Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

[Wallflower]

also, I'll be honest: that huge spoiler hasn't really done anything to sell me on catboi!scum but wallflower is now my top TR

could you say a bit more on why you think that me asking about where we could get votes from is something that is more likely to come from me as scum?

It's the kind of question that feels more like trying to look like you're working with the town, than actually working with the town. It didn't seem like the kind of situation where it was a matter of needing to recruit votes for a wagon. There are many players in this game and at that stage, I think most had not yet been around for the play from TB that made you suspect them, so how were you or butterchurn even going to know where you could votes from?

[Wallflower]

It feels like the only realistic answer would have been "most of the game potentially, depending on what they think"

[Menalque]

I guess we see the game differently -- I don't view games as made up by a set of total individuals but more a set of relationships that tend towards grouping

I have my prior relationships, which steers how I'm going to interact/approach certain people, and then there's however the relationships are falling out in a particular game as it develops. either way, that means that there are people I suspect are more likely to vote with me and those who I think are less likely to do so. for instance, it was pretty unlikely that Well Done were gonna vote with me at my behest, even if they might vote there if they came to their own conclusion that TB was scum or someone who the game would benefit from eliminating

so what I'm asking is not "do you know specific people who will vote TB?" but instead "who are the people you feel like you've made a connection with this game who might get on board with the wagon?"

[Wallflower]

I guess we see the game differently -- I don't view games as made up by a set of total individuals but more a set of relationships that tend towards grouping

I have my prior relationships, which steers how I'm going to interact/approach certain people, and then there's however the relationships are falling out in a particular game as it develops. either way, that means that there are people I suspect are more likely to vote with me and those who I think are less likely to do so. for instance, it was pretty unlikely that Well Done were gonna vote with me at my behest, even if they might vote there if they came to their own conclusion that TB was scum or someone who the game would benefit from eliminating

so what I'm asking is not "do you know specific people who will vote TB?" but instead "who are the people you feel like you've made a connection with this game who might get on board with the wagon?"

thanks for the explanation. It's a more social approach than what I'm used to, but I can see how that would work

[Menalque]

no prob, I've learned from experience that I'm better at the "social" part of social deduction games than the "deduction" part lol, which is why I play into that side quite a bit

[MalcolmTucker]

I'm finding it a lot easier to TR players in this game than SR them despite the high scum count between different teams.

I'm liking Flavor's approach here and think they are town. I don't necessarily agree Catboi is mafia, and I thought Wallflower came out far worse in their exchange, but I do think there's a solid point made that Catboi may have seen it as easier to go after Wallflower than anyone else on their wagon.

CSF reads as town to me, and I'm generally agreeing with pretty much everything Butterchurn is posting.

I'm not hating the idea of Norwegian as possible mafia here, feel like there's been a mix of filler and no real major pushes despite their attempt to get a wagon going on me which then faded away.

[MalcolmTucker]

Reading through Wallflower's big post and to be honest none of it is really convincing me they are town. Ultimately despite their suspicions they are still very much hedging their bets on the slot, and some of their pros for Catboi being mafia are not particularly strong to me.

They criticise Catboi's 1184 for example by bringing up TB since they'd backed out - but from my POV I found that helpful because it very much clarified why TB had approached the game in the way they did, and will influence how I approach their slot going forward. It was a solid +1 town for me when I read it and strikes me as a complete reach to suspect someone as mafia.

Maybe I'm just too wary of getting sucked in by big posts that look like major townie effort but there's no reason it can't come from mafia. Especially when one of Catboi's main criticisms had been that Wallflower's suspicion of them was too vague.

I'll vote here for now.

VOTE: Wallflower

[Menalque]

okay, will say that if either of catboi or Malc ever flip scum the other one dies too lol

[Menalque]

I'm liking Flavor's approach here

hmm

what do you like about FL's approach? be specific

[MalcolmTucker]

I'm liking Flavor's approach here

hmm

what do you like about FL's approach? be specific

Much as I suspect Wallflower, I felt their point that Catboi could have been potentially trying to go after Wallflower because they viewed it as the easiest target on their bandwagon was insightful, as an example.

Beyond that I think they're playing well and working to solve without being too tunnelled on any one player. Plenty of time for that to change since it's D1 but they're in my town pile for now.

[Menalque]

I'm surprised, because most newer players tend to hate the way FL plays and want to murderise him for it

[MonkeyMan576]

I have to admit I don't really like Wallflowers non confrontational approach so far.

VOTE: Wallflower

[Titus]

I'm seeing a bunch of counterwagons spring up to MonkeyMan576 and I am not a fan.

[Titus]

I love playing scum and don't feel bad at all lying. Am I a sociopath?

No. People in this game request scum to lie. Lying because requested to is not a bad person at all.

[MonkeyMan576]

Wrong alt Titus, but there is more often than not going to be many wagons on day one from my experience, especially in large games.

[Nashville Dreams]

I'm seeing a bunch of counterwagons spring up to MonkeyMan576 and I am not a fan.

I love playing scum and don't feel bad at all lying. Am I a sociopath?

No. People in this game request scum to lie. Lying because requested to is not a bad person at all.

[MonkeyMan576]

I love playing scum and don't feel bad at all lying. Am I a sociopath?

No. People in this game request scum to lie. Lying because requested to is not a bad person at all.

I was being facecious in responce to SoD's comment about feeling bad about being scum. I just found it amusing.

[Nashville Dreams]

See, here's the thing about this: Tracer Bullet is pooky. And yes, pooky co-won paragon last year, etc. But pooky is developing some extremely bad habits.

How do you know Pooky is Tracer?

[Nashville Dreams]

He dosen't scumhunt, he headhunts. He just pushes players out of fear of their scumgame rather than reading their alignment. He did it to me and skitter in that game. He was right on skitter, but wrong on me, because it was inconceivable to him that I could possibly be playing any differently.for reasons other than my alignment. Frankly I'm not sure he actually cared.

It's a shit way to play and completely insufferable. And whatever happened, good riddance if he was pulling that shit again here.

Do you think this is why he tried to push me earlier?

~Titus

[Nashville Dreams]

I think sword of ducks is actually very likely town now. For reasons.

Why reasons? That slot is another that should be eliminated. I think SoD and MonkeyMan576 are teamed.

~Titus

[MonkeyMan576]

Trust me I could definatley go for a SoD wagon, and I've said so.

[NorwegianboyEE]

SoD is not scum.

[Nashville Dreams]

I’m gonna have to think over my thoughts on Catboi.

On one hand, they are definitely a smooth talker, but they’re pinging me like crazy, especially that big post.

They’re saying a lot of things that are like…true, good statements, but not necessarily townie statements.

I also don’t personally like the Wallflower push because I think myself, Norwegian, and Mega are the worst ones on the wagon, but Wallflower has the most to go against and likely the least pushback.

I also see Wallflower as super townie, even if Catboi isn’t scum.

I still don't get why Catboi is pinging you, especially given the wagon states.

[MonkeyMan576]

Based on what meta?

[Nashville Dreams]

SoD is not scum.

The more people say this without SoD doing anything, the more I am convinced that I am right.