Mini 2270: Spring Fling!

[Datisi]

Your bemoaning about how you would drag datisi down but not being willing to swap your partner or even comment on it is minus points

this is something that really caught my eye and i like that dunnstral pointed it out

because if noraa really was that worried about zir dragging a townie down, why is zir still thinking about pairing with me if i'm town?

how does it block you? it gives you datisi so you dont have to 1v1 anyone to get a dance partner

and this part, coupled with the above, is also ??? because i have agency in this? i make the final choice who i'm dancing with? like, i feel like a goal-oriented townie that wants to solve the game is like, gonna talk to me and get me to listen who to pair with, while scum is gonna be afraid that i'm gonna see through them and change my mind and is trying to shut the idea down before it even sets off

[Datisi]

a part of me now wants to run off with dunn

the paranoid part of me is yelling at me that this is a pocket, because dunn saw i was scumreading lukewarm so he decided to also scumread lukewarm, but (1) he was scumreading him prior, (2) proposing to mala then proposing to me feels a bit more nuanced than necessary if that's the plan and i don't know if dunn like, bothers to fake that if scum?

[Datisi]

i want to see noraa substantiate the claims against dunn

i also won't be efforting too much today because painting eggs, but i'll be around

[Ydrasse]

oh to have the energy to write/read into things more

i don’t want to see dunn left out at this point, his arguments... don’t feel like they’re unsound? i read them and the things that he’s saying i nod along to, while it’s pretty verbose than dunn generally is from my experiences i don’t think that verbosity is like. him trying to be all charismatic towny or whatever. i also think that it’s... unfair to use things like townreads on him as a weapon to push him because like. it refuses to acknowledge the alternative that people think he’s town... because he might be town.

noraa or luke should be left out at this point.

[Ydrasse]

also an idle thought that i haven’t fleshed out too much yet is that the opening pairs might all be pure town.

i guess with my current reads it’s the thing where town flings themselves into the action and scum who has sat back to try and plan are suddenly left scrambling a bit more to try and find partners because oh no why is town doing what they did.

(incidentally, the only real narrative i could think of for scum!prism that doesn’t feel like i’m twisting my brain too much to reach is that she’s aware that partnering sooner = probably better but i’m kind of taking her at face value here) (this has been on my mind a bit more but i didn’t have the oomph to post)

[Ydrasse]

but despite all that i’m kind of like

is it silly to have 3/3 scum unpaired right now

because for me i think it leaves it in noraa/luke/mala/fire but the latter two are kind of reads that are just There right now as poe more than a strong reason to believe they’re mafia

and then the other wolf in my brain looks at like bell but then goes 3 gentleman mafia reads? hmmmm

[Lukewarm]

I have returned. I feel like I should rephrase my thoughts from before I left in a more coherent manor, since I kinda rambled my way into my conclusions yesterday.

We only have 4 options of people to kill atm: Me, Noraa, Ceph, and Dunn. I don't want me to die, and I because I felt like I was pickign up the same vibes was zir, I distinctly don't want Noraa to die. So, that leaves Dunn and Ceph. Ceph is a null read, and Dunn is distinctly Not A Town Read. Which is in itself worse then a null read. So, just looking at the 4 possibilities left, it feels like Dunn is the most likely to flip red. However, I think that Dunn's flip would also provide me with the more information regarding other players then Ceph.

I do not think that scum!Noraa goes that hard on leaving Dunn behind if they are partners. I don't think that scum!Datisi makes post 587 if Dunn is town.

So, 1) I feel like of the 4 presented options, Dunn feels like the highest change to flip Red, and 2) Dunn's flip would provide the most workable information to me.

I think that that is the clearest way to present my final conclusions of my thoughts. Of course, at this point I have no agency, and its really up to Mala/Dats on what we are doing.

I'm gonna catch up now.

[Enchant]

Ceph is a null read, and Dunn is distinctly Not A Town Read. Which is in itself worse then a null read.

RED IS RED
BLUE IS BLUE

[Lukewarm]

So no, you can't prove it

This really doesn't sit well with me. Because, in Web of Lies, Noraa was absolutely falling all over themselves to spout how they were the Dunn whisperer, with an impeccable ability to read Dunn. And Dunn never said anything to imply that that was false. And then Noraa was right that game.

Regardless of Noraa's actual ability, it is fairly clear that Noraa views themselves to have this ability and that Dunn is aware that Noraa view themselves that way - and both of those things can be seen in a game where both Noraa and Dunn flipped town.

So it is strange for Dunn to then go to "Prove that you can read me" which just seems like a discredit angle. But it is also an irrelevant angle if he thinks that Noraa is scum.

[Lukewarm]

Thank you for your insight Enchant.

[Malakittens]

i feel townpings on malakittens for possibly dumb reasons, we'll see

why's that??

maybe

dunnstral/mala
lukewarm/Datisi
cephir/fireisred

luke+ceph swap works too

So, I haven't yet had a great read on Dunn. I have played with Dunn in the past and been wrong too many times. So i'm leaning on ppl who have more exp in reading him.

im also open to that. i wanted myko left out most but now with who is remaining i want ceph and dun >>>>> luke and noraa to stay.

and im cool with taking some consensus into account if it comes down to luke/noraa cause i don't exactly have a strong scumread on either of them

I mean i wanted you to be left out bc i think youre scum, but hey we all cant get what we want

dunn will flip scum 9/10 times here

You were right about Dunn in Control so if anything i'll be more wanting to trust your read over aNYones elses when it comes to dunn

[Dunnstral]

In web of lies I was a friendly neighbor who was cleared to a neighborhood of 4 people and noraa was calling me town

You are cherry picking

[Lukewarm]

To be clear, I am saying they are either lying or misinformed, and that what they are claiming is untrue

And he doubled down.

But again, even if Noraa is wrong about their ability to read Dunn, it has been established in a prior game that Noraa firmly believes that ze have this ability, and Dunn should by all rights know that that Noraa believes that.

[Dunnstral]

I'll triple down: It's not true that I take softer stances as scum.

[Lukewarm]

In web of lies I was a friendly neighbor who was cleared to a neighborhood of 4 people and noraa was calling me town

You are cherry picking

Noraa said all of that before your friendly neighbor was revealed... So no, your friendly neighbor PR that game has nothing to do with Noraa's self perceived ability to read you.

[Malakittens]

someone once told me dunnstral powers up in dance games

so in hindsight this makes dunn's posting NAI as if he powers up in dance game regardless of alignment, which in the future is gonna throw off any meta type tells

fml

I think that Dunn should be left behind

propose to Mala

I don't currently trust Prism, which leaves me disinclined to let her do the sorting of the pairs.

Thinking selfishly, I think pairing with Dats knowing that I am his top scum read just kills me day 2, and I think proposing to fire results in fire getting hammer between me and Cephrir, and I am left behind today. So, survival thinking says Mala is my best bet.

Noted & ooof going to think on this last few lines of this.

[Dunnstral]

Why would I go out of my way to say that noraa was wrong when they were calling me town and I was a friendly neighbor and I wasn't scumreading the slot

And also they replaced in

[Dunnstral]

Lukewarm, do you believe that I have softer stances when I roll mafia?

[Malakittens]

If Mala is town I don’t really think that will work because, uh, she’s malakittens. *waves hand* it’s possible she’s different than forever ago, but she’s a paranoid kitty and one of the more likely players to suddenly leave if they see red flags and you don’t dissuade them enough.

This is very true. Red flags scare the fuck outta me

do noraa and dunn have history and is ze usually able to read them well?

In control, Noraa was able to read Dunn super well. I wanted Noraa to sheep me on my mastina scum read and they didnt

[Dunnstral]

In control, Noraa was able to read Dunn super well.

How long did it take noraa to form their read in that game Malakittens?

[Lukewarm]

Lukewarm, do you believe that I have softer stances when I roll mafia?

This is going to be a very unsatisfactory answer, but I don't have a conscious metric by which I read you. But there are some games that just scream at me that you are town despite you getting semi-widely scum read, because you feel exactly the same way you did in our first game.

First game being Divide and Conquer, following games that screamed at me that you were town being Shakespeare and Web of Lies (prior to your FN reveal).

And then there are games where you don't feel that way: Those being Control (I spectated that game), Isekai, and Bloodstained. 2/3 of those games are scum game.

This game, your vibes were definitely in the second category.

[Dunnstral]

82 pages mala. Here's the post:

Spoiler: post 2041

Subject: CONTROL - GAME OVER!

oh wait wait wait wait wait wait WAIT hold the fukc up. i just skimmed dunnstrals iso.
thats scum. can we bring that wagon back please

-baby bear

At this point, the game had been open for about 10 real life days

Yes, noraa's

slot

called my

slot

scum before this point, but:

1) Noraa was part of a 3 headed hydra, and the post calling me scum was signed by somebody else
2) The hydra acknowledged that they were essentially acting as 3 seperate heads
3) I was also part of a hydra when the other hydra originally called my slot scum

[Dunnstral]

Lukewarm, do you believe that I have softer stances when I roll mafia?

This is going to be a very unsatisfactory answer, but I don't have a conscious metric by which I read you. But there are some games that just scream at me that you are town despite you getting semi-widely scum read, because you feel exactly the same way you did in our first game.

First game being Divide and Conquer, following games that screamed at me that you were town being Shakespeare and Web of Lies (prior to your FN reveal).

And then there are games where you don't feel that way: Those being Control (I spectated that game), Isekai, and Bloodstained. 2/3 of those games are scum game.

This game, your vibes were definitely in the second category.

So no you don't?

[Lukewarm]

And then there are games where you don't feel that way: Those being Control (I spectated that game), Isekai, and Bloodstained. 2/3 of those games are scum game.

This game, your vibes were definitely in the second category.

I also don't know that I have a great metric to sort you once we are in this category, because I town read you as scum in Isekai, I scum read you as scum in control, and I town read you as town in blood stained.

So, when it feels like you are in the first category, my read on you feels very confident, but when you are in the second category, I feel like I am less so.

[Lukewarm]

Lukewarm, do you believe that I have softer stances when I roll mafia?

This is going to be a very unsatisfactory answer, but I don't have a conscious metric by which I read you. But there are some games that just scream at me that you are town despite you getting semi-widely scum read, because you feel exactly the same way you did in our first game.

First game being Divide and Conquer, following games that screamed at me that you were town being Shakespeare and Web of Lies (prior to your FN reveal).

And then there are games where you don't feel that way: Those being Control (I spectated that game), Isekai, and Bloodstained. 2/3 of those games are scum game.

This game, your vibes were definitely in the second category.

So no you don't?

Its not something that I have ever thought about, so I don't have an opinion either way unless I go do a lot of meta on you.