open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[Kaiji]

Sorry for the initial emotional response. I knew I was being baited and I just needed a second to gather the receipts from my memory.

[Kaiji]

Luckily- I think this latest discred attempt is a good example of why catboi is scum here because of this type of dishonest approach to discred me at any cost because I'm attempting to swing the vote to him

[Kaiji]

Wow I really came a long way this game since my skitter scumread huh

[catboi]

it's obnoxious but no one else is even actually attempting to communicate and you're trying tostring me up for some horseshit "not solving" accusation that I get hit with in every game because the only measure of towniness in 2022 is how much bilge you vomit into the thread

but whatever, here's the thing - i genuinely don't believe rereading and re-evaluating are worthwhile anymore. i think they genuinely make my reads significantly worse as every time i have tried to do so. so in general from here on out i am trying to stick to my first impulse and make the most basic reads as i see what is happening. this does not lead to conventional eye-pleasing play where i dump tons of walls and get praised for "trying really hard" after losing the game, but i do not care. i am sick of that. i play the game on my own terms and if people won't read me on those terms, they can eat shit. it is not particularly hard for me to bullshit an essay as scum. i have done so before. the issue is that as town i care more about figuring out the truth, i can't just twist every pt into something AI. this game in and of itself is a huge slog and trying to backread gets me nothing. so i am just trying to play it forward and generate reads as things move along.


further, menalque went multiple weeks doing almost fuckall and faced essentially ~no pressure there, which is a pretty strong fucking sign he was getting protected. the problem is, the ISO from all the players in that slot is impressively fucking useless, and I get essentially nothing out of looking what other people said about menalque. I don't have a good way to describe this, please just go back and look at pooky/menalque. They were both essentially playing to leave as few associations as possible

koba's read on the pooky/mena/enchant slot is borderline nonsensical, the pivot from a scumread to a townread is never justified. the entire reaction to the claim of trying to claim they're being tied together is absurdly self-conscious, i don't think anyone thinks that way as town. the defense of enchant also is a big fat fucking nothing that avoids any qualitative assessment of his play (because it makes no fucking sense as coming from town), the whole thing is gish gallop attempt to overwhelm the thread and exhaust people so they give in rather than making any remotely coherent argument.

they are fundamentally

right

that my scumread on them is purely reactive but that is how the game goes sometimes - scum aren't obvious to you until they start pushing on you. that was the exact case with skitter in slaughter hour - i only really "caught" her because she tried to get me eliminated and it made no fucking sense. that's exactly what is happening with koba because they decided to go all in on trying to get me flipped today

[catboi]

anyway that's my fucking spiel i'm done engaging with koba because they are just going to try to twist shit as much as possible and it's a waste of time even though i can't resist snapping back

if you flip me today and the game does not actually end, do not let koba get away with this shit, do not listen to any fucking excuses, just fucking speedvote them immediately


(i do not have the slightest bit of confidence in leaving a read on the third, i'm not going to try)

[catboi]

(i am also annoyed because a month ago i spent an entire game getting assaulted by scum for 'not solving' and it's the exact same pattern of making completely fucking unreasonable demands and attacking people for not meeting them)

[Enchant]

anyway that's my fucking spiel i'm done engaging with koba because they are just going to try to twist shit as much as possible and it's a waste of time even though i can't resist snapping back

if you flip me today and the game does not actually end, do not let koba get away with this shit, do not listen to any fucking excuses, just fucking speedvote them immediately


(i do not have the slightest bit of confidence in leaving a read on the third, i'm not going to try)

Damn classic mafia speech.
Also i supposed DkKuba is first they should to fastvote? Why? DO you think i will dieeeeee after you at night?

Catboi starts to post links on games in hopes to prove something. He doesh't have real argumentation.

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm frankly almost at the point where I'm thinking it's not even worthwhile to resolve this 1v1 today again

cool

[Alyssa The Lamb]

this game is giving me a brain aneurysm

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I think the game is pretty close to making complete sense to me

just the thing is, I'm not so confident in any one side of this 1v1 to specifically want to push in that

problem is, I think the remaining two scum are in Skitter30/Datisi/Something_Smart and I'm not 100% sure on any one of them either

and I still think no kill today is not a great choice

wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Alyssa The Lamb]

my favorite part about this game is that I think it's not even viable to kill within my second PoE because I strongly doubt there will ever be enough support to make any of them work today

[Alyssa The Lamb]

oh right I was going to look at VCs again

what was I wanting to search for again, idr

[catboi]

anyway that's my fucking spiel i'm done engaging with koba because they are just going to try to twist shit as much as possible and it's a waste of time even though i can't resist snapping back

if you flip me today and the game does not actually end, do not let koba get away with this shit, do not listen to any fucking excuses, just fucking speedvote them immediately


(i do not have the slightest bit of confidence in leaving a read on the third, i'm not going to try)

Damn classic mafia speech.
Also i supposed DkKuba is first they should to fastvote? Why? DO you think i will dieeeeee after you at night?

Catboi starts to post links on games in hopes to prove something. He doesh't have real argumentation.

fuck off

[Alyssa The Lamb]

Alyssa The Lamb [3] – Mare, catboi, Datisi

Three unconfirmed slots, all of which stayed on this wagon for quite a few pages

there's no way in hell this is all town, this is exactly the type of wagon I expect scum to want to park on

Alyssa The Lamb [4] – Skitter30, Datisi,

Sleepless Assassin

, catboi
Sleepless Assassin [4] – Andante, Kaiji, Mare, Menalque

Virtually all the unconfirmed slots are on these two wagons

My POV, both wagonees are town. Even if you don't and assume I'm scum instead, it becomes a question of whether scum are more likely to bus or try to save their partner

P125

Sleepless Assassin [6] – Kaiji, Menalque, Andante, catboi, midwaybear, Faker
Alyssa The Lamb [4] - Sleepless Assassin, Mare, Skitter30, Datisi
midwaybear [3] – Alyssa The Lamb, InnocentVillager, SirCakez
Faker [1] - Something_Smart

Not Voting [0] –


EOD1

Sleepless Assassin

[8] – Kaiji, Menalque, Andante, catboi,

midwaybear

,

Faker

, Mare, Skitter30
Alyssa The Lamb [5] -

Sleepless Assassin

, Datisi,

InnocentVillager

,

SirCakez

, Something_Smart

midwaybear

[1] – Alyssa The Lamb

Not Voting [0] –

This is minorly +town for Skitter and +scum for Something_Smart

I don't think it's necessarily indicative that scum aren't all on the same wagon, but that assumption requires the NSG (Kaiji) slot to be town to work

[Alyssa The Lamb]

think I convinced myself that skitter is the town of the three

[Alyssa The Lamb]

if I'm wrong on any one slot, it's exactly Mare, the reason I have for townreading her is the weakest out of all of them

I'm trusting my process on Andante slot being town
The game makes more sense with NSG being town, and I was suspecting that she was town off the D1 stuff I found (and with the knowledge that her activity is virtually never AI in this case); I also don't think Kaiji needs to go this hard and in so many directions in this type of gamestate at all

The game makes a lot more sense with catboi being the third scum rather than Enchant; I'm actually suddenly very unsure that midwaybear dies as an outed doctor (that scum know is a doctor) if the scumteam were planning on the cop claim, and I think they have to plan the cop claim in order for it to work out the way it had with how Menalque played

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I'm comfortable with this solve now actually

Catboi + Datisi + Something_Smart feels right

[catboi]

why is enchant town

i don't care about finding a team that works

there is one vote today to find 1 scum

defend that slot's play on its own merits, no worldbuilding shit

[catboi]

i do not need colored votecounts and arbitrary conclusions

[Kaiji]

I understand you are good at scum and are playing better than most would in your position - but just because you are trying this hard to not get limmed won't make me find you towny. I wish you the best in your future scumgames but I have to cut this one short.

[Kaiji]

if I'm wrong on any one slot, it's exactly Mare, the reason I have for townreading her is the weakest out of all of them

I'm trusting my process on Andante slot being town
The game makes more sense with NSG being town, and I was suspecting that she was town off the D1 stuff I found (and with the knowledge that her activity is virtually never AI in this case); I also don't think Kaiji needs to go this hard and in so many directions in this type of gamestate at all

The game makes a lot more sense with catboi being the third scum rather than Enchant; I'm actually suddenly very unsure that midwaybear dies as an outed doctor (that scum know is a doctor) if the scumteam were planning on the cop claim, and I think they have to plan the cop claim in order for it to work out the way it had with how Menalque played

I kinda like this conclusion.
If we end up somehow mislimming enchant here this should be sheeped. I'll be strongly considering it myself. I disagree with SS but catboi/datisi feel right. Especially in a game state I feel scum are playing very well,

[Alyssa The Lamb]

why is enchant town

i don't care about finding a team that works

there is one vote today to find 1 scum

defend that slot's play on its own merits, no worldbuilding shit

i do not need colored votecounts and arbitrary conclusions

The play from the slot is congruent enough by itself with being a cop, and even if Kaiji did cherrypick a paper trail that he had laid out before, I don't think they would kill midwaybear too

[Alyssa The Lamb]

I forgot to remove the neutral face, oops

that was going to be a much more snarky post but I decided against it

[catboi]

why is enchant town

i don't care about finding a team that works

there is one vote today to find 1 scum

defend that slot's play on its own merits, no worldbuilding shit

i do not need colored votecounts and arbitrary conclusions

The play from the slot is congruent enough by itself with being a cop, and even if Kaiji did cherrypick a paper trail that he had laid out before, I don't think they would kill midwaybear too

please explain why

I

kill midwaybear with a possible cop in existence, because that is an outright gamethrow of a kill - further there's no reason for him to die if it's town tunneling town. was the exact same scenario in my newbie game that just ended where scum killed the person they were tunneling in the hopes people would paranoia onto each other instead - problem is logically if its a TvT deathtunnel scum have every reason to want to preserve that

further just because the play from the slot was low effort shit does not make it town PR play - can just as easily be fozen lurksack scum (and that was basically how menalque played the time i saw him as scum). the fact that enchant is

still

trying to argue for no elimination should raise a pretty big red flag

[skitter30]

Hi i'm like here but i'm getting on a plane soon so uh where should i vote

Pedit i dont think catboi takes the draft picks / night actions he would have had to as as scum