Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

[Sword of Ducks]

I don't know what happening, but I will put this here!

VOTE: Well Done

Why?

Because I've got a bad feeling about the both of you, that's why!

[Well Done]

I don't know what happening, but I will put this here!

VOTE: Well Done

Why?

Because I've got a bad feeling about the both of you, that's why!

Explain

[Well Done]

Anyway I feel like Well Done's argument here is a bit inconsistent. As has been pointed out Nashville has barely if even properly scum-read Flavor. And Flavor's reverse read on Well Done starts to seem reasonable if they are town and believe this read is in fundamentally bad faith.

To be clear, Flavor Leaf's scum reading us (or Mastina, or ND) was not the basis of our scum read. We were scum reading him, we explained why we scum read him, and voted him.

The "he is scum reading people who scum read him" is not the basis of our scum read, and instead was Dunn's reaction to this post.

I've been waiting to get pushed for a while.

My thoughts on that are it's very possible that both scum teams thought it was possible that i was scum on the other, so this looks probably like scum who's finally trying to stop any momentum I have going.

Hi, this is Luke. I am vl/a today, and this is my first (and probably only) post of the day. I will also be away tomorrow and possibly (probably?) Monday.

My scum lean on Flavor Leaf started out about the time that his interaction with Tracer Bullet happened, and then he started pushing Catboi.

I put it to Dunn that Every time I read a post by flavor leaf, I feel like a used car salesman is trying to sell me something. Like he is trying to talk something past me, and it makes me not trust anything that he says.

That is the same time that I started digging into his iso, and what caused me to spot the similar wording he had with catboi.

Spoiler:

Like, they went from making post 911 saying they were not going to hyperpost, to becoming the number 1 top poster in the thread over the course of 12 hours.

[This was actually the thing that I was looking into when I spotted the similarities btw. I was looking to see what caused such a massive change in his mindset and approach to this game.]

I kept having similar reactions (The used carsales man thing) to his postings on a number of topics . Him pre-positioning that certain players could not be eliminated day 1, preemtively commenting a couple times that catboi can and would fake claim upon being ran up, the narrative that he presented that Wallflower was somehow the exact perfect person for catboi to turn to over over say toog or meg, the way that he interacted with the bnuuy wagon, the repeated comments on Mena being pocketed by Catboi, that the "Catboi Cover Crew" was a thing.

And the fact that a lot of these things felt like they were being said on repeat, like he was trying to get the rest of the thread to think about the game on his terms.

And then, last night, I read his scum guide. And that is when it clicked that he was focused on setting up "GameFics" as he called it in his guide. That that was his focus OVER being focused on scum hunting. I sent my thoughts to Dunn, and he agreed, and then he has been the one pushing it because I have not been on.

Anyways. Back to my V/LA

[Well Done]

I'm still 100% in support of day 1 eliming the Beloved Princess. Lowest risk for what could possibly also be scum, PRs are still hidden, scum would be firing blindly, possibly getting a few cross kills.

Is the Malefactor essentially just a 5th scum member for both teams with no ability to communicate with them? Or are they more akin to a Serial Killer? I didn't see anything on the wiki about a Malefactor, but their win con suggests they are aligned with either/both scum factions but don't get a kill of their own. I'd assume in this setup, they are bulletproof. Do they win even if dead as long as town loses?

They don't inherently have a night kill or a bulletproof vest. They do win if dead as long as town loses.

As for where you are going with this, no I don't think that malefactor would claim Beloved Princess on day 1 if that is not their real role. It simply does not benefit them to do so.

[Toogeloo]

I wasn't linking the two. It was two separate thoughts.

[MonkeyMan576]

Looking over Mastina's last game I can see she is an extremely high content poster and contributed to her towns win as a Town Mason. I am not comfortable with eliming her as a claimed BP. Based on the claim she is the player I would last like to see eliminated. In fact anyone proposing her elimination I am extremely suspicious of now that I think about it.

Monkey, where do you stand re this given recent pushes on Mastina? I'm unsure on the slot but I don't think your post here is entirely unreasonable, however unsure if you've changed since you don't appear to be pushing particularly hard on players you initially thought would have been scummy for pushing Mastina at all D1.

Didn't see this until late. I am against the BP pushes, although I kinda see where they are coming from. It's kinda like getting a VI policy eliminated, you have to do it out of necessity because you don't want it dominating the endgame. But here I just don't see this as a gambit from mastina, I could be wrong but I doubt it and in general I personally am against policy eliminations.

[Sword of Ducks]

I don't know what happening, but I will put this here!

VOTE: Well Done

Why?

Because I've got a bad feeling about the both of you, that's why!

Explain

Well, sometimes there's no explaining a clear gutread...but that's all I have.

[MonkeyMan576]

Hey, at least he's voting. Baby steps.

[Flavor Leaf]

Him pre-positioning that certain players could not be eliminated day 1, preemtively commenting a couple times that catboi can

Misrep.

I've actively stated I don't believe that Catboi is likely to be faded.

In fact, I've said multiple times that he gets run up, claims a PR, and relieves pressure.

[Flavor Leaf]

And then, last night, I read his scum guide. And that is when it clicked that he was focused on setting up "GameFics" as he called it in his guide. That that was his focus OVER being focused on scum hunting. I sent my thoughts to Dunn, and he agreed, and then he has been the one pushing it because I have not been on.

This one's not a bad reasoning.

But like, it's multiball, this just isn't the case for scum in Multiball.

And I have actively been scum hunting, you just are choosing to act like I haven't been.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like, they went from making post 911 saying they were not going to hyperpost, to becoming the number 1 top poster in the thread over the course of 12 hours.

In regards to this, yeah I really wanted to lurk.

Just not possible for me if I'm playing a game nowadays.

[Flavor Leaf]

2077 is a fine post, but it's just not really a case to why I'm scum, it's just an analysis on how I'm playing, and then a link to why.

The Catboi Cover Crew is the exact same thing I did in my last finished town game that I called the Froggy Protection Posse, in which I was correct with STD being scum within the Froggy Protection Posse.

Change a few words, but take the same situations, and it's a Flavor Town case.

[Flavor Leaf]

And then, last night, I read his scum guide. And that is when it clicked that he was focused on setting up "GameFics" as he called it in his guide. That that was his focus OVER being focused on scum hunting. I sent my thoughts to Dunn, and he agreed, and then he has been the one pushing it because I have not been on.

This is the best reasoning I see, besides the bad "over focusing on scum hunting" line, but that looks just to try to push down the work I've actively been putting in doing on developing my reads in addition to just not being true in multiball.

[Flavor Leaf]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p13309361

Here's a post to me on my alt April Ludgate that is my last finished town game, only finished town game in a year and a half.

Pretty much proves that it's a playstyle.

Yes, I repeat stuff.

Yes, I use gamestate analysis hunting over direct scum casing.

Yes, I create buzz lines, such as my "LAST NIGHT TOMORROW!!!!" large reads list.

It's how I play. I'm essentially all Charisma and Gamestate, and like to use catchphrases.

I'm an actor/writer, and I play the game like an actor/writer.

[Well Done]

Your last town game was a year and a half ago on an alt, but earlier you argued that Dunnstral should "know" you are town based on meta. Huh.

[Flavor Leaf]

Your last town game was a year and a half ago on an alt, but earlier you argued that Dunnstral should "know" you are town based on meta. Huh.

last town game before that game, dont misrep.

[Flavor Leaf]

Your last town game was a year and a half ago on an alt, but earlier you argued that Dunnstral should "know" you are town based on meta. Huh.

this proves you chose to discredit before even looking at the post, because that was March 26th.

Dunnstral has been playing here for years, and the case was controlling game and being manipulative?

That's just describing me as a person.

[Flavor Leaf]

Your case just feels like fluff because you need to find reasons to push me.

[Toogeloo]

To be fair, Dunn is probably scum by virtue of me being town. It's meta at this point.

[Flavor Leaf]

Your case just feels like fluff because you need to find reasons to push me.

This is true even if you truly do believe I am scum.

[MonkeyMan576]

So, this is mostly a role madness game, based on the previous game. This means any claims are more than likely going to be power roles.

We need to consider this when we decide if we are going to allow someone to live based on their most likely power roles upcoming claim.

We can't really wait for someone to claim VT, and then hope that it's a less valuable member of the game potential VT.

[MonkeyMan576]

For the record, the original games setup:

The Resistance - Town Vanilla
Dannflor - Town Vanilla
Kakeguri Addcits - Town Vanilla
morph the cat - Town Mason Roleblocker
petapan - Town Odd Night Seer
Vaxkiller - Town Veteran
Celestial Powerhouse - Town Mason Two Shot Vigilante
Kazyan - Town Doctor
Taco Hemingway - Town Even Night Occoultist
unwnd - Town One Shot Wolfsbane
Lukewarm - Town One Shot Wolfsbane Monk
Mastina - Town Monk
Uncle Shelby - Town Monk
Ythan - Town Hirsute Even Night Cop
Pooky - Town Cleric
WhemeStar - Melefactor Wiccan One Shot Neighborizor
ManateeDude - Werewolf One Shot Bulletproof Mason
DrippingGoofball - Werwolf Odd Night Gunsmith
Anya - Werewolf One Shot Strongman
Echolocation - Mafia One Shot Bulletproof One Shot Strongman
CheekyTeeky - Mafia Diabolist
Vecna - Mafia Miller Nonconsecutive Night Tracker

[MonkeyMan576]

Also notable that the town won easily and the mod felt the need to add a member to each scum team at the expense of two townies.

[Well Done]

Your last town game was a year and a half ago on an alt, but earlier you argued that Dunnstral should "know" you are town based on meta. Huh.

last town game before that game, dont misrep.

I wasn't in "that game"

[Flavor Leaf]

Your last town game was a year and a half ago on an alt, but earlier you argued that Dunnstral should "know" you are town based on meta. Huh.

last town game before that game, dont misrep.

I wasn't in "that game"

Nobody said you were.

You've been in plenty of games with me, Dunnstral, idk why you're trying to act like this is some first time we've played together.

That game link was specifically for the Catboi Cover Crew comment because in that game I stated Froggy Protection Posse.

You are actively trying to twist things.