Micro 1054 || Fuzzy Friends Coalition || Game Over!

[Ydrasse]

VOTECOUNT 2.3

[3] Irrelephant11:

Not Known 15, skitter30, Menalque

[3] Menalque:

Save the Dragons, Malakittens, Irrelephant11

[3] Not Voting:

Datisi, Aristeia, fireisredsir

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate!

The deadline is in (expired on 2022-05-20 18:52:45).

MOD NOTES

- sowwy phone vcs are hard to do lmk if this one is messed up and i’ll edit it

- clicky here for joined mod iso.

[Menalque]

just fyi I let you get that pagetop, ydra

[Datisi]

datisi can you give me the cliff notes on why ari is town once you're back please

actually fuck structure i'm just gonna list things off as i remember
- didn't try to force her way on day one, openly said multiple times she would sheep skitter or sheep me. i think scum!her is more than able to brute force her way and the fact that she voluntarily stepped back to let the thread develop on its own pace makes me think she's town
- her reasons for townreading me are kinda... not something that benefits scum!her? like, scum!her doesn't have to go on a tangent how "i'm not scumreading her, so that makes her paranoid, BUT she's not gonna scumread me for that because it makes a toxic precedent and maybe i'm better at reading her now" or "scum!tisi couldn't bare posting in the dance game, he's different here" when that's something she can just, like NOT mention at all. the only way i can think of it making sense is if she's pocketing me and i'm not sure i see the benefit
- posts like 1195 is something i don't remember seeing from scum!her. it feels like way more effort than needed. and IF she was scum putting that effort in, i feel like it would've resulted in her simply pushing skitter, not just ~sorting her~
- also i really like the point where she mentioned how she didn't want sheep skitt on a coalition that she knew was worse and where skitter wanted to kill me anyway if it wasn't my preference. like maybe i'm dumb and getting pocketed but it both feels like (1) a reasonable organic thought process that scum doesn't think to naturally fake (2) that does not really benefit her much other than getting townread
- and like, on d2 i feel like the sorting content : pushing content is way too... high for scum!her? like i think she would've chosen someone by now. this is similar to my other points but yeah

i'm like 10 pages behind and admittedly didn't do much to reeval her today but that's the cliff notes

ok gonna go eat something, leave a voicemail if you need me

[Datisi]

(2) that does not really benefit her much other than getting townread

this sounds kinda stupid written out like this, but my point is - it's a pretty minor thing that people probably won't notice and it doesn't benefit her much otherwise, that effort to reward ratio is just not worth for her to bother faking it

[Aristeia]

um your reasons are not v good.

1- I'd always try to pocket you as scum. Pocketing you is just something that I would enjoy doing and it doesn't have to have an obvious benefit.
2. I do make that effort as scum - esp to shut down a push coming from a townleader very early in the day and I don't need to push skitter - de-escalating and pretending to sort her is much better to do strategically.
3. I mean it could just be some excuse I made up to force my way into a coalition and blame failure on skitter?
4. I don't really need to push anyone on d2 if townies are fighting among each other and I'm not really being threatened.

here is the only reason you need:

I literally never rand scum <3

[Aristeia]

maybe this will jinx myself for next game :<

that would be unfortunate

[Datisi]

ari pls let me keep believing i have a faintest idea on how to read you

[Aristeia]

the first reason was good tho !

[Aristeia]

maybe you're just mafia and I am completely pocketed <3

[Aristeia]

it is nice to be pocketed I am going to take a nap in your pocket <3 you dear

[Save The Dragons]

I don't want skitter to be scum, @aristeia @std @fire please determine if this is tvt or tvs so I can proceed accordingly

I can't blame skitter for finding posts manipulative (i don't know that they are but i can't blame her for being wary).

i dunno. i'm turned off by skitter wking mena but i'm trying to give it its due diligence in case i'm wrong here

[Save The Dragons]

skitter me saying "why don't you want to vote scum" isn't me trying to pivot to you, and if mena flips green I'm the one that looks bad.
I said it because I'm dumbfounded that you don't want to vote menalque after the way he's played this game day

@fire? @std? Am I missing something here? Is skitter just a stubborn towny?

i think so.

i could see scum kind of locked into this position but i don't think skitter was all for town!mena before this phase. it would probably be easy for scum!skitter to go "maybe i'm wrong" and toss some shade onto mena but the fact that she's sticking to her guns seems somewhat townie.

[Save The Dragons]

im still not caught up but what frustrates me is the obvious mischaracterizations and sliminess and people are just ignoring that.

mena has clearly decided i'm scum but has no nuance to it no re-evaluation no thought process behind it. it's not like a townie finding a scumread at all, it's like scum picking someone because they have to. and people are just ignoring that.

mena has lied about what i've said to make me look worse and people are ignoring that. 1522

mena posted a monstrous wall and then acts like my monstrous wall in response is disgusting. subtle manipulation. 1669

mena's being performative again by voting for me showing off that they can't be scum because scum would be crazy to try to flip STD but i don't think he was trying to flip me i think he was showing off that he wants to in order to look townie

[Irrelephant11]

I'm having like a panic attack (not really I've never had one I don't think. it's just the only term I can think of to describe this relatively minor emotion I'm experiencing) thinking about the world where menalque is town and I've led town off a cliff by making us 1v1

[Irrelephant11]

Maybe it's better described as "some amount of panic" without the attack part

[Irrelephant11]

menalque can you respond to std's response to your case on him next time you are itt

[Irrelephant11]

Alright I guess my heart won't stop pounding until I've made the case against menalque and if I'm wrong I'll only realize it by spewing it all, and either way i'm going to be totally distracted from my real life duties until I've done this so

[skitter30]

<3 irrel

[fireisredsir]

mena has clearly decided i'm scum but has no nuance to it no re-evaluation no thought process behind it. it's not like a townie finding a scumread at all, it's like scum picking someone because they have to. and people are just ignoring that.

i don't think people are really ignoring that fwiw, i felt that way and p sure at least one other person has mentioned that same thought

[Save The Dragons]

you are right, i think that some of the mena defenders are ignoring these things tho

[Irrelephant11]

<3 irrel

<3 I'm okay!! Don't feel bad @anyone it's my fault for caring about winning my first game back a little too much

[Datisi]

Really really really really really really really don't want him to be town though because almost every post I read from skitter, datisi, and aristeia feels so pure and solve-y and effort-y and TvT, to the point where I have started skimming them so I don't town-tunnel (is that thing?) too much on that trio. just being honest here.

this is a post that gave me the impression of being something that scum probably(?) doesn't say because it's like, i don't think they lock themselves into a position where they're this forced to re-evaluate

i guess if irrel is scum, he's already done a good number of things that don't feel like something scum does and i shouldn't be giving this specific post attention but here we are i guess

but I think that StD redding essentially solves the game?

i think this has been asked about already, but quoting it anyway as a reminder

Could that be because you two are right and the rest of us are not seeing his obvious towntells, or because he's catering his scumplay to your meta expectations? (I'm guessing the latter currently, I think it's common for scum, me included, to play to the expectations they know others have of them, but then miss the expectations of players they don't know as well)

i don't think this is the case... the way i've been using meta recently is trying to find posts that i don't think fit the mentality of a certain person playing as scum (see: guardians of the fortress as an example of me doing that) and the thing with using such meta is that it's *difficult* to predict. even if you know i'm using meta to read you, you can't know exactly what patterns have i picked up on in your town/scumgames and what am i looking for. like, i included meta examples that were from late 2020 and early 2021. do you think mena remembers those posts and he managed to play into my expectations?

like, you *could* argue he was just blanket imitating his meta and managed to stumble upon the things i'm looking for, but in my experience that doesn't(?) happen so like idk shrug i am not convinced my towncase was bad.

[Datisi]

(tfw dats has a quote from menalque in his sig, making it really hard to cntl+f for him >.>)

i changed it :3

i very strongly don't think mena's case on std comes from scum:
- i think that this is a read he feels very strongly about
- i think that scum-him is very aware that std is not getting flipped today so this is a lost cause
- don't think scum-him puts nearly this much energy writing up a case on someone he knows isn't getting flipped today

and on the very-offchance mena gets std flipped today, where is he going next even?

i guess we can make an argument that there's scum with him in the coalition and he doesn't want to flip there
but like i can't imagine he thinks that this will actually work

i think the std case from mena only makes sense from scum!mena if he's doing some reverse psychology bullshit in order to try to spew his partner green - bc i don't think this gets him townread from anyone other than you/me, and you/me already townread him so

incidentally, i lowkey think that is mena reds, std might actually be the buddy, but i'll think about it if/when mena reds

[Datisi]

tigers is even worse

skitter doesn't use tigers!?!??!?!1?!11?!?!?

i did not ever get the impression that the elim was most likely to fall within dats/skitter personally

yeah same, i don't think anyone was actually scumreading either of us (other than one another) and maaaybe like whatever is going on in nk15's head

[Irrelephant11]

skitter doesn't use tigers!?!??!?!1?!11?!?!?