Mini Normal 2258 | Bunnies [Postgame]

[Aristeia]

I didn't derail your push because your push is literally a trainwreck.

[Frogsterking]

This post is ALL relevant to the current game state and a direct continuation of my issues with Datisi's slot and my subsequent ongoing push which began when prompted in 3339.

The only game previously you were on an opposing alignment of Datisi you lost, and you seemed pretty pleased with the result.

I was literally the only scum player trying to win in that game. one scum player lolbussed and the other scum player disappeared so fuck off with your gamethrowing bullshit.

intentionally gamethrowing.

There is a report function for gamethrowing behavior that you can press and send to Site Administration if you actually believe this horseshit

I put effort into supplying you with links that cast reasonable doubt this behavior is AI for me.

You didn't link a single fucking example of you quickhammering as town in any game ever.

The closest you could come up with was you hammering in a game EIGHTEEN FUCKING DAYS AFTER DAY START AND AFTER EVERYONE HAD DISCUSSED THE ELIM FOR LITERALLY WEEKS.

YOU HAMMERED SOMEONE BEFORE ONE DAY WAS EVEN OVER.

IT IS NOT THE SAME FUCKING THING

These posts come from Ari after she fails to chainsaw for Datisi against my push and derail the thread from the line of discussion SHE initiated in 3339. She is now demonstrating this to be a surface level pretense of sorting Datisi's slot and my own, and that's not all she is revealing.

Like Datisi did in response to my case in 3340, Ari is now

LYING

or

"SIMPLY FORGETTING"

very recent events of D3 with claims which are EASILY falsifiable. Below is the exchange Ari is excluding from 3421:

I skimmed the VCs for the linked game and I don't see you quick-hammering any town players - the only hammer vote you cast during the game is on a mafia player.

In the game I linked, it was during limlo even that I put at least one townside player at e-1, multiple times. In one case I did it to clear them as a scumteam with another player who was posting. I don't remember the other reasons.

This is completely different from quickhammering a town player and then trying to quick-lim another player before he gets a chance to vote.

I guess you do have a point in that it shows you are incredibly impulsive and willing to make plays that are just not very good for townside in terms of benefiting town.

ok um have you quickhammered anyone before as town? doesn't have to be scum I just want to see how you approached it.

Frogster I do want to know why you decided to try to quick-lim IV before he got a chance to post today.

ADHD and general anxiety disorder. The anxiety creates an illusion of urgency and the ADHD fosters it with impulsivity. It's NAI.

It's difficult to stop, but it can be done, especially now that I did it twice and I know it's a pattern, and I don't want to do it again.

Do you have any examples of completed town games where you pull of multiple quick hammers in a row on townside players?

It is difficult for me to take this at face value when the underlying behavior is extremely ++scum ev.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... start=1050

In this game.

I just remembered too when I put IV at e-1 in this game I was expecting SS to unvote and I thought SS was town but I wasn't sure yet and I wanted to see what they would do. I also scumread IV at the time.

In the game I linked, it was during limlo even that I put at least one townside player at e-1, multiple times. In one case I did it to clear them as a scumteam with another player who was posting. I don't remember the other reasons.

I skimmed the VCs for the linked game and I don't see you quick-hammering any town players - the only hammer vote you cast during the game is on a mafia player.

I mean obviously my hope for this game was to hammer mafia as well?

The moderator of the game I linked to you said that what I was doing was risky. I will find them saying that.

I skimmed the VCs for the linked game and I don't see you quick-hammering any town players - the only hammer vote you cast during the game is on a mafia player.

In the game I linked, it was during limlo even that I put at least one townside player at e-1, multiple times. In one case I did it to clear them as a scumteam with another player who was posting. I don't remember the other reasons.

This is completely different from quickhammering a town player and then trying to quick-lim another player before he gets a chance to vote.

I guess you do have a point in that it shows you are incredibly impulsive and willing to make plays that are just not very good for townside in terms of benefiting town.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 0&start=75

This is what I was looking for, on page 4.

IDK about any quick hammers specifically then, I'm not sure if I had many opportunities, but I'll check I guess.

This ENTIRE part of D3 which just happened, while Ari was allegedly attempting to sort my slot, Ari has "simply forgot" about in 3421.

Below is the part that Ari is referring to in 3421, the only part of the exchange which Ari didn't LIE about or "simply forget" :

This is the closest I can find to a "quickhammer" on town: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... 3#p3351243

The votecount at 632.

...

the day started on Jul 28th and you hammered on Aug 16th, two days before deadline after Inhimshallibe posted final words and other people said it was ok to hammer.

That's not a quick hammer at all. I want to stop tunneling on you I am going to read other things after work.

Ari is ignoring my attempts to show her my actions were NAI because she isn't legitimately attempting to sort my slot, and she's lying or "simply forgetting" information that is convenient to her because she isn't being called out by sufficient townies on her scummy posts.

________________

For Math:

Spoiler:

Thanks! I think we see the same if Frog is scum. Not sure we agree if Frog is town but then I’d be reading overnight anyway.

I put effort into supplying you with links that cast reasonable doubt this behavior is AI for me.

You didn't link a single fucking example of you quickhammering as town in any game ever.

The closest you could come up with was you hammering in a game EIGHTEEN FUCKING DAYS AFTER DAY START AND AFTER EVERYONE HAD DISCUSSED THE ELIM FOR LITERALLY WEEKS.

YOU HAMMERED SOMEONE BEFORE ONE DAY WAS EVEN OVER.

IT IS NOT THE SAME FUCKING THING

Ari I can tell you’re frustrated.

I think it might be best if you stepped away a bit.

A good chunk of the game agrees Frogger needs to be eliminated.

I just finished a 12 hour shift.

I saw Andres posted and is back from VLA and I wanted to give IV a chance to catch up as well. If my clock math is correct then IV hits 48 hours of no post then I will vote and make Frog e-1 so then IV can either respond overnight or get replaced.

Having conf town alive and if we need a replace to catch up is good.

Just happened to check at the right time.

Sorry I should have added /j on that.

Any who heading to bed hopefully IV responds.

This also gives Frogger if town time for one last post.

Math, if you haven't noticed,

I'M NOT DEAD YET AND I'M PUSHING SCUM.

You're welcome to revisit the earlier work you started in this game which lead you to believe scum were

early

onwagon D1, including the content that lead you to your D2 push against Ari, and rewrite it in a way that THE OTHER PLAYERS IN OUR TOWN CAN UNDERSTAND. The ideas you came up after initially entering the game WERE YOUR ONLY IDEAS THAT WERE ACTUALLY GOOD AND YOU'VE COMPLETELY ABANDONED THEM.

If you aren't interested in following through on your ideas that actually contributed to scum hunting and haven't been proven wrong yet, at least stay out of my way while I follow through on mine.

I just finished a 12 hour shift.

I saw Andres posted and is back from VLA and I wanted to give IV a chance to catch up as well. If my clock math is correct then IV hits 48 hours of no post then I will vote and make Frog e-1 so then IV can either respond overnight or get replaced.

Having conf town alive and if we need a replace to catch up is good.

Math.

You're getting in the way of my push on scum..again. I have a lot of content to post over the next couple of hours. Stop sucking off Ari.

Please do not use language like sucking off. You can make your point without this please. This is harmful to me.

I am not sucking off her, I just have not been convinced by tons of tiny posts. You and Ari and You and House are still my top solves.

If you want others to care take time to make a well crafted convincing post rather than rapid fire

I will be devoting what little time I have over the weekend to getting an elim done.


It’s an extremely high threshold,

BOO HOO

You're terrible attempts to lead the Town and constant self-aggrandizing are harmful to me, and you can play the game in a way that DOESN'T prevent your alignment from winning it.

Notice how from here on out I'm going to restrain myself in a show of good faith, and try not to swear or be overly insulting or say the thing you mentioned is harmful for you. I'm doing this in a show of good faith Math, because I'm expecting you to listen and respect my requests. IF YOU DON'T LISTEN TO ME AND RESPECT MY REQUESTS I WILL IN TURN NOT LISTEN TO YOU AND RESPECT YOUR REQUESTS.

You go V/La this weekend if you have "little time", I don't care about your scheduled townie executions. I told you stay out of my way while I push scum for a reason, SS told you you are one of the players giving him a headache for a reason, House is tunneling you for a reason: you don't know which of your ideas are good and which bad, and your attempts to assume a leadership position are getting in the way of the other Townies attempts to not only win the game, but even play the game.

If you want me to respect your wishes and oblige with your requests I will, in fact, I would very much like to work together, win, and have a good experience.

But in order for that to happen, you need to also respect MY wishes and requests Math, because you are currently making the game very difficult for me to play on both a mechanical and emotional level, AND I'M PRETTY SURE WE'RE ON THE SAME TEAM.

Here are the things YOU'RE doing that are making the game difficult for me to play (which is affecting you as well, because we're both trying to help Town win,) and causing emotional harm and personal offense to me:

IF YOU WANT TO HELP SOLVE THE GAME, GO BACK TO THE ONLY THING YOU HAVE SHOWN TO BE GOOD AT AS TOWN, VCA.

STOP GETTING IN THE WAY OF MY ATTEMPT TO PUSH THE SCUM TEAM, STOP BOASTING TO ME AND THE OTHER TOWNIES ABOUT YOUR CURRENT PROCESS AND READS: THEY SUCK.

STOP EXPRESSING INTENT TO SHEEP THE SCUM TEAM ONTO MY WAGON. STOP DISMISSING MY CASES AGAINST THE SCUM, AND STOP SHUTTING DOWN MY ATTEMPTS TO SCUM HUNT. IF YOU REALLY THINK I'M SCUM AFTER I FINISH CASING THEM, WHICH WILL TAKE AT LEAST FOUR DAYS, THEN FINE, VOTE ME.

BUT DON'T CUT ME OFF WHILE I'M TRYING TO ORGANIZE THE TOWNIES AND QUESTIONING AND CASING THE SCUM TEAM. IF YOU REALLY DON'T HAVE TIME THIS WEEKEND GO V/LA. YOUR "BUSY SCHEDULE" HAS NO IMPACT ON THE BEST COURSE OF ACTION FOR THIS GAME.

I. DON'T. CARE. GO V/LA AND DEAL WITH YOUR "BUSY WEEKEND."

WHEN YOU COME BACK THE GAME WILL BE BETTER OFF THAN WHEN YOU LEFT IT.

[Frogsterking]

I didn't derail your push because your push is literally a trainwreck.

Okay Ari,

why?

Show why my push is "literally a trainwreck" without strawmanning my arguments, making easily falsifiable claims about recent events of D3 ("simply forgetting"), making easily falsifiable claims about your self-meta, attempting to be evasive and derail the discussion, and then running away and crying like Datisi eventually did in response to 3340.

[Aristeia]

I am responding to your allegations that I am a gamethrower. That is not derailing your "push".

[Aristeia]

If you don't want to piss me off you should probably not insult me. If you want to make a case for me being mafia, feel free to do so.

[Frogsterking]

Ari, should you choose to sit here and scum freeze while you wait for Datisi to wake up in about 30 minutes, I'm going to begin elaborating my case on YOU, which hasn't even been posted yet. The issues I raised earlier that broke your partner were simply the things I pointed out relevant to Datisi--which again--YOU asked me about in 3339.

You are already off to a similar start as Datisi was yesterday:

I didn't derail your push because your push is literally a trainwreck.

I'm continuing my push I started against Datisi in 3339, but Ari's attempts to save him and derail the push starting in 3389 make me convinced she is the scum partner

Save him from what? The boredom of talking to you?

I am responding to your allegations that I am a gamethrower. That is not derailing your "push".

[/quote]

If you don't want to piss me off you should probably not insult me. If you want to make a case for me being mafia, feel free to do so.

making claims that my accusations are "literally a trainwreck", being sarcastic and dismissive, making baseless claims that you have addressed any of the points I've raised in any way. Let's see how long it takes you to run away and cry like Datisi from mean scary town spewing frog.

[Aristeia]

You're not scary to me. You are a sad clown.

[MathBlade]

House please ignore Math's awful reads in this game and attempts to lead, Math has no idea what he's doing and I've caught both scum.

Just so we're clear... you think both scum feel threatened enough at this point in the game to be on a wagon together pushing you?

idk bro.

House please ignore Math's awful reads in this game and attempts to lead, Math has no idea what he's doing and I've caught both scum.

You mean I'm not supposed to sheep my hardest scumread?

Well damn.

I mean I think he's just a Village Idiot, I don't scumread him, but as long as we both agree his D3 plan is terrible, we can still get a scum frag today.

PEdit:

No I think the opposite, I think they feel so unthreatened they think they can BW whoever starts pushing on them and Town won't notice. That's why Datisi telegraphed his read flip on you, he isn't being pushed and he feels confident enough to do whatever is most convenient without explaining any of his actions.

Let me clarify: Datisi

hasn't

been pushed until I started on him in 3340, and he spewed BS after BS.

Insomnia sucks.

You feel like you’re trying to make Datisi stick vs believing it.

Earlier you said I pushed Datisi, now you’re saying you’re the only one who did.

Like please gather your thoughts and consolidate if you’re town.

[Aristeia]

I can't wait to see you make a case for why you think I am mafia after just a few hours ago you thought I was a "super townie game throwing doorknob" but sure, go for it.

[MathBlade]

I can't wait to see you make a case for why you think I am mafia after just a few hours ago you thought I was a "super townie game throwing doorknob" but sure, go for it.

It feels like Frogger is putting on a show. No idea why though.

[Aristeia]

I think he knows he is going to get flipped today so he has decided to do some comically bad pushes to make it look like awful distancing so after he dies people think me/datisi are mafia or w/e.

[MathBlade]

I think he knows he is going to get flipped today so he has decided to do some comically bad pushes to make it look like awful distancing so after he dies people think me/datisi are mafia or w/e.

Possibly. Or he didn’t expect to be called out.
Or House is trying to teach him skills
Or just desperate ploy.

It could also be a Townie feeling so lost but the more Frog posts he convinces me it’s not the case.
Just gotta get into his head to see why Frog is being dramatic here

[Frogsterking]

House tl;dr

Ari and Datisi are scummy scum slots, they keep defending each other and making BS excuses, you're in scums pocket, I have lots of notes and am out to get their slots hammered.

"Ari" is an undisclosed secret gimmick alt of a very skilled and experienced scum player, who seems to have an even wider scum range than scum!tisi, and up to this point in the game is still well within their scum range.

"Ari" has systematically derailed the thread discussion when it turns against her or Datisi, is currently sheeping the LHF slot andres against me alongside Datisi, has chainsawed my push against Datisi without addressing any of the issues I raised with Datisi's slot, has been evasive and cagey about her reads, shown no believable read progression on my slot, Math/a50s slot or andres slot, inserted herself into the setup speculation and mech discussion so she could appear townie while shading innocentvillager, misrepresented the mislim of D2 as primarily coming from House, Math and Frog, "simply forgetting" that ARI AND DATISI started the bandwagon as well as the meta speculation while skitter was V/la that skitter was not town, is misrepresenting the thread bloat and noise of D3 as Ari and Datisi NOT primarily responsible (shading Math, House and I in the process), inserted herself into the meta speculation so she could misrepresent her scum range by concealing her real meta behind her gimmick alt and appearing townie in the process.

ALL of these claims are easily verifiable from looking at even just the latter half of her D3 iso. I will start posting the results of my notes on Ari's slot to backup my claims above. Some of the claims I've made have over a dozen posts from D3 Ari demonstrating the scummy behavior.

Ari has night killed the main scumhunting dayplayers who threatened her game, RTP and VP, and Ari has manipulated, shaded, pocketed and bandwagoned all of her secondary scumhunting threats by day: skitter (who ARI AND DATISI bandwagoned, enabling her quicklim to be possible, and were mysteriously absent when skitter was begging for Ari to meta clear her), Math who has FoSed Ari D2 and D3 who can be placated because nobody can understand him or desires to listen to him, and now during D3 after my FoS on Datisi, she has been shading, bandwagoning me and my discussion attempts.

I have notes on Ari demonstrating TMI in multiple instances which I can backup with links concretely verifying my claim, which I will begin posting now.

[Frogsterking]

MATH YOU DIDN'T READ THE PART I WROTE FOR YOU IN 3451, SHUT THE FUCK UP UNTIL YOU HAVE

[Aristeia]

wow I went from clueless loveblinded doorknob moron into evil cunning scum mastermind pretty fast when I thought your case on Dats sucked

pretty crazy stuff.

[Aristeia]

UNVOTE: skitter

We can at least wait until Dats and Ari can look over her play here and get a reaction from Andres, we don't need blood tonight for any reason besides impatience.

VOTE: skitter

I did it, rip the tiger

[MathBlade]

MATH YOU DIDN'T READ THE PART I WROTE FOR YOU IN 3451, SHUT THE FUCK UP UNTIL YOU HAVE

I read what you said.
You said for me to do VCA.
It’s been said several times that points to you for D2.

You asked me to not shut you up.
I am not.
I am trying to get you to present your cases in a clear and convincing manner if you’re town.
You seem more interested in anger than a conversation.

Until you talk with me civilly I have no interest in interacting with you and will just go to bed and wake up in the AM and vote you if it’s more of this.

[Aristeia]

were mysteriously absent when skitter was begging for Ari to meta clear her),

I guess I was just in your head making you press the hammer button with my scum mastermind psychic powers.

[Aristeia]

imagine blaming me for being offline for a few hours while you quickhammered her. I should instead be always online in case that happens right? Otherwise I would be "mysteriously absent"

[MathBlade]

I find it mostly bluster.

It does nothing to convince me Frog is town or I should care.

I still think Ari/House + Frog is the solution.

I will vote Frogger in the Am.

[Datisi]

heyy i just noticed something funny

Ari, should you choose to sit here and scum freeze

while you wait for Datisi to wake up in about 30 minutes

, I'm going to begin elaborating my case on YOU

frogs is very much aware of my sleep schedule, it seems. (he was off by some half an hour, but hey, pretty close.)

who ARI AND DATISI bandwagoned, enabling her quicklim to be possible,

and were mysteriously absent when skitter was begging for Ari to meta clear her

hmm...

Asks ss ari or dats, they have experience with scum-me, outworlder does not

this post happened at 5:04am CET.

VOTE: skitter

I did it, rip the tiger

frogs hammered at 5:25am CET.

while frogs already admitted he knows my sleep schedule, here he is giving me shit for not being awake for these 20 minutes at 5am, a time i am never awake.

interesting.

[Datisi]

math, how did you go from thinking i am 100% a scumfuck to not even including me in solves?

[MathBlade]

math, how did you go from thinking i am 100% a scumfuck to not even including me in solves?

It was more a gradual progression.
I started trying to figure out who your buddy would be but then realized no matter how I sliced it I was trying to force a round peg in a square hole so either I had a major key element in the game state wrong or you wrong.

So I issued a challenge to you/Ari/House to take charge since you all townread each other.

No one really did which told me that either they weren’t comfortable in their reads or scum without a planned narrative/agenda yet. Everyone wanted Frog and Andres which means likely only one of them was scum.

Then the rest from there.

[Aristeia]

Dats,

I'm watching the last episode of OreGairu and it's sooo good.

Hope you have a great Saturday <3

[MathBlade]

Only one or none of them*