Mini Normal 2258 | Bunnies [Postgame]

[Frogsterking]

Isn't like "Informed goon" or whatever a common role in Normal setup creation? and he just lied about his alignment.

What would be the design justification for informing scum of a vig?

To give scum team more options with regards to making their fake claims more believable, making the true setup a little more difficult to guess for town. In line with this goal here:

X amount of curveballs is necessary, my mindset is that I've recently read complaints from TM about PP's (essentially normal) setup being easily guessable

If some amount of curveballs are desirable, ones that don't change optimal PR play at all but make the setup harder to guess are very desirable

Some Isis design thoughts, pulled from a review I did with her, if this is helpful @Datisi

To give scum team more options with regards to making their fake claims more believable, making the true setup a little more difficult to guess for town.

But like 90%+ of scum players would not claim backup vig there.

I don't have enough knowledge to deny or verify that claim, and I'm not making an argument that such a design decision is effective or ineffective, I'm making the argument that the design justification is to encourage scum players to make those kinds of plays by giving them information that might help make those plays more believable, which seems to be in line with the goals of the quote you pulled from Isis. I think making a scum an ascetic which Dats suggested is also in line with those goals. That's why I think it's an edge case, like in the 5%-10% range.

[Datisi]

I can hear him screaming how they were wrong about you sir and bemoaning it
How VP is screaming you’re scum

them*

also rtp has never misread me and they sure didn't start now

vp probably is scumreaing i'm scum, i'll give you that lol

[MathBlade]

I can hear him screaming how they were wrong about you sir and bemoaning it
How VP is screaming you’re scum

them*

also rtp has never misread me and they sure didn't start now

vp probably is scumreaing i'm scum, i'll give you that lol

Sorry them apologies

[Frogsterking]

Isn't like "Informed goon" or whatever a common role in Normal setup creation? and he just lied about his alignment.

What would be the design justification for informing scum of a vig?

To give scum team more options with regards to making their fake claims more believable, making the true setup a little more difficult to guess for town. In line with this goal here:

X amount of curveballs is necessary, my mindset is that I've recently read complaints from TM about PP's (essentially normal) setup being easily guessable

If some amount of curveballs are desirable, ones that don't change optimal PR play at all but make the setup harder to guess are very desirable

Some Isis design thoughts, pulled from a review I did with her, if this is helpful @Datisi

To give scum team more options with regards to making their fake claims more believable, making the true setup a little more difficult to guess for town.

But like 90%+ of scum players would not claim backup vig there.

I don't have enough knowledge to deny or verify that claim, and I'm not making an argument that such a design decision is effective or ineffective, I'm making the argument that the design justification is to encourage scum players to make those kinds of plays by giving them information that might help make those plays more believable, which seems to be in line with the goals of the quote you pulled from Isis. I think making a scum an ascetic which Dats suggested is also in line with those goals. That's why I think it's an edge case, like in the 5%-10% range.

Dats suggested commuter too, which might synergize more with being informed of a vig.

[Datisi]

s_s, my issue with that is that very recently i've had a game where scum did actually claim backup vigilante, and they had some roles that pretty much gave it away there is a vig in play

like, i don't think it's so out of this world that scum sees a jailkeeper or gunsmith or whatever and thinks there's a vig

besides, this is a50.

[Frogsterking]

Anyway should we quickhammer IV now?

[Frogsterking]

Anyway should we quickhammer IV now?

Is there any reason NOT to?

[MathBlade]

Anyway should we quickhammer IV now?

Is there any reason NOT to?

Yes a good chunk of the game hasn’t posted

[Datisi]

something about making sure everyone has said their peace, iv has a chance to claim, y'know boring shit like that

[Frogsterking]

Anyway should we quickhammer IV now?

Is there any reason NOT to?

Yes a good chunk of the game hasn’t posted

something about making sure everyone has said their peace, iv has a chance to claim, y'know boring shit like that

Is there any reason we CAN'T skip that stuff?

[Something_Smart]

Anyway should we quickhammer IV now?

do you just not want to actually play the game, or what?

[MathBlade]

Datisi and Frog is looking spicy

[Datisi]

"Town N1 Backup Vig"

mm, s_s, you say scum doesn't claim this because it likely doesn't get believed. does this role make sense as town? like, the only way this role isn't a vc/neap/gunsmith miller is if a vigilante gets yeeted day 1. that is very unlikely to happen. and this role can exist as a vc/neap/gunsmith miller regardless. so.

[Something_Smart]

the only way this role isn't a vc/neap/gunsmith miller is if a vigilante gets yeeted day 1

killed night 1, you mean?

[Frogsterking]

VOTE: innocentvillager

e-1

Town:
Dats, Ari, SS, House, Frog
Edge Case:
Math
Scum:
Andres, IV

[Something_Smart]

UNVOTE:

[Datisi]

the only way this role isn't a vc/neap/gunsmith miller is if a vigilante gets yeeted day 1

killed night 1, you mean?

no. he claimed "town n1 backup vig". that is, a vigilante that can only shoot on n1, if a vigilante has previously died, no?

[Datisi]

or is that a backup that only inherits the vigilante role if a vigilante dies on n1?

that's horrible design though, punishing scum for sniping a power role on n1.

[Something_Smart]

@MathBlade please clarify how your role works

[MathBlade]

My role requires a vig to have died on D1 to function. Then can N1 vig.
I asked the mod the same question on replacing in.

[MathBlade]

It does not necessitate a vig to have existed just that if one did and was elimmed D1 then I would be a vig.
The N1 is on the backup not the vig

[MathBlade]

or is that a backup that only inherits the vigilante role if a vigilante dies on n1?

that's horrible design though, punishing scum for sniping a power role on n1.

Kinda been the trend and partially why I took a break.

[Something_Smart]

My role requires a vig to have died on D1 to function. Then can N1 vig.

That, uh, sounds like a backup N1 vig, but I guess maybe it isn't. Maybe "N1 backup vig" can be interpreted as either.

[MathBlade]

Btw complaining about things being unbalanced for scum is pretty scummy.

I have explained it as best I can without copying my rolePM.
I am named Townie from this point forward.

[Something_Smart]

Well, now I'm assuming there's a gunsmith in the game. Regardless, if there is a roleblocker, it probably isn't Math, so we can cross that bridge if we come to it.