Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

[Save The Dragons]

This is more of me echoing Well Done's concern that the mod might not put a beloved princess in to be randomized in this setup

That is not our stance

We said that we have doubts whether a beloved princess would be aligned with the mafia/werewolf factions

My belief is that in general mastina does not fake claim, regardless of alignment, except for in extreme circumstances. They claimed beloved princess? That's their real role. Now figure out their alignment. We are against eliminating the beloved princess.

If the roles are randomly aligned I don't functionally see the difference but whatevs

[Well Done]

If the roles are randomly aligned I don't functionally see the difference but whatevs

The original running had the same random element, but still had some roles that were not random amongst the entire player list. Werewolves could not random into the monk role, and mafia could not random into the Mason role, the malefactor could not random into being a monk or a mason.

After bloodstained, I would hope that ceph would make the beloved princess in particular a town only role.

I know that that is not a guarantee, but even if that is not the case, I feel like true claiming as beloved princess as scum is a horrible play as a major benefit of the effect cones from the surprise factor. I feel like scum!Mastina would have kept her role to herself, so in otherwords, I believe that mastina claiming the role is +town for her over all.

[Sword of Ducks]

I'm about ready to sit down and solve this game. Does anyone have the original roles used in the first multiball?
(looking for a list to give possible combinations, and to rule out impossible combinations)

[Well Done]

I'm about ready to sit down and solve this game. Does anyone have the original roles used in the first multiball?
(looking for a list to give possible combinations, and to rule out impossible combinations)

Roles that dies during the game are in this post: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87185

Roles that made it to the end of the game are in this post:
https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12912660

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wow so there can also be scum mason?
First flip in previous game was werewolf mason apparently.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Ok so i think it’s foolish to assume Mastina’s role can only be a town one if the first game is any indication.

[Save The Dragons]

i see the difference now

[Well Done]

Wow so there can also be scum mason?
First flip in previous game was werewolf mason apparently.

There can be a werewolf Mason, but mafia mason is impossible. And the opposite is true for Monks.

In the prior run, the malefactor cannot be either - but I could see that being subject to change in this set up.

[Well Done]

Wow so there can also be scum mason?
First flip in previous game was werewolf mason apparently.

Probably prudent for players to avoid making similar comments on being surprised of this possibility.

[butterchurn]

I would like to know who you think they are.

why?
I find it kinda sus you are reacting this way

Because I think Tracer has consistently been posturing with confident stances and I don't think they're genuine or backed up by any serious reasoning. I think that saying "scum are trapped like rats in a bucket I love it" is not really a statement that accomplishes anything or moves the game forward unless he is willing to say who. And if he's town, there must be something that inspired him to say that in that situation. His response of "they know who they are" didn't do much to convince me that the original post came from any place of real town thought.

[bnuuy]

Wow so there can also be scum mason?
First flip in previous game was werewolf mason apparently.

pls refer to the non-werewolf scum faction as mafia going forward, I use scum as catch-all for anti-town so seeing it used as an alternate term for mafia throws me off

[butterchurn]

The word "scum" in that statement is already being used in the manner which you request.

[bnuuy]

I would like to know who you think they are.

why?
I find it kinda sus you are reacting this way

Because I think Tracer has consistently been posturing with confident stances and I don't think they're genuine or backed up by any serious reasoning. I think that saying "scum are trapped like rats in a bucket I love it" is not really a statement that accomplishes anything or moves the game forward unless he is willing to say who. And if he's town, there must be something that inspired him to say that in that situation. His response of "they know who they are" didn't do much to convince me that the original post came from any place of real town thought.

I see it as a noob trap, a less skilled scum might react to a post like that in a way that gives themself away
I don't quite feel like you did that but your engagement with it feels like you're trying to disarm the trap

[bnuuy]

The word "scum" in that statement is already being used in the manner which you request.

clearly norwegian has never played great/grand idea them

[bnuuy]

The word "scum" in that statement is already being used in the manner which you request.

clearly norwegian has never played great/grand idea then

ebwop

[Flavor Leaf]

With the idea that a Masonry/Monkery were randomized, I rolled 50 randomizations. In these cases, it's not possible for both scum to be in it, so was doing the randoms out of 19.

if there is those roles here, of course.



If Malefactor can be in them.

21 times no scum
18 times 1 scum, no malefactor.
4 times 1 scum, and malefactor
3 times 2 scum, no malefactor
4 times, just malefactor

if malefactor cant be in them

25 times no scum
22 times 1 scum
3 times 2 scum


I don't know what type of merit this has, but it does show a higher possibility of all townies than i would normally suspect, albeit not enough to clear anyone in it.

It's basically 50/50 if scum is in a Masonry/Monkery.

[Flavor Leaf]

these aren't exact odds, just how I ended up rolling. I imagine if I did it again, it'd be similar.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'll try to play some tomorrow, but i did say I'd be lurker leaf coming into it.

Consider that a super fancy prod dodge.

[bnuuy]

With the idea that a Masonry/Monkery were randomized, I rolled 50 randomizations. In these cases, it's not possible for both scum to be in it, so was doing the randoms out of 19.

if there is those roles here, of course.



If Malefactor can be in them.

21 times no scum
18 times 1 scum, no malefactor.
4 times 1 scum, and malefactor
3 times 2 scum, no malefactor
4 times, just malefactor

if malefactor cant be in them

25 times no scum
22 times 1 scum
3 times 2 scum


I don't know what type of merit this has, but it does show a higher possibility of all townies than i would normally suspect, albeit not enough to clear anyone in it.

It's basically 50/50 if scum is in a Masonry/Monkery.

Was this for a 3-person masonry/abbey (a more fitting term for the monk group)?
You don’t need to run a simulation to determine odds of at least one scum in a masonry/abbey, you just need to use conditional logic for each step (if a scum is put in during one step, the next doesn’t need to be run)

[Flavor Leaf]

isnt that just relying on it being a

% of 0 scum
% of 1 scum
% of 2 scum
% of 3 scum

which is what I was more trying to avoid.

I imagine the setup would have been more likely randomized that way than a randomizing how many scum to put in these things

[Nashville Dreams]

Hey, let's not turn this into numbers crunching when both scum

and town

have an incentive to lie.

~Titus

[MegAzumarill]

Relying on percentages is moot because we don't know if everyone was an opportunity for each role. Some roles may be locked to a certain faction (i.e. A seer and an alpha werewolf exist, seer can be any alignment but alpha is forced to be ww)

That said those percentages are for a 3 person monastery or masonry correct?

[bnuuy]

Any alignment can be godfather/alpha ww if using GIM rules

[catboi]

Long day today, need some time to catch up, not sure I'll get through everything tonight.

- I'm not really vibing with the wagon on monkeyman - to me it feels like he's getting voted for having

weird

or

irrational

opinions, not necessarily

scum-motivated

ones. The stuff he says might seem bizarre but I feel like he actually believes what he's saying. The pressure on him feels opportunistic in nature.

- actually feel like mala's entrance to the game, has more energy than I'd expect if she rolled scum here.

Yo, very important to note:

I am a Beloved Princess

.

No, seriously; no joke; this is a realclaim. (I can fullclaim the wording use, but I've reason not to.)

Obviously, this needs to be said since eliminating me during the day is a Very Bad Idea. (I'll need to ask a question to the mod about Vigs tho.)

I may or may not be feeling like playing tonight but it'll either be shortly or not until tomorrow-at-earliest.

...I am incredibly annoyed if Ceph actually put a goddamned beloved princess in his game, but I have absolutely no reason to believe mastina would lie about this or claim it in her first post. Also just, uh, generally feels better than her scumgame, although it's early and if she fades down the stretch it'll be evident.

- norwee kind of feels like he's overplaying the mastina paranoia a bit

Every day that goes by without Catboi trying to kill Mena I become more convinced they are on the same team

- 520 from STD is self-contradictory but in a way that I feel like scum wouldn't post it

[catboi]

This is more of me echoing Well Done's concern that the mod might not put a beloved princess in to be randomized in this setup

That is not our stance

We said that we have doubts whether a beloved princess would be aligned with the mafia/werewolf factions

My belief is that in general mastina does not fake claim, regardless of alignment, except for in extreme circumstances. They claimed beloved princess? That's their real role. Now figure out their alignment. We are against eliminating the beloved princess.

Dw.

I’ll just persuade Catboi to vig her for real this time

sigghhhhhhhhh

the stupidest thing is the mold claim scared me off


not that it would have mattered because scum had a doc