller has bigger odds of getting cleared, but depending on the amount of "clears" the gunsmith gets and how they're treated, it felt too much.

i also thought about maybe making a gunsmith informed and letting them know that there are no mafia doctors or traitors (so a clear is a clear) but that also felt a bit too much. maybe it's not.

[Something_Smart]

Yeah follow the cop seems a bit problematic. I like the alien change.

I guess it's probably

somewhere

in the realm of balanced with that? It's still swingy as shit, and it contains your favorite venge + vig combo. But that is pretty rare, especially since scum have a counter if the JK is alive.

[Datisi]

It's still swingy as shit

how much of a problem is this, player-fun-wise? i know it's not Required for a game to be not swingy, but i like to at least try to not get murdered post game. and are there any easy fixes for it that keep the core idea

or should i just throw away the whole setup

?

[Something_Smart]

In general it's often not a

huge

problem, but it's worse in the normal queue because people want, you know, normal games.

That said, you do have a mod reputation, so you will probably attract mostly people who can handle the complexity. It's definitely still bad, but I wouldn't call it a deal breaker.

I think less swingy games are on average more fun though.

[Datisi]

not sure if i'm a fan of there being that much swing that it's still *bad*

1x town combined alien voyeur
1x town gunsmith
1x town 1-shot backup gunsmith
1x town n2 joat (rolecop, follower)
1x town vengeful miller
5x vt

1x mafia 2-shot jailkeeper
1x mafia informed (there is a vengeful town member in the game)
1x mafia alien enabler

this keeps the idea of "one role until an enabler dies, then a different role", but the other role is decently weaker so the mafia enabler dying early should be a net positive for the scumteam instead of a "lol now town has a vig fk u"

i'd rather have universal multitasking, as i just now realized that "multitasking jailkeeper" is basically a guilty for the rolecop

this entirely removes the vigilante though, and depending on how much town power there was from it, might leave the game scumsided? if so, i'm thinking of adding some sorta gated tracker or something, but yeah, wanna check this one first.

[Something_Smart]

Looks better for sure.

The main issue that comes to mind now is that if the miller claims miller they are likely to attract a gunsmith check which is Really Bad for town.

if you want them to be confirmable by the rolecop maybe backup vig or backup IC?

[Datisi]

1x town combined alien voyeur
1x town gunsmith
1x town 1-shot backup gunsmith
1x town n2 joat (rolecop, follower)
1x town backup vigilante
5x vt

1x mafia 2-shot jailkeeper
1x mafia goon
1x mafia alien enabler

you mean something like this?

[Something_Smart]

Yeah.

I would probably drop the N2 from the JOAT in that case, both to give town a little more power and increase the chance of the rolecop check landing on the backup vig.

[Datisi]

sure, i can do that.

if a follower follows a person who is visiting the alien's target, the follower still sees the action, right?

[Something_Smart]

Yeah.

[Datisi]

alright, thanks.

been a long day, i'll get role pm's up tomorrow, assuming chaos doesn't have any objections to this setup.

[Datisi]

1x town combined alien voyeur
1x town gunsmith
1x town 1-shot backup gunsmith
1x town joat (rolecop, follower)
1x town backup vigilante
5x vt

1x mafia 2-shot jailkeeper
1x mafia goon
1x mafia alien enabler

role pm's:

Spoiler:

vanilla townie

welcome,

playername

! you are a

vanilla townie

.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town combined alien voyeur

welcome,

playername

! you are a

town combined alien voyeur

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will perform both following abilities:
~~

alien

: all actions used by that player that night, and all other actions targeted at that player that night, will be blocked.
~~

voyeur

: you will learn what was done to them that night (protection, investigation, etc), but not who did it.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town gunsmith

welcome,

playername

! you are a

town gunsmith

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player has a gun.
~ roles that have a gun are: all mafia (except traitors and doctors), cops, vigilantes, gunsmiths, rolecops, vanilla cops, pt cops, vengefuls, detectives, neapolitans, backups of roles with guns and joats that have any of these listed powers.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town 1-shot backup gunsmith

welcome,

playername

! you are a

town 1-shot backup gunsmith

.

role abilities:

~ once in the game, at night, but only after a gunsmith has died, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will learn whether or not that player has a gun.
~ roles that have a gun are: all mafia (except traitors and doctors), cops, vigilantes, gunsmiths, rolecops, vanilla cops, pt cops, vengefuls, detectives, neapolitans, backups of roles with guns and joats that have any of these listed powers.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town jack-of-all-trades

welcome,

playername

! you are a

town jack-of-all-trades (rolecop, follower)

.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player and use one of the following abilities; each can only be used once:
~~

rolecop

: assuming no interference with your action, you will learn that player's role (but not their alignment).
~~

follower

: assuming no interference with your action, you will learn what form of action they took that night (investigation, protection, killing, etc), but not who they targeted.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

town backup vigilante

welcome,

playername

! you are a

town backup vigilante

.

role abilities:

~ each night, but only after a vigilante has died, you may attempt to kill another player.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

mafia 2-shot jailkeeper

welcome,

playername

! you are a

mafia 2-shot jailkeeper

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

, who is a

mafia goon

, and

playername

, who is a

mafia alien enabler

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.

role abilities:

~ each night, you may target a player. assuming no interference with your action, you will simultaneously roleblock that player, and protect that player from any number of nightkills. you may do this the same night you perpetrate the nightkill.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

mafia goon

welcome,

playername

! you are a

mafia goon

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

, who is a

mafia 2-shot jailkeeper

, and

playername

, who is a

mafia alien enabler

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

mafia alien enabler

welcome,

playername

! you are a

mafia alien enabler

.

factional abilities:

~ you are a member of the mafia, along with

playername

, who is a

mafia 2-shot jailkeeper

, and

playername

, who is a

mafia goon

.
~ once every night, a living member of the mafia may submit a factional kill action.
~ you may talk with your living teammates in the mafia private topic, located here. you may talk there at any time as long as you are alive.

role abilities:

~ when you die, the role "alien" will cease to function for all players.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to the mafia (or nothing can prevent this from occurring) and at least one mafia player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name or by posting in the mafia pt.

result pm's:

Spoiler:

voyeur:
~ a

jailkeeping

action was performed on

playername

.
~ a

role investigation

action was performed on

playername

.
~ an

action investigation

action was performed on

playername

.
~ a

killing

action was performed on

playername

.
~ your action failed, and you did not receive a result.

gunsmith:
~

playername

has a gun.
~

playername

does

not

have a gun.
~ your action failed, and you did not receive a result.

rolecop:
~

playername

is

vanilla

.
~

playername

is a

combined alien voyeur

.
~

playername

is a

gunsmith

.
~

playername

is a

1-shot backup gunsmith

.
~

playername

is a

backup vigilante

.
~

playername

is a

2-shot jailkeeper

.
~

playername

is a

alien enabler

.

follower:
~

playername

performed a

blocking

action.
~

playername

performed an

action investigation

action.
~

playername

performed a

role investigation

action.
~

playername

performed a

jailkeeping

action.
~

playername

performed a

killing

action.

ruleset:

Spoiler:

rules

shamelessly stolen

inspired by plotinus' and schadd_'s rulesets.

the tl;dr:

~ day 1: 10 days. days 2+: 8 days. nights: 2 days.
~ majority yeets.
~ 36 hour before prod, 24 hours before replacement.
~ if you want to replace out, pm me.
~ flavour has no bearing on player alignments.
~ don't be a dick.

the basics:

~ follow all site rules.
~ my mod colour is

teal

. you can use it if you want, just don't attempt to impersonate me.
~ you may not talk to each other about this game outside of threads i have created for this purpose. you may not talk about other ongoing games in this thread.
~

if you wish to replace out, pm me, do not request replacement in thread.

do not discuss your reasons for replacing out publically. do not threaten to replace out or tell other players to replace out. if you have any concerns that a player should be replaced, pm me.
~ do not quote pm's from the mod at all, either real or fabricated. do not quote posts from private threads. this includes specific timestamps. paraphrasing is acceptable.
~

don’t be a dick.

this is a heated game but toxicity will not be tolerated. attack the play not the player. if your fellow players tell you to stop, you must stop. if you do not stop, i will tell you to stop. if you still do not stop, you will be force-replaced.
~

flavour is just flavour, and has no bearing on player alignments.

don't use it to make arguments.
~ play to win. seriously claiming scum with another player is against the rules. i will judge what counts as serious - don't toe the line.
~ if you have any questions about the rules, feel free to pm me.

days and voting:

~ day 1 lasts up to 10 real-life days. days 2+ last up to 8 real-life days.
~ extensions may or may not be granted if there are replacements, or if the circumstances call for it (for example, if the site was experiencing issues).
~ votes must be in bold in the format VOTE: datisi or

vote: datisi

. Strong preference for using vote tags instead of bold tags. unvotes are nice but not required. type [

v]datisi[

/v] to vote and [

uv]datisi[

/uv] to unvote.
~ you can use nicknames when voting, as long as it is clear who you're referring to.
~ if i think it’s a vote, it’s a vote.
~ days end early when a simple majority of players (50% of living players + 1 rounded down) vote to yeet somebody.
~ if a majority is not reached at deadline or if a majority of the players vote for no yeet, the day will end without a yeet. at evens, 50% is sufficient for no yeet.
~ twilight begins when a majority is reached and lasts until i lock the thread. you're still alive until i flip you so you can talk in any game threads you have access to until then, but no votes or unvotes will be counted.
~ it takes (100% of living players + 1) votes to yeet the moderator.

activity and v/la:

~ you must post at least once every 36 hours or i will prod you. you then have 24 hours to post in the game thread or i will replace you. if you come back before i find a replacement, you can stay.
~ if i have to prod you for the fourth time, i will automatically start searching for a replacement.
~ if you haven't posted in the 24 hours before the thread is locked for night, you must reply to the night start pm or you will be replaced during the night.
~ players can request me to prod somebody early. this will only count as an official prod if you don't post before you would have been due for a prod.
~ if you need to be absent for longer than 36 hours, you should declare

v/la

in bold in the thread like this: [

b]

@mod: I will be v/la until thursday

[

/b]. while you are v/la, you will be nudged once every 60 hours. two nudges equals one prod. if you have not posted game advancing content in 5 days, regardless of v/la status, you will be replaced.
~ a naked "prod dodge" does not reset the prod timer. to avoid being prodded/replaced for inactivity, include some game advancing content in your prodges, such as "got prodded; datisi is still scum."

nights and night actions:

~ nights last 48 hours.
~ the night phase can be shortened if every living player -- even those with no night actions -- agrees to it and if I'm not busy.
~ you may submit actions via pm. if you have a scum pt, a mason pt, or a notes pt, you may also submit your actions there. if the actions are not submitted by the deadline then you do nothing. you can change your mind as many times as you like before the deadline.
~ if i don't hear from you about your night actions, i'll pm you 24 hours before the deadline. this doesn't count as a prod. if i still don't hear from you, you will take no action.

miscellaneous:

~ let me know if you want a private thread to store your thoughts and feedback for the other players. you may draft posts in your notes pt if the posts are clearly meant to be posted in the main thread. you may talk about your notes pt. you may not directly quote from your notes pt, and you may not use it to demonstrate that you've had a town mindset in private all along; just put your town mindset in public to begin with and keep your notes to yourself.
~ provable randomness is against the rules. saying that you rolled a dice is fine, using dice tags or random.org screenshots is not.
~ no hard to read / extremely small text. cryptography is forbidden. breadcrumbing is okay.
~ using scripts to alter or hide another player's posts is not allowed.
~ the only allowed media is embedded content, or links to uneditable content. for example, you are not allowed to link vocaroos and pastebins in the thread.
~ very big images and big chunks of non-game-related text are allowed, as long as they are spoiled. if you post them without a spoiler, i will edit a spoiler in.
~ excessive spamming is not allowed.
~ the mod may make mistakes. minor errors (such as a mistake in the vote count) can be pointed out in-thread. for bigger errors, please pm me.
~ i reserve the right to alter/remove/add any rules as i see fit. you will be notified if this happens.

setup information:

~ this is a normal game.
~ any and all private topics will be open at all times.
~ all members of the

mafia

are multitasking by default.
~ sample vanilla townie role pm:

Spoiler:

vanilla townie

welcome,

playername

! you are a

vanilla townie

.

role abilities:

~ you have no special abilities.

win condition:

~ you win when there are no longer any threats to town and at least one town player is alive.

the game thread is here. please confirm your role by replying to this pm with your role name.

i already dread having to resolve all of this... so, if someone visits the alien's target, they're still visible to the follower. likewise, if the follower follows the alien, they should see both a blocking and an action investigation? and if they follow them *after* the alien enabler is dead, they see only the action investigation?

and, if the rolecop and the gunsmith visit the same person that the voyeur is watching, they should get a "you saw a role investigation" twice, right?

[ChaosOmega]

I'll let S_S confirm, but I believe the answer is yes to all of your questions. For the result PM's, rolecop/follower should have a no result option as well, along with a didn't see anything result for voyeur/follower.

[Something_Smart]

Everything Chaos said is correct, yes. Nothing else looks wrong; I'll give it another look just to double-check once you fix those things.

[Datisi]

i am totally a competent moderator, i swear.

"your action failed, and you did not receive a result." is also for both the rolecop and follower. as for the didn't see anything:

voyeur ~ "no actions were performed on

playername

."

follower ~ "

playername

did not perform any actions."

[Something_Smart]

/pass

[ChaosOmega]

/pass