Large Normal 238 | Weiqi, Baduk, Go | Endgame

[Mizzytastic]

Professional ranks are a far older system with a lot of history. Professional ranks are also dan ranks, starting at one and going to nine, but they don't correspond to amateur rank, where the strongest amateur dan is often considered around professional level. Professional ranks represent career achievement and while I've seen an estimate of about a 3 handicap difference between the strongest and weakest pros, no pro would accept handicap.

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Official Votecount 5.2

Frogsterking (2): Scorpious, April Ludgate

[E-4]

April Ludgate (2): MathBlade, Save The Dragons

[E-4]

Save The Dragons (1): Galron
fireisredsir (1): Frogsterking

Not Voting (5): DeasVail, fireisredsir, Eyes without a face, tenebrousluminary, Cape90

With 11 players alive, it takes 6 votes to achieve an elimination.

Day 5 will end in (expired on 2022-04-03 05:45:00).

click here for joined mod iso.

[tenebrousluminary]

fire is town. I am suspicious of everyone who fails to recognize this.

[fireisredsir]

math ive had plenty of paranoia over April this game. 2 game days ago i was feeling like it was more likely they were maf. ive gone back and forth, but right now i don't see any reason to think they're maf, based on the way they're playing and the way that titus played. the same way that titus' play made me feel it was most likely that vp was town. and even though they've been wrong with some reads, I think that they're p valuable to work together with and solve with

[fireisredsir]

I'll need someone to convince me on Frogster? I'll have another read through, but I'd feel nervous eliminating there. The all-over-the-place-ness of their stances and posts seems more "lost townie" to me than scum-motivated. And given the gamestate up until the titus elim, "lost townie" seems pretty believable. I may be falling for it, but I'm not as convinced by Frogster being scum.

im not 100% confident on it, and i think lately there is a bit of those vibes, but looking back on their ISO it doesn't look like town, especially for frog. there's a pretty major lack of attempting to solve through the early and mid game, not much of the trademark overexitedness and overconfidence and just... effort that is trademark of town frog. he's been pushing town the whole game and there were literally zero attempts to sort datisi (despite a few mentions of "i still need to sort this slot", no questions or reads or thoughts given) until titus replaced in, then you have 4029 and 4042 which are pretty weak, 4836, and then after that he has at least a few engagements with titus, then the wild theory of her being SK, but once that calms down he doesn't even mention her again until after the flip (although he didn't post at all for like 4 days in there)

it's also a poe sort for me, there's not many people left that I think could be scum

[tenebrousluminary]

some people not mentioned in your list haven't even posted?? excuse me for asking i guess

class starting back again, cheers

I don't like the way Datisi focused on nitpicking rather than the substance of Nero Cain's argument.

have you decided you're just gonna mindlessly tunnel every post i make this game? i logged in during my break, saw that nero was supposedly townreading people that hadn't posted, i asked him about it. do you think "nitpicking" that makes me scummy?

I would like to know how you came up with this "mindless" idea. I have been quite clear about why I think the posts of yours I have criticized are scummy to me. It has not been mindless at all.

So long as you continue to make such posts, I will continue to suspect you, yes. Is being scumread so alien to you as to be upsetting?

because it seems like you've decided you're gonna scumread me and are forcing my posts into a scum mindset, as opposed to actually reading them and coming to alignment-indicative conclusions.

and i find it dubious at best that you would consider a post like that scummy, considering its context. i'm not upset, i'm just calling bs out when i see it.

like, this is what i mean when i say specifically looking for scum motivation in my posts. it feels like latching on to whatever i say in order to try to force a contradiction out. do i seem concerned? why wouldn't i dismiss it by saying something about it?

To me, it seems like Yeet's push made you sweat. Resorting to discrediting it as a meme rather than either ignoring it because of not being concerned

or confronting the substance

, to me is the action of mafia. One could call it "dismissive." I could be wrong, of course.

you mean like when i tried to question him about what gives him the jitters and he latched onto the fact i said "good vote" as opposed to actually responding to my questioning? and how the entirety of his push just kept being egging me on without any substantive elaboration? gee, i wonder why i started thinking of the push as a meme. no idea why.

Still think I'm partnered with this?

ackchually before i go

ok? does that make me scum? if no, why are we having this conversation? if yes, why aren't you voting me?

I think you made a bad initial vote and that you're trying to justify it under pressure but cant. And i now am!

VOTE: skitter

(1) what pressure
(2) you've seen me so many times make early votes that had more confidence than justified to get the game going and see the reactions to it

Pedit @dats me questioning you abt your vote. The more i ask you abt it the more i feel like there was no initial reasoning and you're trying ti back-justify it

And my issue is that you presented it as a scumread and the reasoning you gave was somewhat empty

And now you're saying it was more of a reaction vote? Why is my reaction scummy?

do you expect there to be some super strong case / reasoning from me on page 2-4, whatever it is? (when i'm not playing with ico, that is ) like, A Thing from tenebro pinged me, i decided to vote him for it, both to show that i got bad pings from his slot, and to see if any interesting things happen as a result from it. i do this *checks notes* all the fucking time as both alignments. which is something that you should know, and the fact that you're giving me shit for having an "empty" vote early on is, like, not a good look.

like, what's your idea here? that scum!me panicked, made a random vote that i had no idea how to justify because i thought i wouldn't get asked about it?? then when, surprise, did get asked about it, i only then started thinking about a justification?? like you know better than this...

- this in some ways reads like an OmGUS-y reaction to them voting you a few posts prior
- i still disagree with you that his vote was indicative of a 'scummy lack of boldness' and not wanting to stand out when you hadnt had much pressure at the time
- i obviously do not expect a super strong case on p4, and i would habe been fine if you had just said it was A Ping, but the reasoning you're giving doesnt make sense to me as something you actually thought at the time
- you seem to be getting kinda testy / sensitive that i'm pursuing this line of questioning ...

- just because i voted them after they voted me doesn't mean it was omgus... like you can claim it is you want, and i can't prove it wasn't because i can't prove what i was thinking, but like; even if it were omgus, that is scummy why exactly? like you don't get to make such blanket statements about me

- i was the person with the most pressure at the time (and before someone starts crying how this is a contradiction because i called yeet's push a meme - just because it was the most pressure doesn't mean it was actually a lot of it), and okay.

- ok, what is the difference between me just saying it was a ping and me actually explaining the thought process behind the ping? also, what about "there's a person continuously attacking me, and then there's a person who jumps into the game, says one throwaway line on why i'm scummy and votes me, and the latter is more likely to be scum trying to fit in and attack a popular target, but also make it seem like there was Original Thought Process behind their attack" doesn't make sense?

- yeah no shit i'm getting testy. same question at the first point: why is that scummy? did i miss some new towntisi meta where i as town don't get annoyed at garbage pushes at me?

there's a person who jumps into the game, says one throwaway line on why i'm scummy and votes me, and the latter is more likely to be scum trying to fit in and attack a popular target, but also make it seem like there was Original Thought Process behind their attack"

Because i think you were overestimating how much of a target you were at the time, and how likely scum are to be trying to 'fit in' there by voting you, and i dont know why that universe was more likely than them being town and just not liking one of your posts

And yeah i think you getting this annoyed is more indicative of scum-you, see: recent open wherein you became conciliatory (i.e. vs testy) when you got scumread

and again, why are you assuming that this is supposed to be like, lockscum pack it up boys case

ajkndjbfdkjf

like, how i imagine town enters the game where they have a scumread on a person that is currently being pressured. they will either (a) quietly vote the person to add pressure and say minimal stuff about them, or (b) add a decent amount of content (page-appropriate ofc) onto their push. the fact that he did something *in between* is markers of a scum mindset imo - it shows that he doesn't want to take too much responsibility for pushing me if i happen to flip (so he can't do (b)), but also doesn't wanna seem like scum who's braindead sheeping someone (so he can't do (a))

like OBVIOUSLY this isn't super strong but it's a start. and i see no reason why not to vote there and explore that start. like do you think i'm not aware that reasoning is not very strong??

and after googling both conciliatory and testy... you sure? i'm pretty sure i started voting you there pretty early on after you did some nonsense push on me

There's a lot of interaction with skitter in here. Many of Datisi's targets are flipped town at this point, so if there was any slot he interacted with heavily which could be a partner, I think this is a reasonably likely one. There are parts of this interaction that read as genuine frustration from Datisi, which would suggest not being partnered with skitter, but I am only reading his side of it right now. There are bits I could see as potential bussing, too. Plus, there is a third option, which is that traitor-skitter is distancing from Datisi and he doesn't know it. I think this last might sound the most likely to me right now, but this could be a useful place to analyze for someone who knows Datisi and skitter well or is generally good at associative tells. Would love to get some input on this.

I could still see it as partnered in part because Datisi eventually comes around to a townread on skitter and even chainsaws for her later.

dats tell me you're town again? : )

i'm town, and i will do all that i can to protect this town and you : >

Ari is another slot that I could imagine Datisi being scum with. This interaction could easily be fake, but there's more interesting stuff coming.

So Datisi makes no attempt to pressure my slot even though he admits it's scummy, and didn't attempt to parse even further when prompted by Nero. No hot takes and no solves, just unproductive questions thus far.

this is like, one of those times where i want to ask - what do you expect me to pressure you about? your slot is scummy because you dropped into the game, made a pretty much meme push on me, threw weak questions at ari, and left when she voted you. there is nothing to parse there, you and i both know that you're a better scum player than that, so it's not like i can actually draw a "well he's scum completely fucking up the game, gg" conclusion from that. and the only possible pressure i can put on you is general "what are your reads", which like. i find more value in seeing what you come up with yourself than what you come up with if i'm yelling at you about it.

Datisi's entire push on monkey is a chainsaw for Ari.

If Datisi's replies in a satisfactory manner, I'm switching my vote to VP.

VOTE: nordom

gee, i wonder where i saw this kinda reasoning before

last two games i saw a post like this, it came from scum both times

(i'm not yet certain if i wanna end up on nordom, but this feels fitting to change now, both as a scumread on nordom and as a not-quite-scumread-anymore on skitter)

I don't think I spotted a compelling trajectory to come off scumreading skitter.

Wu was the pressure push and Monkey was just the idle comment because he was a popular choice at the time.

i made one (1) post on wu, AFTER being asked my opinion. and i did not call monkey scum, quite the opposite, i said i don't think those weird posts make him scum. all while pushing skitter and tenebro, who i was first on.

can you acknowledge the above, and then tell me whether you still think i was making "lazy convenient reads on wu and monkey"?

I think it was more than once that I saw Datisi brag about being first on me and skitter, which would be an odd thing to do if skitter and I are both town.

as an escape route. that landed her into more pressure.

Yeah. Just because she thought it would work doesn’t mean it would.

not doing what the conftown player tells you to do and instead being contrarian to them lands you into pressure? wow what a surprise, i'm sure she'd had no idea that would be the end result

Part of the aggressive Ari defense series. Why is he townreading Ari, again?

this makes me think, did skitter's wagon go up at like, any point other than last night? because it seems to me that nero had been arguing with her for a longer time, but the wagon only taking off now while she's vla feels like it should be indicative of *something*

So I think very much that Ari was being contrarian to Math because of the b a g g a g e. Personally, i think it would support the claim that it's non-ai. But it doesn't explain her belligerence towards me. It seems to me that it was a blanket strategy to anyone who she thinks she can push around. But saying that, i wonder what datisi thinks about ari's contrarianism now that it's been given full context.

i was very much present in the game where the math/ari shitfight took place, so i was aware of the context at the time. but it doesn't really change my view on her behaviour much? like, ari saw what happened last game, how math started tunnelling her and how much effort it took just to salvage the game in final 6 when math was dead set on voting out ari. so i think it's still fair to conclude that ari wouldn't purposefully be getting on his bad side as scum. the baggage point is... i dunno, if it's true that the whole thing was NAI and that ari was acting like that solely because of an outside grudge, then i kinda lose a bit of respect for her, but i'm really not sure it's the case.

The two-for-one skitter and Ari defense in one easy post. I think scum would be more aware of their partner's VLA than some random person's. Also, I feel that the statement "skitter's wagon taking off while she's vla feels indicative of something" is phrased in a seed-planty way. It's obvious what conclusion Datisi wants the reader to come to, that scum are taking advantage of the situation, so why not say so rather than try to convince the reader this is their own idea?

this makes me think, did skitter's wagon go up at like, any point other than last night?

I think some people had mentioned Skitter being scum most notably Math and Fire for not doing her "ping" thing.

Can you link me a game or 2 that you played in where there was a hood?

thanks, i'll check that out.

normal games that i've played in that had a hood are:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=80974 - 9p, town/town
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=82613 - 9p, town/scum
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=83045 - 9p, town/town
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=84455 - 13p, town/town
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?t=84322 - 12p, town/scum/scum

and one game which had a scum/scum hood of a scum and a traitor that i'm not really counting since it wasn't a hood in the usual sense.

so, yeah. i'm really not buying the notion that "there has to be scum in hood because *radio static*".

I must admit this puts a hole in my theory that the neighborhood could possibly be scum-free. Incidentally, what is Cape's read on Galron, since we know Cape was using the neighborhood last night, allegedly?

skitter is really good as town, yeah. the thing i'm thinking of right now is what i commented earlier, i find it weird that there was an actual wagon happening on her seemingly right after she went for a few-day-vla.

Datisi there are 3 people on skitter's "wagon" and two of these people are close to confirmed town.

i am in fact aware of that (though there were more people on there previously)

it does not refute my point that it's odd how her wagon took off only once she went v/la and how it's much easier for scum to vote her once she's away. and how your progression on skitter is less than stellar.

More chainsaw for skitter. It's almost so much it makes me think it could be TMI that the skitter pushes are wrong rather than partnered.

std, is there a reason why you feel so... backseat this game?

Just wanted to note there is an incredibly weak Dragons suspicion throughout this iso that Datisi never does anything about, and in fact he even goes after Scorp among the lurkers despite having Dragons as his #3 suspicion or so consistently. Looks partnery to me.

i wonder if the fact that fua is attempting to push skitter while ignoring me (while the two of us are doing almost the same thing) has anything to do with the fact that skitter is more likely to be yeeted and has more supporters than i do...

More chainsaw for skitter. He's awfully invested in this for someone who was recently scumreading her.

Datisi, what do you think of cape?

was townie early then fell off

eod play was obviously not great but that's a very shallow answer

i will provide a fuller answer in the next 36-48 business hours, really need my vla this week >_>

Not much in here that contradicts fire's Titus/Cape theory.

ok, my bitch ass laptop decided to not connect to the internet so phoneskimming time

looking at scorp's iso in isolation (lol), definitely a scum contender. this dude has done jack shit all game. i think the tell i made on him on d1, that he's not even TRYING to appear townie, is valid, but not insanely so as he was aware that refuge in audacity is a possible defense.

i can def see scorp being scum *if* the rest of his team in a pretty good position. because i think scum is more likely to be lazy if the game seems to be going fine, or if it seems like their partners have it together. (thought goes to umlaut in that one mini normal where he started being lazy when mathblade replaced into his team)

as said, if he'd scum, i think we're lowkey fucked since that prob means there's some deepwolves or powerwolves or whatever. i think nero is a strong contender should scorp flip red; other than fitting with my bullshit gamestate reads, i think he also tried to make an eyes wagon a thing when math was trying to wagon scorp?

also, the fact that (1) there is absolutely nothing townie about scorp (2) there's still practically no wagon on him despite that and despite a MASON pushing him makes me feel like the game isn't a fan of his wagon (though i'd have to run another check to see if anyone was actually properly pulling away from him)

so, like, in total? 6.5/10, my gamestate reads aren't always great, but i would not mind a wagon here

This is a sudden flip compared with Datisi's earlier expressed Scorp townread because of his "Luca Blight tell." I believe it supports Scorp town, and makes me question why Dragon gets no attention from this quarter.

VOTE: frogster

not loving the fact that it feels like everyone and their mother is defending scorp, but let's see what happens here

I believe this comes from a desire to keep Scorp mislimmable for later.

Datisi, what do you think of cape?

if i were there now, i'd be voting cape. 2610 feels like a "how DARE you question me on my speedy lolhammer you SCUMFUCK" shadethrowing when it's like, quite obvious why he should be getting questioned for it, the defensiveness feels unusual because like, obviously he's getting shit for it

and i think it's unlikely cape/malcolm are s/s because i have a hard time imagining two scumbuddies deciding to do this weird lowkey shade but not really push thing on the same person one right after the other

bottom of page 106, be back in a bit

I don't understand what "if I were there now" means, but it sounds like an excuse to maintain a Cape scumread and avoid acting on it. While I have found Cape's play to be town, I am only seeing support in here for fire's theory.

If anyone cares, my strongst scum reads right now are VP, Cape,and Datisi...

give me one reason why these aren't just random 3 names you pulled out of a hat

@nero, do you actually have any reason for scumreading me other than me not accepting your "hood therefore must scum" idea as gospel?

This is an odd thing to become incensed about for someone who allegedly scumreads Cape.

TLDR: I think Dragons, Cape and April have increased scum equity compared to how I felt before.

[tenebrousluminary]

Dragons had almost zero interaction with Datisi so nothing to see there.

going to move Cape90 into my townlist because 215 is too adorable

I don't want to think in Mystical Voodoo Triangles, but it is awfully tempting.

Dats did you roll town again ? ? : )

dats tell me you're town again? : )

This is a slot that showed up to the game already intending to not give Datisi a hard time.

I think we should consolidate on one of HEM/Tenebro to push pressure and advance game state rather than splitting

so which one would you like to do today dear?

Hey look, it is the exact thing VP did that was suspicious. Knowing I'm town, at least, there's no difference. I wonder whether Cape also tried to push me early on, I see that all of Datisi, Ari and Dragons were united there.

Sure let's discuss Datisi then.

Why does Scum Tisi decide to not create a townblock?

This again seems like someone who started at "Datisi is town" rather than someone who arrived there.

Which makes me suspicious because if Datisi remembers me as the one who "ripped through town" in that one game, then he must have due cause to pressure me.

Do you have a previous case of Datisi pressuring you off the bat? Is it scum!indicative for him to be interacting with people other than you?

Revving up the chainsaw for Datisi.

You assume that Datisi is able to create a townblock in the first 24 hours of a large theme... which makes very little sense to me - you also previous stated you think nothing ai has actually happened and you think people shouldn't be able to form reads - this is a contradiction just on the surface.

You are imposing a standard that by your own admission is absurd upon Datisi and using it to push him.

I assume Datisi is able to create a townblock because that's how i remember his playstyle in early games.

We are 24 hours into the game.

Datisi has been in class for 10 hours and slept for maybe 6 or 7 hours.

Your expectations are ridiculous and directly contradict what you previously said about there not being enough alignment indicative material to create townreads this early.

The defenses are endless and I do not even know why Ari is so sure of Datisi town.

probably try this

VOTE: scorp

The Mystical Voodoo Triangles are speaking to me again. Dragons, Datisi and Ari all targeted Scorp, seemingly from whole cloth.

Do you really think its not ok for Datisi to repeat his viewpoint to another player in the game who might not have read his point earlier since this is a large theme that is moving very quickly?

Chainsaw.

still think its Ari/Skitter maybe eyes and yeet

I think Dats just thinks he's a better player than he really is and doesn't want his friend voted out.

you misread me last time we played what makes you think you got any better this game?

I'm not sure if we have ever played together on this account. If you are talking about mini 2258 then it was House and Dats that I thought were scum, not you. Unless you are like a House alt. And ITG I was town/null reading you and even defended you in 1618. Was I misreading you then?

mm I guess I misremembered - you wanted Datisi dead not me in 2258.

Easy to see how this could earn Nero the label of "enemy" without inviting reflection.

[tenebrousluminary]

Granted, it seems improbable that scum-Dragons would make his main contribution to the game a bus on Ari/April.

[tenebrousluminary]

2435 is definitely a post scum!me would make in order to go "ackchually i didn't know it was hammer i didn't count hehehe" and my short history of playing with cape tells me he is the kind of person who *would* be paying attention to how many votes there are on someone, anyway

You played one game with me so clearly you can deduce that what you are saying is complete hogwash yeah? It really isn't super convenient on this site to just see who voted what, also I really wouldn't expect such a heavy shift in votes when we were not even near EoD. It was very easy to keep track of the votes in the normal blitz game, but I was literally just on a constant catch up mode for most of this entire game. Should I have looked? Yes. I knew that they received like some votes, like I was thinking 2 or 3 more, not hecking 6 others.
So I keep seeing a bunch of people be like "oh what Cape did has clear scum motivation!" Does it? I don't think it does, what would I try to accomplish with an early hammer? Is Yeet my scum partner? The thread wasn't even suspicious of my slot until I hammered. If I am mafia, this only hurts me unless like Yeet is my scumpartner right? I really don't see my scum motivation there, also I BET one of you would have lolhammered that if not me, just saying, and it wouldn't mean shit probably.

Also, let's think about why I would post 2 messages after a vote has been achieved on someone. I mean, I think this would be against the rules under normal circumstances yeah? But obviously I just

knew

I hammered the vote. Flawless logic I must say. Anyway Datisi the votes say you are mafia, I don't think your content particularly does, also you seem adamant on following my votes despite your laughable suspicion of me, so you are pinging me my good friend.

if i were there now, i'd be voting cape. 2610 feels like a "how DARE you question me on my speedy lolhammer you SCUMFUCK" shadethrowing when it's like, quite obvious why he should be getting questioned for it, the defensiveness feels unusual because like, obviously he's getting shit for it

LOL I mean your not wrong VP did ping me there. Also Datisi, I kinda see this and I think your full of it, your cocky

VOTE: Datisi

scum

you mean like it totally hadn't changed with math and monkey and fua right? because there's no such thing that could shift the gamestate instantly riiight?

There was literally 9 insta votes on GeneralWu. I don't think his Miselim was being avoided no matter if the day was being prolonged or not.

2692 - ok probably at most one scum in baltar/cape/scorpious

Correct, thunderdome me. there is 1 scum between Cape and Datisi, let's go. I am popping off ProHawk style.

this is interesting since i recall when in a previous game cape and i were t/t and he made a similarly-sounding huge wallcase on why i'm scum and i think i did get voted there, and then i got unvoted 5 minutes later because lol but like point being

But cape is mafia this game amiright?

Anyway, what is the mindshift?

Datisi has their sights on too many town. You with me Frogsterking?

i'm cocky yeah

how is that scummy?

Listen, I get why i should be questioned for my lolhammer the other day. But really it's just getting tiring and frustrating to even deal with because I know you and VP and all that will just tunnel me incessantly for it.

I don't think cocky was the right word

It was like

You are obviously posturing and I don't think you believe the words you are saying, you are forcing out something onto me. You literally have jumped on like 2 wagons with me today around the same time too! i struggle how you are believing in real thoughts. Also it really looks like you have your sight set on just multiple people all at once with somehow even less direction then me, and yet you shade me for being directionless?

Datisi also seems to love throwing around this very ironic word "opportunistic" when they only said that word once in the blitz game. Datisi's play has been riddled with oddities around this section of the game and.

The best word I can use is "hostile"

I think you could use that word for me but I am kinda just more frustrated. But Datisi feels

hostile

3049, 3037 (the haha is like ???), 2879, 3383.

I will be off for a bit

UNVOTE: Datisi

I will hold for now actually.

Some thoughts I had that kinda just came to me.

1. Does VP Baltar actually have the thought that communicating in our neighborhood at night is anti town until we "descumify" our hood? Like a night ago I agreed with this until I actually sat down and thought about that and then came to the realization that there literally is no downside really to talking in there at night or whatever.

2. I find it really strange that Nero Cain hasn't really been pushed by either of VP Baltar or Datisi as it seems kinda obvious by the way that Nero has basically been lowkey shielding me and suspecting VP, like since day 1, like this whole time. I want to revisit this like tomorrow or something.

3. As much as i don't like VP like, kinda just shrugging off my big case on them and saying some pretty evidently false things about the wall, like if you took a look at it for one second, it's obvious it wasn't like, prewritted/preplanned from the night before, but it's pretty clear that VP doesn't have too much intention really debunking me... but Datisi does, and still scumreads me off of it.

4. As much as I want to think that my suspicions on VP/Datisi/Scorpius are good. Well, the thing is, I am usually accurate on my scumreads, but the problem is is that I usually have more focus. Focus that I just kinda am thinking I am lacking right now this game. Especially with me not thinking of ruling out anybody from my neighborhood from POE.

5. I think I don't want to push the following players: Yeet, MalcolmTucker, fireisredsir. And then there comes some other people like Save The Dragons (I think recent content is good + they seem consistent in logic when I questioned them on April), tenebrousluminary, DeasVail who I think are all relatively towny and

This sprang pretty quickly out of a former null read, and ended just as suddenly. Not sure what to make of it.

[Save The Dragons]

i still think it could be scorp

[tenebrousluminary]

If they flip town, April is the last person who should be shot.
If VP flips scum, sure shoot April.

If VP or Cape flips town, the shot should be on the scum pushing those lims.
If VP or Cape flips town, the shot should be on April and suppose that I'm just batshit crazy.

wat?

Only thing that is preventing me from hitting that vote button is IDK how scum!Titus works in either of scum!VP or scum!Nero's world

TMI?

Only thing that is preventing me from hitting that vote button is IDK how scum!Titus works in either of scum!VP or scum!Nero's world

like hey guess what we're not in a scum!VP or a scum!Nero world

so what's stopping you now

VOTE: Titus

Titus did a similar thing to VPB the other day.

But like. You know, I don't like the swap off me they did.

Why did this need to be pointed out?

I don't think this person is partnered with April.

[Scorpious]

i still think it could be scorp

I see you boo..

[Scorpious]

I also see that fantastic bus by April..

[fireisredsir]

don't forget the part where titus was townreading VP and said she'd vote anyone to save VP and then a counterwagon started forming on cape and then she told math "don't get distracted" and voted VP instead of cape

[tenebrousluminary]

Yeah. I don't know if I can get past my Cape townread right now, but that

is

suspicious.

[tenebrousluminary]

My worlds right now look something like Dragons/Cape or April/Galron? I'm not sure Frog fits into either of those neatly.

But I probably shouldn't try to hero-solve it.

[tenebrousluminary]

Can you tell I'm about 100x as motivated now that we got a piece of the puzzle?

[fireisredsir]

yes! that's why i thought it was very important for the health of the town that we flip titus yesterday

[tenebrousluminary]

Scorpius is Town

If Frog is scum with anyone I currently think is scum, this is actively sabotaging their agenda.

@luminary

Are you being evasive and passive aggressive and stuff? That will destroy any teamwork potential we have.

This post is so strange as to be town.

Can you explain for me? I wasn't in that game.

less than 24 hours on the clock for d1, cape makes a huge wallcase on me and votes me. five minutes later (with nobody's input), he unvotes me because he went back and realized something i said actually made sense from a town pov and he might be wrong. cape got immediately townread for the case>reeval (the case itself was rly bad though), and we ended up yeeting both scum d1 and d2.

Thank you for strengthening my townread on Cape.

how does that strengthen it for THIS GAME?

pedit: @frogs

Because that story sounds similar to their play here

how does that strengthen it for THIS GAME?

pedit: @frogs

Because that story sounds similar to their play here

explain this to me like i'm 5.

please.

Their town meta is impulsive and thoughtful and they write a lot sometimes. If they're scum it's good acting, I think it's difficult to fake. I'll be less willing to townread them if they have a performing arts background.

I don't see a Cape partner here.

*sees inanity of page 1*

*bolts to VCs*

*sees inanity of page 1*

*bolts to VCs*

Why even read page one we all knew you were just gonna do that anyway

Yeah it's potentially a LAMIST statement to make with a built in excuse to not share thoughts.

I think luminary suggested the first 60 pages and then skipping to when April becomes active which I'd like because Titus' slot is one I really need to sort.

An alternative approach, not really reading at all and providing fresh reads as they come, could be helpful for scum hunting but would be more difficult for us to read Titus' slot itself.

Just thought this was interesting, I don't have an angle.

I think I'll evaluate April and Dragons alignment based on the way their reads flip. I'm going with this approach because I think they can both get good reads as town, I don't think I have any levels on them through "social deduction" and I think they both keep their cards close to their chest as either alignment.

April's reads are flipping; so where are you?

front half of this wagon is good, back half is shifty, but this seems more likely to hit scum than Malcom flip.

Front half? I am town now?

I think galron is more likely to flip scum based on his flaky play since coming into the game, and I don't think two scum in the hood, so that would make you town.

Here, VP flipped his read from a hard scumread on Cape to a hard townread on Cape, it's not consistent with VP's outted reads and is scum motivated.[/quote]

UNVOTE: Galron

It looks like VP is scum in the hood and being opportunistic for a mis hammer[/quote]

VOTE: VP

please dont kill another limbait target have some courage and vote VP

[/quote]

This post looks town to me.

Now I want to talk more about Dease. Dease completed a large normal a couple years ago with both Nero and Eyes. In that game Dease was the deepscum who made it to the endgame. There are a lot of similarities between Dease's play in that game and this game. I have a feeling Dease may be a player who needs pressure before he releases actual AI information.

I don't see a Deas partner here, and I'm thinking Deas works well as a final partner for basically any world.

VP asked me to answer his questions repeatedly then ducked out when I actually did.

Where did he do this?

Why are you voting no one?

Titus you CAN'T BE SERIOUS. "WHERE DID HE DO THIS?" ??? U R NOT EVEN READING VPS POSTS. U CANT BE. UR TELLING ME U MISSED ALL THIS:
-quotes-
I guess if I had to choose one of Nero, Cape and Galron to be scum in the hood gun to head I would choose Nero on PoE because Nero seems significantly more experienced so I'd weight Galron's psuedo mech clear > Cape's town tells > Nero's town tells.

Seems legitimately upset with Titus, and I think sussing Nero if they had a rolecop on him would be pretty plainly unhelpful.

UNVOTE: fire

I mean maybe I overreacted a little bit, it all made sense in my head. Fire pushed through malcolm and then vp and fire was right there to get credit for titus. IDK I'm go to sleep.

fire is a bit town based on VC

I thought fire looked worse based on votes

No you know what I have good ideas sometimes VOTE: fireisred

This post looks town.

Frog is not moving in lockstep with my suspects and some of them are targeting him. I wonder if he is a mislim.

VOTE: April

[April Ludgate]

I also see that fantastic bus by April..

I've been pushing Frogster since Day 3.

[April Ludgate]

The main issue I have is if I am right and traitor exists this is the last miselim we have.

So as much as I think you’re scum April I am torn between eliminating Frog or you.

I should just be tunneling you because of how wrong you have been

But at the same time I think if you’re scum you know this and give me frog and set up for you and Fire stomp.

You just got Flavor Fever.

I think if I were to flip, youd be able to look back and see how obviously town I've been this game.

[April Ludgate]

You really contradicted yourself and said tene is town and now tene is possible scum.

Again, I don't do this as scum ever. Contradictions are not scummy either, I flip flop constantly as town because one minute I think this, but I backtrack and think another. =/

[April Ludgate]

The main issue I have is if I am right and traitor exists this is the last miselim we have.

if traitor exists, you get an additional misfade not one less?

[April Ludgate]

Eyes without a face
DeasVail
Galron
_____

tenebrousluminary

Cape

Frogsterking
VP Baltar

Also, people saying my reads have been flipping more than they actually have.

this was the bottom half of my reads list on Day 3. DV/Galron have gone up, and VPB has flipped town.

Look who's left....it's like incredibly similar to what I'm still currently pushing.

[April Ludgate]

My worlds right now look something like Dragons/Cape or April/Galron? I'm not sure Frog fits into either of those neatly.

But I probably shouldn't try to hero-solve it.

Galron is essentially confirmed town because of Yeet Psychologist clear.

[April Ludgate]

Also, a Fire/April team suggestion means you're looking at the game from a surface level, and really need to look deeper than that.